TurboTom72
Boost Addict
Hi everyone. I have some questions with regards to the Red Armstrong XP plus fuel pump. This is not a thread being started to determine who's pump is the best, but I'm hoping some of the more knowledgeable members can chime in and help clarify the facts regarding these particular fuel pumps as a debate began in another general tech thread and I decided to start a different thread rather than hijack someone else's. The question is, does Red modify Walbro pumps, and/or does Walboro produce fuel pumps specifically for Quad Air built to Red Armstrong's specifications. The debate was between myself and TType6 and here are some snippets from our conversation in the tread Help,Help,Help. Here's basically how the conversation went:
So, that's basically it in a nutshell. Sorry for the novel, but that was what I've read and believed for several years now, and I really want to know if what TType6 is claiming is true. Thanks in advance guys!
I installed a Red Armstrong XP pump after I discovered I had one of the faulty pumps that Earl mentioned. That really pissed me off as I had changed a previous pump out as a precaution and replaced it with a new one that failed after only a couple hundred miles. The new Racetronix pumps are looking pretty good these days with many having greater output numbers than the Walboro pumps. My pump is basically a modified Walbro, but I would probably have looked to Racetronix had their newest line of pumps had been available at the time.
No,it is a pump that is built to Red's specs by Walbro. You can't buy a Walbro and modify it to flow as well as Red's. Still the same pump that it has always been. A very good flowing and reliable pump.
I agree that it is a very good pump, and I've had excellent luck with mine so far and would reccomend them to anyone. I really don't recall seeing any info anywhere that mentions what your claims are here. Basically what I've read on the various TB sites throughout the years is that Red modified GSS307 pumps by shimming the pressure relief spring which as a result achieved higher flow numbers. There is actually discussions on this forum about that exact subject matter and Racetronix actually makes mention of it. In July 2010, I orderd my XP plus from Quad Air. I'm pretty sure that Jane told me in conversation that Red modifies all the pumps himself in house, as I was curious, and asked her specifically about the pump in an effort to avoid buying another GSS340 pump, which died with under 300 miles on it. But that was several years ago, and things may have changed there since then. Also, and I could be wrong on this, but I don't think he is selling enough units to warrant Walbro to build pumps to his specs. If they did build to his specs, I think the cost per unit would be so high that I doubt he'd be able to sell them at $140ea.+ s/h and still be profitable. No offense, just saying. Anything is possible though, so I could be wrong too.
He does override the relief valve himself to insure that maximum pressure is available when it is needed most at maximum rpm and boost. This doesn't make the pump flow more volume. If the pump was the same internally as all the other 255s,it would flow the same. It flows more. Just like the regulator he sells,it looks like an exact duplicate of the one Kirban sells.It is on the outside,but not on the inside. If you come up with a modification to a product and ask a manufacturer to build the product with these modifications,it is common that they will only sell the modified product to you as you own the design. The industry rates pumps at a low pressure. The only way to determine which one of the 255s flows the best is to measure the flow at 70 lbs of pressure where we need them to flow. This is where Red's pumps shine.
Hi Dan, Sorry for us Hijacking your thread and turning it into a Red Armstrong fuel pump discussion. I'm going to end the debate here. TType6, although you raise some interesting points with regards to Red's pumps, you basically reiterated what I originally said. You claimed that walboro makes the pumps to Red's specs, so still basically a Walbro pump as they manufactured it, and you say that the pumps weren't modified, yet agree that Red shimmed the pressure relief, which, in my opinion, is a modification. So you are basically agreeing with my initial statement that the XP plus pump is a walbro pump modified by Red Armstrong at Quad Air. As our debate has resulted in the highjacking of Dan's tech support thread,and you now have sparked my interest about the topic, I am going to start a seperate thread so that some of the other long standing members can also chime in and possibly shed some light on the situation for both of us. I am sure others out there would be interested as well, and the purpose of this site is to convey accurate info to the masses. I will also put in a call to Red's shop tommorrow to see if they can shed some light on the situation as well. I will post up some of our convo here on the thread, and with the help of the community, maybe we can get some factual info. Not trying to bust stones, but really would like to know the whole story if possible.
So, that's basically it in a nutshell. Sorry for the novel, but that was what I've read and believed for several years now, and I really want to know if what TType6 is claiming is true. Thanks in advance guys!