How Much Power with Stock Bottom End?

[Cryptic]

After fixing one or two more minor things I am finally starting the quest to start adding power. I have some great ideas and plans on how to do that and while this will never be a racecar I'm curious what the consensus is with contemporary parts and tuning what the horsepower limit is with the stock bottom end until you start breaking things?

Now I realize there are different definitions of "breaking things" as in one pass until it breaks or a dozen. The number I'm looking for is if you're careful, have done things right, have a solid tune that you can run at and push it over and over again and be safe.

Part of this is just wanting to keep it tucked away as a reference but mostly because I would want to build for that number and tune for a lower number to be safe. I look forward to the many and varied opinions.

 

[Hahny]

After fixing one or two more minor things I am finally starting the quest to start adding power. I have some great ideas and plans on how to do that and while this will never be a racecar I'm curious what the consensus is with contemporary parts and tuning what the horsepower limit is with the stock bottom end until you start breaking things?

Now I realize there are different definitions of "breaking things" as in one pass until it breaks or a dozen. The number I'm looking for is if you're careful, have done things right, have a solid tune that you can run at and push it over and over again and be safe.

Part of this is just wanting to keep it tucked away as a reference but mostly because I would want to build for that number and tune for a lower number to be safe. I look forward to the many and varied opinions.

You best be ready for all sorts of different options about to come your way. Good luck.

 

[SCOOBY DOO]

Weakest link is the transmission. You can go 7 flat at 100 all day long with the stock junk in my sig, but you gotta be on the tune every pass with PL looking for anomalies.

At the end of the day you have to determine how fast you wanna go...how deep your pockets are...and what REALLY matters...is your tuning ability.

All the best.

 

[Cryptic]

You best be ready for all sorts of different options about to come your way. Good luck.

Popcorn is in the microwave.


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[SCOOBY DOO]

If you wanna go REAL fast then you need to talk to PACECARTA, Mr Spool or Bison. What they do is wayyyyyyyyyyyy above my pay grade.

 

[Cryptic]

If you wanna go REAL fast then you need to talk to PACECARTA, Mr Spool or Bison. What they do is wayyyyyyyyyyyy above my pay grade.

Those are some phone calls I’m preparing to make.


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[grass doctor]

so you want to max a stock bottom end out ? is this why you ask?

 

[V6sleeper]

With the right tune and set up of parts i've seen cars over 500rwhp enough for mid 10's and that's many years ago, but i wouldn't want to live there without main caps and forged pistons. its a thin line to walk.

 

[T-type Jones]

I think you'd wanna stay around 500 whp. I'm little over 500, and I think I'm safe there, so far the only thing I've replaced on my car are the tires, and I think I need some shocks. I have 101180 miles on the bottom end.

 

[Cryptic]

so you want to max a stock bottom end out ? is this why you ask?

I want to make sure that I’m not maxing a stock bottom end. I want to keep a safe distance with the understanding that sometimes shit happens.


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[Grumpy]

only thing I can add is that they will take a good beating with a spot on tune. IF it hiccups it gets ugly really quick. also it isn't if it breaks but when.

 

[grass doctor]

I want to make sure that I’m not maxing a stock bottom end. I want to keep a safe distance with the understanding that sometimes shit happens.


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if you want to enjoy the car for what it is and not be constantly working on it...and have a reliable fun to drive classic ...keep the boost down..16-18 psi max ...especially if not running alky...you want it running like a sewing machine... ....

 

[Cryptic]

if you want to enjoy the car for what it is and not be constantly working on it...and have a reliable fun to drive classic ...keep the boost down..16-18 psi max ...especially if not running alky...you want it running like a sewing machine... ....

I do enjoy working on it although it’s less fun to fix broken things. I’m leaning heavily towards E85 since it’s readily available in my area. About to do new lines and all that.


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[grass doctor]

I do enjoy working on it although it’s less fun to fix broken things. I’m leaning heavily towards E85 since it’s readily available in my area. About to do new lines and all that.


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ok GL ...you will need at least 80lb injectors for e85...have fun ..and stay well..

 

[Cryptic]

ok GL ...you will need at least 80lb injectors for e85...have fun ..and stay well..

Thanks. Long term I plan on doing a turbo and injector upgrade at the same time. I have 60’s right now and a stock turbo so I know I won’t be able to turn the boost up too much for the time being.


