4l80e?

[lost2a6]

Have any of you gone from the 200 4R to a 4L80E, and what are your thoughts after doing so? The reason why I ask is I feel that after a certain power level, the 200 is a ticking time bomb. I have a 200 with all of the billet internals and every time I get in my car and mat it to the floor, I'm worried about the Trans breaking. I haven't added up the cost of building a 200 with all of the billet stuff, however I bet that it wouldn't be to far off from what it would cost to install a 4L80E. It used to be that the Trans controller was very expensive on the 4L80E, but that's no longer the case anymore. It seems to me you could basically install a shift kit and a good converter in the 4L80E and have a very reliable Trans for say a 11.30s and faster car without the hassle of having to build the 200 with all of the billet stuff and then hope that it doesn't take a crap. I know that the 200 is lighter, doesn't rob as much HP, and has been in the 9's on several occasions, but cost efficiently and a reliability stand point, it would seem better just to go with the 4L80E and be done with it.

 

[chris718]

The big plus is the gear ratio on the 4l80e.The faster drag radial type cars almost always benefit from the numerically lower ratio.

 

[22lbChevelle]

I'm working on this as we speak.

I've acquired a 2004 4l80e from a 2wd Van for $200.

I figure the cost will be as follows:

$350-Rebuild Kit
$60-Slip Yoke
$100-Drive shaft shortening
$350-computer (Im using a DIY megasquirt controller, figure $500 for whatever for an optishift)
$250-500 - converter
$60-BOP adapter plate
$50-fluid
$120-shift kit
$Free-modify crossmember and floorboards

So the total comes to about $1540 for a fresh 4l80e.

 

[ZNix]

Where are you getting the adapter plate? I was thinking of upgrading.. My Tranny is on its way out.

 

[22lbChevelle]

Jegs or Summit has them.

Refer to my thread I started today regarding this aspect of using a chevy transmission on a buick engine though, there are a couple details I am curious about.

 

[quickt]

Have any of you gone from the 200 4R to a 4L80E, and what are your thoughts after doing so? The reason why I ask is I feel that after a certain power level, the 200 is a ticking time bomb. I have a 200 with all of the billet internals and every time I get in my car and mat it to the floor, I'm worried about the Trans breaking. I haven't added up the cost of building a 200 with all of the billet stuff, however I bet that it wouldn't be to far off from what it would cost to install a 4L80E. It used to be that the Trans controller was very expensive on the 4L80E, but that's no longer the case anymore. It seems to me you could basically install a shift kit and a good converter in the 4L80E and have a very reliable Trans for say a 11.30s and faster car without the hassle of having to build the 200 with all of the billet stuff and then hope that it doesn't take a crap. I know that the 200 is lighter, doesn't rob as much HP, and has been in the 9's on several occasions, but cost efficiently and a reliability stand point, it would seem better just to go with the 4L80E and be done with it.

Good transmission big and bulky but very tough. The electronic shifting is nice. Absolutely nuts to install one in an 11 second car IMO.

 

[nonosv6]

Will it hold up behind a 8 - 9 sec car without a ton of aftermarket parts?

 

[Kevin87TurboT]

I installed one in my last turbo Buick. I agree with Lonnie. It's not beneficial for an 11 sec or slower car. I would even imagine that the additional weight of the trans could slow an 11 sec car by a few hundredths. However, I can really see a case for installing one in a 10 second or quicker car that you're going to drive very often. Like you said, the billet 200-4R parts are expensive. I beat on the transmission for over a year with nearly 600 rwhp and never hurt it. There were very few mods to the trans. It was all stock hard parts with good clutches and a transbrake valvebody.

 

[ZNix]

I was just thinking of the 4l80e for the modern technology, they are easy to find at the JY, and you can set up paddle shifters!

Nix

 

[lost2a6]

=Absolutely nuts to install one in an 11 second car IMO.

So are you saying that you can have a 2004R with out all of the billet parts and still run mid to low 11's and still be dependable? I would bet that a stock 4L80E would handle low 9's in a 3,600lbs car without having anything being done to it. The question that still remains is, how much are you going to sacrifice in ET or MPH to have a dependable, bullet proof Trans compared to the 2004R?

 

[lost2a6]

I installed one in my last turbo Buick. I agree with Lonnie. It's not beneficial for an 11 sec or slower car. I would even imagine that the additional weight of the trans could slow an 11 sec car by a few hundredths. However, I can really see a case for installing one in a 10 second or quicker car that you're going to drive very often. Like you said, the billet 200-4R parts are expensive. I beat on the transmission for over a year with nearly 600 rwhp and never hurt it. There were very few mods to the trans. It was all stock hard parts with good clutches and a transbrake valvebody.

