Still have problems

[Matt McClung]

This morning I went into the shop to get the GN to take to a car show and I cranked and cranked no start but I finally prevailed and it started. Against better judgement I still went to the car show and when I got there I shut off the car and tried to restart and no problem it started right up, but after the 6 plus hours that it sit, when the show was over I could not get it started finally I got it started and brought it home and it is back in my shop. I recently got a code 41 with no start so I replaced the cam sensor cap, and I checked the cam sensor gear and the roll pin is in place and all is well. The cam sensor is not moving and if I get it to start than it will run great with no trouble codes. But leave it sit for a while and it will not start not even try to fire, but sometimes it will start and if it does you can drive it anywhere without it stalling. I recently goofed up and removed/replaced the chip without unhooking the orange wire and I did this more than once so maybe I hurt the CPU, or could it possibly be the crank sensor, but doesn't the crank sensor always need to be working or is it like the cam sensor where it needs it to start but will continue to run without a signal? It is also getting fuel and the fuel pump is working good.

Any Ideas? I tried to give all of the info I could.

Thanks once again

Matt

 

[2QUIK6]

Cam sensor is used during startup. Once started, the cam sensor can be disconnected and it will run fine. Maybe have a loose wire on the sensoer somewhere. Have you received any more code 41's since you replaced the cap?
Maybe the cam sensor is out of adjustment?
That would not explain why it would start right up though after just cutting it off but it won't start after sitting...that is why I would think maybe its not the cam sensor.

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Are you positive the fuel pump is priming when you turn the key to the on position?
With some fuel pump hotwire kits they still use the fuel pump relay located on the pass side fenderwell, sometimes the relay goes on the fritz and wont kick your pump on...

Get the car to the point where it wont start and then check to see if your getting spark, then pull a plug to see if its wet.

If you have xylene and its cool out, ive had it settle to the bottom of the tank car wouldnt start and flooded the plugs out.

Another idea, IF you floor the car while cranking the car up, the injectors dont spray(if flooded) and the car should fire up. You could have leaky injectors flooding the cylinders.
Next time try flooring the car while cranking and see if it fires up, its worked on quite a few cars if i get a phone call..
That would probably be the easiest test to start with
BW

 

[Matt McClung]

Yes I am sure that the fuel pump is priming as I have listened for it when I have been trying to start it, and I also checked for fuel at the fuel rail. I have tried the throttle to the floor just for the heck of it and no go, besides I just installed new injectors a couple of weeks ago. I also don't think that it is the cam sensor, I did not get any codes on the way to the car show today and the show was about 30 miles from my house.


Matt

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Hmmmm, did you install new or used injectors?
Did the problem exist before you installed the injectors?

What injectors did you install and whos chip is it, make sure the chip is made for the new injectors you have installed.

If thats the problem,its something else :wink:

BW

 

[Tom Walker]

Crank sensor

Yes, I've had that happen with a crank sensor. Was intermittant for a while, then stopped all together. Ign. module did that too. Good Luck!

 

[Matt McClung]

The injectors are new and I installed them a couple of weeks ago but the problem did not show its face until thursday night. Does anybody know if the ECM needs the crank sensor for just starting of does it need it to keep running after start up?

 

[TWISTER]

The crank sensor is needed to run also. I had two go out one all at once and one intermitently till it finally went different cars. PITA to change with a steel pin through an aluminum bracket just short of being welded on. Sometimes crap will get in it and knock part of it loose and it with still run sometimes. Think NAPA carries them for $40 or so,as I said before I think this may be your problem. Good LuckThey are upgraded now with a different bracket that is supposed to be better. Cheap insurance to change it out anyway.

 

[Matt McClung]

Thanks Twister, I will change it just in case but I don't think that the crank sensor is the problem because if I do get it to start, the thing will keep running and not even stumble. That is why I was wondering if the crank sensor needed to send a signal to the ECM all of the time or just at startup. Thanks again for clearing that up for me If you want to have something else to ponder, I have been in my shop today and I tried starting the GN several times today and it started every time right away doesn't matter if it was cold or warmed up. No trouble codes either.


Matt

 

[TWISTER]

Its been a few years but Im almost positive that was the way the crank sensor went out on an olds delta 88 1987 version with the 3.8 in it. Took awhile till it finally went but then I knew what was wrong. Believe me you wont want to change it on the side of the road and a tow truck on a TR sucks. Mines been towed twice once for the crank sensor and once on the trans. I hope this is your problem but its one less thing to worry about. Im sure the crank sensor sends a signal to the ecm to trigger the injectors if memory serves. Good Luck and let me know when you wanna go racing at Martin.
Marty

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

The injectors are new and I installed them a couple of weeks ago but the problem did not show its face until thursday night. Does anybody know if the ECM needs the crank sensor for just starting of does it need it to keep running after start up?

Just to start from scratch, make sure the check engine light comes on next time you turn the key on, if in never illuminates, the orange wire isnt getting power at the battery cable.
Im just trying to help out, worse case scenerio.

BW