Precision front mount intercooler vs precision slic

[434nova]

What kind of power are you guys making with them? What’s a better choice for a car making 800 hp? Car is running pump gas and meth.

 

[marleyskater420]

If you are asking in general for ALL intercoolers; what is better for a car making 800hp, I would suggest a Bell core that is smaller than the 1,100hp fmic core we (RPS) offer. The size would be a core with the dimension: 20"w X 10"h X 3.5" deep.

IF you meant for a choice between the PTE SLIC and FMIC, I would go with the SLIC for drag racing ONLY setup, and the FMIC for a everyday AND track setup.

Those old PTE units were seriously legit pieces. However there have been a lot of maybe not new, but more embraced technology, for intercoolers that helps increase their thermal efficiency while aiding in reducing their pressure drop. Without looking at the past we cannot know from where we came and what we have progressed from. If you look at the companies that are on the cutting edge of intercooler technology, they are not afraid to take risks and push the envelope of airflow dynamic theory and the real world application of these principles.

I mean it when I say that I wish I knew airflow dynamics in the same way these companies and innovators do...but alas, I do not, and I'm just some guy trying to educate himself as best possible so that his company can put out a product that is a step above the competition....

 

[Jerryl]

Heat rejection is of lesser concern than pressure drop, especially with alky injection. Look at methanol latent heat chart and you will notice you need higher temps than normally thought of to vaporize. This is important to consider when using traditional methanol injection.

 

[Pronto]

I know the PTE slic has gone upper 9s.

 

[TTA308]

,

Not sure i understand the logic behind that, one would think the opposite true, FMIC for track and SLIC for street, but Jerryl brings up a interesting point i haven't thought of, now i wonder how and if the Bison Alky plate would affect any of this...

 

[V6sleeper]

Ive gone faster with a slic, no tech data available but Im sure it had to do with lower pressure drop using a small turbo (60-1) that was not working as hard as it would with the front mount.

 

[marleyskater420]

Not sure i understand the logic behind that, one would think the opposite true, FMIC for track and SLIC for street, but Jerryl brings up a interesting point i haven't thought of, now i wonder how and if the Bison Alky plate would affect any of this...

If you're using alky then the thermal efficiency of the core is not as important as maintaining a dense charge air flow.

The SLIC, having a more direct path of travel for the charge air flow, and a shorter path across the core for the charge air ( assuming both cores use the same type of ambient and charge air fin types and fin density) would, in theory, have less pressure drop across the core.

Used in conjunction with methanol injection to cool down the intake charge and raise the octane, the SLIC would therefore provide superior performance when compared to the FMIC.

Look at it like this: vertical flow FMIC's are great for low pressure drop right? (For the purpose of this example let's assume yes)

Well a SLIC is effectively a vertical flow fmic turned on it's side.. it has a thick core and a short width-which is the distance the air inside the core has to travel across.

Look at an old CAS V1/V2 or Cottons. The cores are almost 28" wide..meaning the air has to travel 28" in order to exit the IC core.

A vertical flow, or SLIC even, typically has close to half that size for the core width-which is what the airflow has to travel across to exit the core. For example my Bell core is only 14" tall (being a vertical flow IC, this is the dimension that the air must travel across to exit the core) yet will support 1600hp conservatively. The PTE SLIC has around the same size width of the core (not the overall width of the IC including the end tanks) which means the air does not have to travel as far to get across the entire core.

The more distance the charge air travels, the more friction it encounters, and although the friction helps to transfer the from the air to the IC core, the friction causes resistance to the airflow moving across the core, thereby increasing the pressure drop.

Does that help explain why the SLIC would be better?

 

[forcefed3.8's]

You dont need airflow across the core for that 8,9,10 secs at wot you are running at the track. The intercooler is just a chunk of aluminum absorbing the heat. Some do it better than others.

 

[TTA308]

Sounds like a FMIC is a waste of money unless i missed something... if its not better at the track i don't see how its better on the street.

 

[marleyskater420]

Sounds like a FMIC is a waste of money unless i missed something... if its not better at the track i don't see how its better on the street.