Great info, thanks! Do you have any data to compare the differance in ET or MPH compared to the 200?

 

[quickt]

So are you saying that you can have a 2004R with out all of the billet parts and still run mid to low 11's and still be dependable?

Its done everyday in an 11 sec car and for less than you can do a 4L80 for. Don't need 1 billet part.

 

[quickt]

I was just thinking of the 4l80e for the modern technology, they are easy to find at the JY, and you can set up paddle shifters!

Nix

If its the electronic shifting consider a 4L60 or 65. Those would work well in an 11 second car with out the extra 80lbs, moving the cross member and some of the other the 80 will require. You can use your paddle shifters.

 

[22lbChevelle]

My experience has shown the 200-4r to be unreliable with power over time. My car has only gone mid 12's but I've gone through 2 stock 200-4rs and a 200-4r from the "best guy" around seattle. If you truly daily drive your car, and punch it multiple times daily, I dont think the 200-4r is the best choice. I even run a stock turbo buick AC condenser for a tranny cooler, the 200-4r has never overheated.

I know the 200-4r can be built to withstand a ton of power, but I'm done worrying about the tranny. I'm done with weak 2-3 shifts. I'm sitting here right now looking at the internals of the 200-4r I just pulled from my car last night, and the internals of the 4l80e I picked up a month ago, HUGE difference.

I will say. Part of my motivation for switching stems from the fact that I am already running a Megasquirt 3 ECM so I can build a DIY computer for the 4l80e pretty cheap. Also I plan to switch to a junkyard 5.3L with twin TE44's when this little V6 dies.

The 4l80e wont be for everyone, but I've weighed my options (lol get it) and chose the 4l80e.

 

[lost2a6]

Its done everyday in an 11 sec car and for less than you can do a 4L80 for. Don't need 1 billet part.

When I was running mid 11's, I started to twist the splines on the forward drum shaft. By pure luck I discovered this before it broke. This was discovered due to me having to "freshen up the Trans" on a regular basis. Yes I was leaving hard with it; yes my car is heavy. If I recall, I had a 1.55 60-ft time. I then went to the Billet shaft and all is good for now. I have owned my car since 1995, I look back on the time and money that I have spent on the 200 4R, it would have been worth it to me to have gone with the 4L80E and been done with it for good. I can understand the transmission guys who have a lot of money invested in trying to make the 200 4R hold up to a lot of power, they need to try to re coup their investments. However I don’t mine possibly losing some ET/MPH to have something that I don’t constantly have to mess with or worry about. I’m not trying to be a smart arse, but I don’t care how fast the 200 has been behind 5,000 hp, lol. The 200 4R was never designed to withstand a lot of HP/torque like we are trying to do with it. The 4L80E was designed to be behind a big block with a lot of low-end torque pulling a very heavy load. I know that a stock 4L80E can support the power and more of a billet 200 4R. So this brings me back to my original question, how much of a MPH / ET loss is it going from the 200 4R to the 4L80E in a low 11 sec and faster car? You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig.

 

[Mr.Spool]

not trying to offend you 12lb chevelle,but that is alot of breakage for a mid 12 second car.i put 6 years of track racing and tons of street "driving" on a non-billet 200 car ran low 11's.now have a full-billet 200 from dave husek that is running 10's with low miles so we will see but i love the tranny.can't see the need for the 4l80e with your power level but keep us posted.

 

[lost2a6]

If its the electronic shifting consider a 4L60 or 65. Those would work well in an 11 second car with out the extra 80lbs, moving the cross member and some of the other the 80 will require. You can use your paddle shifters.

If I recall, the 4L60E and the 4L65E is just a glorified 700R4 that is computer controlled. It has its weak spots and has too low of a first gear, and from what I understand, is actually weaker than the 200 4R.

 

[22lbChevelle]

No way to offend me. The first trannies were a worn stock, and a junkyard 200r4. Both puked the second gear band.

You are just one in a line of guys looking to comment on how they have ran low 11's on a 200-4r. I'm not denying it can be done, it is done every day.

As the OP said,"I have owned my car since 1995, I look back on the time and money that I have spent on the 200 4R, it would have been worth it to me to have gone with the 4L80E and been done with it for good."

I'm trying to eliminate the ****in tranny as an issue once and for all.

 

[Kevin87TurboT]

Great info, thanks! Do you have any data to compare the differance in ET or MPH compared to the 200?

I don't. The cars that I installed a 4L80 into also had engine swaps at the same time. I will say that I never regretted the swap in any of the cars.

 

[TURBOPOWERED68]

Did you ever get this done?