I was looking maybe for a after market torque converter for my PTE-44 turbo.I have a stock D5 that is modified to a 3000 stall speed.I have heard a 3000 Orange Brawler Converter is one of the best to use with the TE-44 turbo's.I think a Vigilante 3200 single disc would be to much for a TE-44 for the street driven car.I have the stock shortblock stock cam. My car is a street driven car with about 550 Horses.I have a good set of racing CNC ported Heads,matching intake and ESP front mount intercooler,340 walbro hot wire kit,009 injectors,3:73 gears but i run a 28 inch BF Drag radials.I like the turbo but to spool the turbo for a real good run I have to give it about 2500 RPM.I thought with this turbo it would be close to stock as far as spool up,actually with a little more bottom end power without giving it rpm.I seen a guy a couple months ago lighting his tires up on the street,not that spinning tires is good but i would like to get a little more off idle response.I am running 17lbs boost.I know that the Precision turbo has a much bigger compressor size then the Garret TE-44 turbo.i don't know if there is a big difference between the 2 different size housings as far as bottom end performance.Anyway anybody running a orange street brawler converter with instant spool up or any other converter that gives this turbo instant spool up??? Thanks
PTE-44 Turbo....
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TylerDurden
Jack's Smirking Revenge
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i have a TE 44, stock torque converter NOT modified, FM blue tops and open exh most of the time, i run 18* chip and i cant keep my tires from spinning, even with 275/50s BFG radial TA's
do you have a scan tool? are you by chance maybe running rich at the lower rpm thus not spooling very quick?
granted you have head work that i do not have and you say your running 500 hp as i am only running 330. but i spool very quick, like stock....so not sure why your car isnt.....
do you have a scan tool? are you by chance maybe running rich at the lower rpm thus not spooling very quick?
granted you have head work that i do not have and you say your running 500 hp as i am only running 330. but i spool very quick, like stock....so not sure why your car isnt.....
Yeah maybe thats one of the first things i should have bought was a scan tool.I definately think a scanmaster 2 at least to start out with would be a great help.I thought with maybe my good set of CNC ported ESP race heads that maybe because of the bigger valves it took some bottom end away but even with the stock heads before i had bad bottom end. I don't have great bottom end power without giving it RPM'S but from what I have heard a good set of heads that are ported right should not affect bottom end torque and power.If my car is just idling from a stop and i hit the throttle full from what your saying is that boost should come quickly especially when i have a modified D5 3000 stall converter.My car runs good just like to get that turbo hitting harder with boost alot faster.I know there are alot of guys who like to buy certain chips for real fast spooling.I have a Jay Carter 93 chip in it now.Is there chips out there and I heard alot of guys that i don't know have tricks to make chips, and have them made for instant spool up??? Anyone know someone reputable with these chip tricks???
i just bought an orange stripe, haven't even got it in yet. i bought it from s10 gn and i think he replaced it with the vigelente (i know thats not spelled right) 3200 or 3400. maybe he'll chime in and let you know what he thinks.
I know the orange stripe is by no means a "good" converter. its basically the same a a stock d5 with a higher still, its made a little better but no where near the quality of the vigelents, or any of the nicer 9" ones. this is one of the things where you get what you pay for.
I know the orange stripe is by no means a "good" converter. its basically the same a a stock d5 with a higher still, its made a little better but no where near the quality of the vigelents, or any of the nicer 9" ones. this is one of the things where you get what you pay for.
I don't think it would be smart to buy the vigilante 3200 single disc converter until i get a scan tool and figure out why the car runs rich at low RPM.I have a stock modified D5 3000 converter and alot of guys don't run the Te- 44 with that big a stall especially on the street.Hopefully a scanmaster 2 can point me in a direction of instant low end torque thats missing.If i wind it up around 2500 rpm from a stop the car will kick ass but still needs to be tuned like a race car.My car should go easy 11's on slicks.Im not going to race it till i get a scan tool though.Yeah i just think a Vigilante 3200 with a TE-44 is over kill on the street though.
I dont think it would be smart to run one of these cars without a scantool period. You'll destroy your motor.
Why do you do heads, turbo, front mount, put drag radials on the car, invest all this money and time, and not have a 250 dollar scan tool?
