HELP- Engine Won't Start

[Hahny]

So after 4 months of building my engine, me and my buddy installed my motor/tranny today and as I went to turn the key the car did not start. I am not getting any spark. We decided to check voltage at the cam sensor and crank sensor and I am getting 6-10 volts, but when I try to crank the engine over the crank sensor is dropping to 5.1 volts. Does this sound like I have ground issue? We went through the No Tree Start too and this is where I'm at now with this situation. Has this happen to anyone else?

 

[bpman1234]

so did you prime the oil pump first start not sure if I remember correctly.dont think it will fire with no oil pressure .also double check cam sensor setting .is it priming fuel? and what did you do with all those grounds at the back of the block.

 

[rag231]

Are you referring to this as your No Start Tree .. http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/troubshootgeneral.htm
84-85 or 86-87?
This has definitely happened to nearly everyone on the board by now!
Grounds are very important but I dont think that is your problem in this case.
I went to AutoZone and purchased the noid light kit to see if my injectors were firing. I had no spark and no injector pulses. I pinned it down to my crank sensor and purchased another one. It has to be set just right with plastic feeler gauges. Turned the key and fired right up. Thanks to a friendly turbo neighbor ( Mike McCoy) for allowing me to used a good known coil pack to aid in troubleshooting. If you rebuilt your motor and put the crank hub back on, then remounted the crank sensor chances are you could have sheared the edge of the crank sensor with one of the spaces ( windows) on the crank hub on the first engine rotation. Out of curiosity, how are you checking crank sensor voltage while you are trying to crank the car, I think that is a pulsed signal with a reference for #1 cylinder.
Orange ECM wire at the battery connected?
Report back with findings please.

 

[Hahny]

so did you prime the oil pump first start not sure if I remember correctly.dont think it will fire with no oil pressure .also double check cam sensor setting .is it priming fuel? and what did you do with all those grounds at the back of the block.

Yes, I primed the oil pump prior to installing the cam sensor and I installed it at 25 TDC and used my casper cam sensor tool. The grounds were installed from the block to the firewall, but I did paint my block and didn't clean off the area of where the grounds go.

 

[Hahny]

Are you referring to this as your No Start Tree .. http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/troubshootgeneral.htm
84-85 or 86-87?
This has definitely happened to nearly everyone on the board by now!
Grounds are very important but I dont think that is your problem in this case.
I went to AutoZone and purchased the noid light kit to see if my injectors were firing. I had no spark and no injector pulses. I pinned it down to my crank sensor and purchased another one. It has to be set just right with plastic feeler gauges. Turned the key and fired right up. Thanks to a friendly turbo neighbor ( Mike McCoy) for allowing me to used a good known coil pack to aid in troubleshooting. If you rebuilt your motor and put the crank hub back on, then remounted the crank sensor chances are you could have sheared the edge of the crank sensor with one of the spaces ( windows) on the crank hub on the first engine rotation. Out of curiosity, how are you checking crank sensor voltage while you are trying to crank the car, I think that is a pulsed signal with a reference for #1 cylinder.
Orange ECM wire at the battery connected?
Report back with findings please.

Yes I meant to say No Start Tree and I just installed a new Standard PC 18 crank sensor and bracket prior to starting my engine. I have the crank sensor set at .025 from the reluctor wheel too.

 

[Hahny]

Pulled the coil pack off and tested it with a volt meter and I have juice going to it.

 

[Hahny]

so did you prime the oil pump first start not sure if I remember correctly.dont think it will fire with no oil pressure .also double check cam sensor setting .is it priming fuel? and what did you do with all those grounds at the back of the block.

For what its worth I have around 42psi of fuel pressure. How do you check for injector pulse?

 

[bpman1234]

noid light.you unplug the injector plug and plug the light in crank the car it flashes pulse.

 

[Hahny]

noid light.you unplug the injector plug and plug the light in crank the car it flashes pulse.

Got it. I will try this in the morning. Thanks

 

[rag231]

See if you can rent the kit from advance or pep boys. Price with one of their online coupons was under $20.

 

[Hahny]

See if you can rent the kit from advance or pep boys. Price with one of their online coupons was under $20. View attachment 323428

Thanks rag231.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

Yes I meant to say No Start Tree and I just installed a new Standard PC 18 crank sensor and bracket prior to starting my engine. I have the crank sensor set at .025 from the reluctor wheel too.

Got it in the correct position?

 

[Hahny]

Got it in the correct position?

I think the problem is becauae we set harmonic damper slot at 0 TDC and then moved it back counter clock wise just past the 20 degree mark that's on the timing tab thinking this was our 1.5" or 25 degree TDC. I think that we should have gone clock wise with it?

 

[Hahny]

Got it in the correct position?

Chuck Leaper, are you referring to the crank sensor or cam sensor. I have the crank sensor set in the last slot that's away from connector and I did use a feeler gauge to set it at .025 per instructions. Does this sound right?

 

[Hahny]

Are you referring to this as your No Start Tree .. http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/troubshootgeneral.htm
84-85 or 86-87?
This has definitely happened to nearly everyone on the board by now!
Grounds are very important but I dont think that is your problem in this case.
I went to AutoZone and purchased the noid light kit to see if my injectors were firing. I had no spark and no injector pulses. I pinned it down to my crank sensor and purchased another one. It has to be set just right with plastic feeler gauges. Turned the key and fired right up. Thanks to a friendly turbo neighbor ( Mike McCoy) for allowing me to used a good known coil pack to aid in troubleshooting. If you rebuilt your motor and put the crank hub back on, then remounted the crank sensor chances are you could have sheared the edge of the crank sensor with one of the spaces ( windows) on the crank hub on the first engine rotation. Out of curiosity, how are you checking crank sensor voltage while you are trying to crank the car, I think that is a pulsed signal with a reference for #1 cylinder.
Orange ECM wire at the battery connected?
Report back with findings please.

Well, after going over the car again this afternoon, I was able to get her running. The problem was the cam sensor was out by 50 degrees and that's why I wasn't getting any spark, much less able to start the car. Test drive tomorrow afternoon!!

 

[TurboBuRick]

Why wasn't the ecm getting power?

 

[Hahny]

Why wasn't the ecm getting power?

The ECM was getting power, I had the timing out of whack by about 50 degrees and please understand that this was my first time at building my own engine so I'm learning as I go. That said, I test drove the car today and it is running strong. I couldn't be any happerier with it and I can't thank this site enough for all of the valuable information that's on here as well as its members.

 

[Gene Van Horn]

Love it when a plan comes together. Good luck.

 

[bpman1234]

yup this site is priceless.

 

[Jerryl]

The ECM was getting power, I had the timing out of whack by about 50 degrees and please understand that this was my first time at building my own engine so I'm learning as I go. That said, I test drove the car today and it is running strong. I couldn't be any happerier with it and I can't thank this site enough for all of the valuable information that's on here as well as its members.

Just to be clear;
Cam sensor doesn't set ignition timing.
It sets cam phasing for injector.

Picture for future reference because it can be hard to see the degree marks on the car.