help car failed cali smog......

[NCC1701]

I did the usual tune-up, plugs, wires, pcv valve, oil change, and a new egr valve. I took it in to get tested and it failed. This is the first time this has happened. It failed the NOx on both the 15 and 25. On top of that, the fail at 15 was over the GP (gross polluter)max.
Please give any advice, I am all ears.
15mph
CO2 13.7 O2 .7 HC 108 CO .57 NO 2036

25 mph
CO2 14 O2 .5 HC 69 CO.27 NO 1275

Thanks In Advance

 

[gofstbuick]

since your car is Test-Only, give me a call on Monday 916-255-4217 (between 7:15 and 3:15). You would be eligible for the consumer assistance program. Free repairs (up to $500) for a $100 copay (you must take vehicle to a gold sheild station particiating in the CAP program)

 

[NCC1701]

Thanks gofstbuick............

The smog station i went to today gave me the CAP application.
I am filling it out now. I was just wondering if it could be my Cat going bad? I had it replaced back in 1999. I have had an occasional problem with excessive oil burn off at start up. I get a ton of blue smoke out the tail pipes every now and then at start up. Could that have ruined my cat?
Also, I did replace my EGR valve with one of the aftermarket style replacement with the metered disc. But I really don't think that would have caused me to blow the test so bad.

 

[TurboJim]

Does your EGR work? Co and HC are nice, NOx is blown away.

UNless your standards are lower than NJ..then you better stick to gofast's recommendations.

 

[gofstbuick]

Re: Thanks gofstbuick............

Originally posted by NCC1701
I get a ton of blue smoke out the tail pipes every now and then at start up. Could that have ruined my cat?
Also, I did replace my EGR valve with one of the aftermarket style replacement with the metered disc. But I really don't think that would have caused me to blow the test so bad.

The things that cause a cat to go bad are coolant contamination, certain types of sealants, leaded fuel and misfires. All the items except misfires contaminate the cat. The pulses of the misfires break the substate material of the cat and render is useless.

For dyno type test, I have had very little luck with the replacement EGR valves that use a metered disc. They have caused many I/M240 emissions problems, that I'm a little lerry of how they test on ASM.

If you end up needing a cat, why not let the state pay for it.

Regarding the emission standards, I suspect NJ is now relatively close to federal emissions standards. I know CA is.

 

[NCC1701]

Thanks guys............

I took it in to get it analyzed why it failed and they told me that it's the egr vac. solenoid. They said my cat checked out fine. They said I am getting vacuum in, but no vacuum out. I figure the $49 diagnostic fee can go toward paying the first $100 of the repair. Also they said that it is a dealer only item. I am trying to find the GM part number for that, I can get pretty good discount on it thru my employer.

If i understand that CAP application section 4, I need to show that I have already spent $100 at a smog station trying to get it fixed. After I do that, and it's still not passing, then This cap program will pay up to $500 to get it repaired at one of the CAP approved stations.

Does that sound right???

I didn't mean to sound like I was doubting you on that aftermarket egr valve, I am justed a little surprised if a new valve can be that far off in metering. I really do appreciate your time and advice in this matter, Lord knows I am no expert in emissions.

 

[gofstbuick]

Re: Thanks guys............

Originally posted by NCC1701
I took it in to get it analyzed why it failed and they told me that it's the egr vac. solenoid. They said my cat checked out fine. They said I am getting vacuum in, but no vacuum out. I figure the $49 diagnostic fee can go toward paying the first $100 of the repair. Also they said that it is a dealer only item. I am trying to find the GM part number for that, I can get pretty good discount on it thru my employer.

If i understand that CAP application section 4, I need to show that I have already spent $100 at a smog station trying to get it fixed. After I do that, and it's still not passing, then This cap program will pay up to $500 to get it repaired at one of the CAP approved stations.

Does that sound right???

I didn't mean to sound like I was doubting you on that aftermarket egr valve, I am justed a little surprised if a new valve can be that far off in metering. I really do appreciate your time and advice in this matter, Lord knows I am no expert in emissions.

Regarding CAP, if you filled out the app and did not spend the money, you could have applied any amount you spent at a CAP staion towards the copay. Otherwise, any amout you've spent at a licensed somg check station will count towards the copay.

In answering your aftermarket EGR valve question, those valves with the metered orifice were used prior to states using dyno emissions test (and i don't think the feds really tested that thorough). Therefore, no one would know how they would react under dyno conditions. But during the CA I/M240 pilot program, these EGR valves caused may HC and CO problems (really unrelated to NOx and EGR valves). Therefore based on prior experience, I'm just leary.

 

[NCC1701]

replaced egr solenoid and still failed....

I am geting plenty of vacuum to open the valve, but it's not getting thru the egr solenoid. What tells the solenoid to direct vacuum to the egr valve? Does it have anything to do with the four wire connector on the side of the transmission? I had disconnected that connector due to a problem I was having with the transmission.

Thanks In Advance

I did swap on the "original " egr valve, but not till after I failed this second time.

 

[NCC1701]

ttt

ttt

 

[gofstbuick]

Re: replaced egr solenoid and still failed....

Originally posted by NCC1701
I am geting plenty of vacuum to open the valve, but it's not getting thru the egr solenoid. What tells the solenoid to direct vacuum to the egr valve? Does it have anything to do with the four wire connector on the side of the transmission? I had disconnected that connector due to a problem I was having with the transmission.

Thanks In Advance

I did swap on the "original " egr valve, but not till after I failed this second time.

The EGR function is reliant on closed loop, trans gear (3rd or 4th gear) and speed.

 

[Buicksx3]

What tells the solenoid to direct vacuum to the egr valve?
The 10A ECM/SOL fuse under the dash--- have you checked it? This fuse is also tied in with the A/C relay, the fan delay relay, and the canister purge solenoid. Just something to consider...

The EGR will still operate if the connector is unplugged from the tranny; mine has been unplugged for a couple of years now as I run a 9" AC NLU converter. I live about 90 minutes north of you and I was in a "Test Only" situation as well (aren't they all??) when I had my '87 GN smogged back in April '03. My results were:

15 MPH CO2 14.3 %02 0.0 HC(ppm) 28 CO% 0.00 NOx(ppm) 85
25 MPH CO2 14.3 %02 0.0 HC(ppm) 31 CO% 0.22 NOx(ppm) 42

This test was conducted with 160,297 miles on the original engine with a stock appearing combo that ran 11.1s at nearly 120 with a flat cam lobe. The car had a fresh cat with less than 100 miles on it, 72# injectors, newer R42 plugs w/factory wires, modified stock ECM running a normal (not emissions) 18* timing street chip at 42 psi static fuel pressure, and 10 gallons of Chevron 91 in the tank with no additives from a bottle. The oil in the crankcase wasn't very fresh either. Was I stressing out as I stood looking through the shop's lobby window, watching the smog tech "drive" my car on the smog dyno? You bet I was! When it was over, though, even the smog guy was impressed with the results.

My point: take heart-- hang in there, you'll get through this!

Morgan

 

[NCC1701]

GN finally passed

It turns out that my GN had the wrong intake manifold gasket and that was blocking of the egr passeges. Changed that and it passwed with flying colors.

Thanks Everyone, I really appreciate all the help