BTW, at 17 PSI.. your no where near 550 horses. More like 330.
Until you have a scantool to monitor knock, your boost privelages have been revoked. Do your motor a favor, and learn to tune it.. I dont mean disrespect, having so many scantools available.. man its the first thing that goes on the car.. period.. before chip or fuel pump.
You'll crunch your bearings if ya dont watch what your doing..
Just my O2.. good luck.
Lastly, thats plenty converter for a 44. If it is a 2800+
Why do you do heads, turbo, front mount, put drag radials on the car, invest all this money and time, and not have a 250 dollar scan tool?
BTW, at 17 PSI.. your no where near 550 horses. More like 330.
Until you have a scantool to monitor knock, your boost privelages have been revoked. Do your motor a favor, and learn to tune it.. I dont mean disrespect, having so many scantools available.. man its the first thing that goes on the car.. period.. before chip or fuel pump.
You'll crunch your bearings if ya dont watch what your doing..
Just my O2.. good luck.
Lastly, thats plenty converter for a 44. If it is a 2800+
Well I guess I had some luck driving the car.I had a bad fuel pump replaced last week and it made a huge difference in the car.Yeah the scan tool is definately the next thing I put on my Buick.My car has been running rich for a long time just got to decide on what to get.They say for a beginner the scanmaster 2.Will that give me most of the important readings I need to know why Im running rich especially at low RPM's? .I think by the car running rich over the years has kept the motor in tact.The car definately is putting more then 330 Horses out.I mean yesterday i had it out and just giving it about 2500 RPM's and no boost and launched, car was going side ways all the way to 45mph BFG Drag Radials.I definately think Im missing alot of extra Horse power without ever using a scan tool and tuning the car right, but at 22lbs boost this car will(scantool) make 550-570HP.One thing I should have done when i got my CNC ported Race heads put on was put a bigger cam in,but the stock cam can get in to the 10's,but Im just happy with getting 11's.My car is totally for the street and if i race it it will be very rare.Alot of experts told me that I got that amount of power when set up right, just need to tune it up like a finely tuned race car.
This is strait from precisions web site.
TE44, 580 max hp, 2,700 Min. Stall, Mid 11-second
That 580 hp rating is using max boost. Which is no where near 22lbs, probably over 27. Also that's under perfect conditions with supporting parts (heads, cam, injectors, properly tuned chip, etc.).
I agree with Razor your in the 350 hp range. And even if you put in race gas and turned the boost up to 27 that would be about 450 horse (going by the 8-10 hp for every pound of boost rule).
I'm not trying to rain on your parade, just trying to give you a more realistic idea of what you have.
Now as far as the converter, I would not buy an orange stripe or any other restalled d5. I had an orange stripe 3000 stall in my t and changed it to a 3000 stall 9/11 and there is no comparison. The car spools faster and drives better.
If you driving mostly on the street I wouldn't go over 3000. I have a 3200 in my t now and even though it is a huge difference from a 3000 it's a little annoying to drive every day. You can definitely notice the increased amount of throttle you need to start off.
TE44, 580 max hp, 2,700 Min. Stall, Mid 11-second
That 580 hp rating is using max boost. Which is no where near 22lbs, probably over 27. Also that's under perfect conditions with supporting parts (heads, cam, injectors, properly tuned chip, etc.).
I agree with Razor your in the 350 hp range. And even if you put in race gas and turned the boost up to 27 that would be about 450 horse (going by the 8-10 hp for every pound of boost rule).
I'm not trying to rain on your parade, just trying to give you a more realistic idea of what you have.
Now as far as the converter, I would not buy an orange stripe or any other restalled d5. I had an orange stripe 3000 stall in my t and changed it to a 3000 stall 9/11 and there is no comparison. The car spools faster and drives better.
If you driving mostly on the street I wouldn't go over 3000. I have a 3200 in my t now and even though it is a huge difference from a 3000 it's a little annoying to drive every day. You can definitely notice the increased amount of throttle you need to start off.