If there were FMICs for our cars that offered a lot of flow capability (can support a lot of HP), had low pressure drop (Ideally under 2psi, and no more than 4psi at levels above 1,000hp), and thermal efficiency that was within 20-40degrees of ambient temperature...well, if we had any options like that (or even better than the numbers I proposed) I would say that a FMIC would be a better option than a SLIC, however at the moment I don't really feel that there are mass produced/NOT-custom cores offered that level of performance or meet that criteria...although if you wait a few months, that crazy company owned by that one asshole..I think they are called "RPS" will be releasing 4 different vertical flow FMIC's for the TR that should offer an affordable alternative to a $3,000 custom FMIC with the same performance levels... and I think they are also going to release a SLIC liquid to air core, complete with ice box, water pump, water lines, heat exchanger, and turbo/inlet piping...

Well, if you ask Rob, I believe he has gone faster using his Red's SLIC than the FMIC he was using previously...

Most FMIC's that are offered today do not have the same low pressure drop numbers that a PTE SLIC has- side note- not every SLIC that is sold for these cars is very efficient. The PTE SLIC is a good unit, though.

For the very reason of not having many low pressure drop, or thermally efficient FMIC cores for these cars, we decided to make the Bell cores that we designed....they are rated for 1,100hp and 1,600hp, respectively, with .6psi pressure drop while flowing 2,000cfm at 30psi...

 

[murphster]

You dont need airflow across the core for that 8,9,10 secs at wot you are running at the track. The intercooler is just a chunk of aluminum absorbing the heat. Some do it better than others.

I agree for just a single pass but what about when you want to/have to make multiple passes with little down time? Taking alky out of the equation... when I was on a SLIC the biggest drawback was that it would get heat soaked and when I had to make a pass a short time later the performance was degraded. With a FMIC I thought the airflow helps minimize this heat soak. Although I have not used a PTE SLIC I have heard great things about it... does it not have any of these heat soak issues?

 

[forcefed3.8's]

The Precision from what I have seen has high IATs. With a front mount there is more mass to disapate the heat before heat soak happens. If you make a pass and park your car and dont have the fan running, how is it any different than a slic sitting? And the front mount is inches away from a 180° radiator. I have made back to back mid 8 sec passes with my slic with no loss in performance. A slic can be made to out perform a front mount in every aspect, but it will be expensive. A slic weighs less, doesnt put all that weight at the nose, less plumbing, less lag, potentially less pressure drop. But you are not going to get this performance from the available units. And one that can perform like this will be $1500+. But when you consider i picked up 8mph by ditching the front mount, how much does 8mph cost?

 

[murphster]

I agree with everything you say and most importantly.... data and results don’t lie with your runs. Was really just asking about the PTE SLICs compared to the big FMICs available.

And I guess I just assumed with the FMIC being in front of the radiator that it would naturally be cooler after a run. But from what you’re saying its probably more of a result that they are just a much larger heat sink.

Great info.

 

[~JM~]

Anyone have any comparative data of the differential pressures & temperatures?

 

[Marcell mitchell]

.

 

[434nova]

The Precision from what I have seen has high IATs. With a front mount there is more mass to disapate the heat before heat soak happens. If you make a pass and park your car and dont have the fan running, how is it any different than a slic sitting? And the front mount is inches away from a 180° radiator. I have made back to back mid 8 sec passes with my slic with no loss in performance. A slic can be made to out perform a front mount in every aspect, but it will be expensive. A slic weighs less, doesnt put all that weight at the nose, less plumbing, less lag, potentially less pressure drop. But you are not going to get this performance from the available units. And one that can perform like this will be $1500+. But when you consider i picked up 8mph by ditching the front mount, how much does 8mph cost?

What front mount did you have before you switched to a slic?

 

[forcefed3.8's]

What front mount did you have before you switched to a slic?

CAS V1

 

[434nova]

CAS V1

Do you happen to have a picture of the Red Armstrong slic you have? Is it a 3 inch inlet and outlet?

 

[forcefed3.8's]

2.5" inlet and outlet.

 

[434nova]

2.5" inlet and outlet.

Wow I’m surprised the inlet and outlets are so small. I would have thought you need atleast a 3 inch to support your hp.