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[Jerryl]

UPDATE: 9.86@137 stock bottom end

This is in my brothers Cutlass hybrid, it weighs 3520 with driver. Stock 80,000 mile short block, e85, 83lbs injectors, 60psi base pressure, stock ecm with extender extreme chip, home made double pumper with Reds XP pumps, Reds volt booster, hemco upper plenum, stock throttle body, stock intake...

www.turbobuick.com

 

[ttypewhite]

That question will vary depending on your skill set to understand the platform you have and how to do it properly. There are some extreme cases of nothing short of brilliance with the success from some members. But I would disregard those until you fully understand all aspects of how they are able to achieve it. The key question is, how far to you want to take it, and at what cost? I remember being in your position and saying the same things..... that's how it starts because these cars are very addicting when all works well. I put together a combination for a guy that uses his car as a daily driver in the Spring to the Fall. The motor is completely stock. I started with addressing leaks then general maintenance. After that, the gas tank came down, a 255 Walbro pump went in with a Racetronix hotwire kit, new fuel filter, 42lb injectors, a adjustable fuel pressure reg, a cold air intake and a Turbotweak chip. The car ran well and he wanted more. I added a 3" downpipe, 2.5" Pypes exhaust system and a Scanmaster. Then later a front mount intercooler, a Precision 62 turbo, David Huesk 9.5 stall lock up converter, alky injection, New TurboTweak chip, a 4 core rad the dual fans, LT1 mass air with a MAF translator and some tuning on the dyno and it put down 400whp @ 24psi on a conservative tune and is an absolute gem to drive.

 

[Cryptic]

That question will vary depending on your skill set to understand the platform you have and how to do it properly. There are some extreme cases of nothing short of brilliance with the success from some members. But I would disregard those until you fully understand all aspects of how they are able to achieve it. The key question is, how far to you want to take it, and at what cost? I remember being in your position and saying the same things..... that's how it starts because these cars are very addicting when all works well. I put together a combination for a guy that uses his car as a daily driver in the Spring to the Fall. The motor is completely stock. I started with addressing leaks then general maintenance. After that, the gas tank came down, a 255 Walbro pump went in with a Racetronix hotwire kit, new fuel filter, 42lb injectors, a adjustable fuel pressure reg, a cold air intake and a Turbotweak chip. The car ran well and he wanted more. I added a 3" downpipe, 2.5" Pypes exhaust system and a Scanmaster. Then later a front mount intercooler, a Precision 62 turbo, David Huesk 9.5 stall lock up converter, alky injection, New TurboTweak chip, a 4 core rad the dual fans, LT1 mass air with a MAF translator and some tuning on the dyno and it put down 400whp @ 24psi on a conservative tune and is an absolute gem to drive.

Something like this is probably what I'm going for. Most of the basic maintenance is done except making sure I have some "smoking" 100% taken care of that I've posted about on another thread.

I'm in the middle of upgrade the pump and lines, have a LS1 MAF and translator, upgraded aluminum radiator, adjustable fpr, 3" THDP and upgraded exhaust, TT chip and 60 lb injectors. I'm planning on going E85, upgraded turbo from Bison, matching converter, bigger injectors and seeing where that gets me.

 

[SCOOBY DOO]

Something like this is probably what I'm going for. Most of the basic maintenance is done except making sure I have some "smoking" 100% taken care of that I've posted about on another thread.

I'm in the middle of upgrade the pump and lines, have a LS1 MAF and translator, upgraded aluminum radiator, adjustable fpr, 3" THDP and upgraded exhaust, TT chip and 60 lb injectors. I'm planning on going E85, upgraded turbo from Bison, matching converter, bigger injectors and seeing where that gets me.

Call Bison back...cuz that will take you to needing the transmission upgraded. You're pulling the transmission for the new convertor...no sense pulling it twice. Mike Ricketts AKA ttypewhite has a word in his reply that you need to pay attention too. ADDICTING.

 

[Cryptic]

Call Bison back...cuz that will take you to needing the transmission upgraded. You're pulling the transmission for the new convertor...no sense pulling it twice. Mike Ricketts AKA ttypewhite has a word in his reply that you need to pay attention too. ADDICTING.

I haven't called him yet since I'm not ready to pull the trigger and don't want to waste his time until I'm more serious. Good to know though.

And I get it! I've been working on these cars since HS when a few buddies had TRs and a TTA. It's when I caught the bug and it hasn't stopped itching.