Well i have most of the supporting parts so 450 would be more likely especially at 17lbs boost.I used to have a 60-1 turbo on but it spooled turbo terribly and I didn't like it for the street.The 60-1 is old turbo technology.When i got The PTE-44 I noticed that even though the turbo was smaller the car was alot quicker.On the top end the 60-1 probably would have pulled harder but this turbo is alot more fun on the street.Is it safe to run like 22lbs boost with this turbo??? because before with the 60-1 I was running the same boost which is probably like running 25 on the Te-44.Yeah 27lbs of boost for the street on 94 octane does not seem right.
turbojimmy
Supporting Member
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More throttle as in more slippage from the converter and therefore more RPM or is there more lag?
I don't totally understand how stall should work and as a result have been disappointed with the spool of my PT-51 with a 10.5" ProTorque converter with 3K RPM stall (for sale soon, BTW). Had an orange stripe converter, too. I was so jealous driving my brother's totally stock T a few weeks ago - I forgot what it was like to actually spool from a dead stop stab of the throttle.
I think I had other problems (rich condition) that I've now fixed. I have a PT-61 now turbo and it spools better than the PT-61 even with a bigger exhaust housing. It's still spooling slower than I'd like. I have a 9x11 3500 stall converter on the way and based on your post I'm afraid I may not like it on the street. Most of the miles I put on the car are to and from the track but I do cruise around town once in a while.
Jim
So you think your at 450 at 17 PSI boost with a stock cam, on 93 octane, and running rich? I wont say what I want to say. Drop it a hundred. At least. Stock GN on a hail mary dyno pull is 230-250 approx.. some a little higher, up the boost to 17 lets say 270.. you do heads.. even a set of fully ported GN1's aluminum, low-mid 300's. Do a big cam.. things change. Your combo is mismatched.
First real life lesson comes when you go to the track and only trap 108-110.
Assumming the planets line up correctly, it is perfect in tune, running 27PSI boost, possible 450-470 RWHP.
Dunno where the 550 number came. That would mean 730 flywheel, and that doesnt happen at 17 PSI on an iron headed 231 with a stock cam. Unless you blow a 250 shot of nitrous into the motor.
get a scanmaster, and then buy a direct scan, laptop, and spare ecm. Then you will have the tools necesssary to get the car sorted out. Until then.. the butt dyno says its fast.. but fast is a relative term
First real life lesson comes when you go to the track and only trap 108-110.
Assumming the planets line up correctly, it is perfect in tune, running 27PSI boost, possible 450-470 RWHP.
Dunno where the 550 number came. That would mean 730 flywheel, and that doesnt happen at 17 PSI on an iron headed 231 with a stock cam. Unless you blow a 250 shot of nitrous into the motor.
get a scanmaster, and then buy a direct scan, laptop, and spare ecm. Then you will have the tools necesssary to get the car sorted out. Until then.. the butt dyno says its fast.. but fast is a relative term
First of all bigger turbo's suck on the street!!I think a TE-60 would have been a better choice for my car then the PTE-44 though.No the car is not at below 350 Hp now.Yeah its running rich and not tuned like a race car that it is but at 17lbs of boost on 93 gas i don't think its putting out 450Horses either because it is simply running rich.I have a great set of cylinder heads.I have a ESP front mount intercooler worth about 70+ horsepower and a Jay Carter 93 chip,340 walbro hot wire,ported intake manifold,3:73 gears.I also have a Chevy 427 race engine in my Camaro runs 10's so i know what as far as power Im estimating is close to 400 Horse power at 17 lbs boost..Precision said with my combination with a race chip and race fuel I should get into the low 11's.My heads by the way are machine CNC ported 85+ Horsepower also.I just need a scan tool and i will be blowing the doors off mostly any street car and especially bigger turbo GN's.Its hard to beat a TE-44 on the street!!
turbojimmy
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Not really. So far, the PT-61 is awesome from about 10 MPH on. I just need some more stall to get the car moving. If I wind it up against the brake it's just fine. I guess I expected these compromises so they don't bother me. Once the car is rolling it's a blast.
Jim
Not lag, you just have to step on the throttle a little more to get the car to move from a dead stop due to the higher stall. You will also notice you have to back off the throttle a little once you’re moving otherwise once the turbo spools you'll be accelerating much faster than you intended!
But the turbo spools up allot faster and the power comes on a lot faster. At full throttle it basically just shreds the tires instantly at just about any speed under 45.
When I say it's a little annoying to drive every day I mean as a daily driver. If you’re not driving the car every day then it really won't be an issue. I drive my t with a 3200 stall all the time back and forth from Jersey and don't really mind it at all. It's really not that bad and was well worth the performance improvement. You should be really happy with the converter. Especially when you take it to the track!
Now as Razor said:
450-470 horse will get you into the low 11's assuming the car will launch at the line (slicks, high boost launch, etc).
Now that’s at 27 lbs. Go back down to 17 lbs of boost (-10 lbs, about 100 horse) and your back down to 350. And that’s with a perfect tune.
As far as the way you calculate your horsepower from added parts, I’ll let someone else handle that one.
The TE-44 turbo that you have does it have a Garret housing or precision?I have a precision exhaust housing.From a dead stop could it be that my modified 3000 stock D5 is to much stall and it has to get to 3000 rpm before the turbo spools efficiently.I don't think its the case but by having a little more stall converter for this turbo required might be why i can't get that instant throttle without winding it up,from a dead stop??? Im not against the PT-61 or any other big turbo's I just like more of a street type terror turbo that hits hard at low RPM's!!!
Saying Im running 17lbs boost with my PTE-44 turbo and running it at 27 lbs of boost will give me an extra 100 Horses seems likely.What do most guys run as far as boost on the street with a TE-44 turbo???Should I up it to 22lbs of boost for the extra 50 Horses or is that too high for 94 octane on a 93 street chip???
I have a precision housing on my 44.
From what you are saying you want the car to do I would recommend a 3200 stall 9x11.
But here's the problem. I have never seen a 3000 stall d5 orange stripe actually stall at 3000. The highest I’ve seen is 2850. A 9x11 or a precision will actually stall pretty close to where it's supposed to. A big part of this is due to it being a 9" and not a 12" (without going into detail on how a converter works with fin angles and such).
For what you’re looking for I would recommend a 3200 stall 9x11. Or to be on the conservative side a 3000 stall. BTW CK Performance has great prices on 9x11 converters.
Also if you want to run more boost on the street look into an alky kit. Razor (one of the guys replying here) makes one of the best kits around. www.alkycontrol.com
From what you are saying you want the car to do I would recommend a 3200 stall 9x11.
No. A 3000 stall converter is made to slip till it gets to 3000 rpm. What that does is allow the engine to get to 3000 rpm faster under heavy throttle.
But here's the problem. I have never seen a 3000 stall d5 orange stripe actually stall at 3000. The highest I’ve seen is 2850. A 9x11 or a precision will actually stall pretty close to where it's supposed to. A big part of this is due to it being a 9" and not a 12" (without going into detail on how a converter works with fin angles and such).
For what you’re looking for I would recommend a 3200 stall 9x11. Or to be on the conservative side a 3000 stall. BTW CK Performance has great prices on 9x11 converters.
Usually no more than 17, some may like 18 some may not want to go over 16 (With a good aftermarket chip like Turbotweak). It all depends on the car. The only way to find out is to use a scan tool or knock gauge (a gauge that no gn should be without). Turn the boost up till you get knock then turn it back down till it's gone.
Also if you want to run more boost on the street look into an alky kit. Razor (one of the guys replying here) makes one of the best kits around. www.alkycontrol.com
Pronto
No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot.
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Wow with all the mods you got you never got a Scanmaster? Order one today! Please don't quote hp increases from parts that you have on, it sounds like ricetalk. I laugh at the guys at the track that throw out how much hp they are making. Without a real dyno test or some honest hp calculators your really just blowing smoke through your hat. I can't tell you how many "500hp" cars I beat with my old 403 Olds T/A. I figured I was making about 300 max.
Yeah i have heard of the 9x11 3200 converter but i also heard of the vigilante single disc 3200 coverter but i still think from a dead stop my stock modified D5 2800 or 3000 stall converter should give me the instant throttle off idle without giving it RPM's.I think Im running rich.When i fix the car being rich especiallt at low RPM then i will see if i need a converter.I got alot of extra power in my motor and I don't have a scan tool yet.But a will be getting one real soon.The guys here can believe what they want especially,about the guy who said my car has probably about 330HP probably drives a slow stock GN.At least I know I got a capable 11 second car for real when tuned ,slicks.
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