Thoughts on plumbing oil to rear of engine

[Red Regal T]

I'm thinking of running a 3/8" steel line externally along the block, directly from the oil pump, to rear R/S lifter galley plug. This will provide fresh oil to both front and rear mains of the engine. Anybody done this with a V-6?

 

[Lee Thompson]

oiling

I don/t understand!!! What is rear R/S? What is your thinking here? What do you mean by FRESH oil? Are you wanting to feed the rear main with more oil? Why? I am full of questions.
I always run a small piece of tubing from the pass. rear plug to a new hole in the block next to the knock sensor for oil pressure signal. BTW there is absolutely NO difference in pressure from the front to rear.

 

[Silver 6]

Great idea for a thread.

I have thought about this also, but as Lee stated, what looks like a neat idea, may not have a need. I have seen writeups on other motors with a similar oiling system, such as the AMC V8. It also uses the front cover mounted oil pump.

I have found LOTS of neat ideas for the Buick that don't fill a need.

Lets take this in a slightly different direction. For the front cam bearing use one with only one hole to the passenger feed side or rotate the stock bearing to only supply oil and not pass it through to the passenger side. This would allow that front bearing to do just one thing, support the cam. Then in the rear of the block it should be pretty straight forward to run a small jumper tube from the passenger side oil passage to the driver side. They are already pipe threaded. The only parts fed on the driver side are the lifters on that side.

To me this would seem a better option than the standard method of restricting oil flow at the front cam bearing.

 

[LV GN]

i had a engine builder do that on my 109 block. ran a -6 steel braided line from the brass block where the turbo oil feed line used to run.the brass block had to be opened up and tapped. it then ran thru the knock sensor hole and into the lifter galley plug in the back of the motor it all seemed to work great. always had great oil pressure with mods done to oil pump. never lost oil pressure even when i took motor apart to freshen and found i pounded the main bearings apart from running 30 lbs boost in the mid 10's---len

 

[JDEstill]

We checked out a 455 with that mod (the external line to the rear pass side plug) at the Nats this year. Have also seen it done to a Stg I or Stg II, I forget which.

One of the guys local to me has been talking about doing the jumper in the back while blocking off the #1 cam bearing, and I too like that idea. If he's done it though he hasn't got it running yet, and I don't know of anyone else that has done that particular mod. I think that the TA block is set up this way, via internal passages of course. If that's true, then that would seem to validate the idea. "Priority main oiling", right?

John

 

[Silver 6]

It appeared from an earlier post that the rear oil line was fed from the factory oil port for the turbo.

I would suggest that along with the rear jumper, that person could feed fresh oil directly to the main oil drilling in the block. Oil going in instead of coming out. It would seem blocking the oil outlet from the front cam bearing and bringing the oil directly into the block bypassing the front cover would both be actions to boost oil flow and pressure.

All internal factory oil bypasses could be left functioning.

 

[Red Regal T]

Re: oiling

Originally posted by Lee Thompson
I don/t understand!!! What is rear R/S? What is your thinking here? What do you mean by FRESH oil? Are you wanting to feed the rear main with more oil? Why?

Referring to right side, rear, lifter galley plug. Remove the plug and feeding oil directly from the oil pump outlet by way of steel line, right to the rear of the motor through that portal. I'm not sure if it's necessary with the V-6, but I don't feel it could hurt. More oil to the rear mains can't hurt. It just may be a good modification. Pretty easy to do. Thought I'd put it out here for some discussion.

 

[JDEstill]

David, I don't understand. What main passage are you talking about? Are you talking about a single feed to the back of the block, plus the jumper line connecting the two galleys in the back?

John

 

[FJM568]

Red Regal T, what you are thinking about is what some of the 455 guys do on their motors...They run a line from the oil pressure sending port to the back of the motor, through the bellhousing and into the back of the passenger side lifter galley...This equalizes the pressure from the front to the back of the motor on the 455, supplying the rear main/#7-8 connecting rod bearings with the same oil pressure as the front rod bearings...This is a trouble spot on the bigger 455...They have a pressure drop from the front to the rear..."Most" but not all of the time that the 455's have a rod knocking, it's usually 7 or 8 that is knocking(but not always)...Jim Wiese of Tri-Shield Performance does this mod quite often on the 455s that he builds...I really don't think that it is needed on the V6's, because as Lee has mentioned, there really shouldn't be that big of a pressure drop from front to rear, because the distances just aren't that great...

As for "priority main oiling", well, this mod really doesn't do that...priority main oiling sends oil to the main bearings first(like on the TA V6 block), where on our factory V6 and V8 blocks, the pass. side lifter galley sees the oil first, then the mains, then rods...

As far as doing that mod, just drill a hole through the engine bellhousing and route the line through the hole, to a right angle fitting at the back of the lifter galley...Just make sure you have plenty of clearance between the line and the flex plate...It shouldn't hurt anything at all to do it...

Just my .02 and my opinion, for what it's worth...

 

[KendallF]

I have the rear lifter galley crossover on my S2. When I got the block, it had absolutely no lifter oiling provisions (it had T&Ds and oiled down from the top) so I decided to get oil to the driver's side lifters by crossing it over at the back. FWIW, it's VERY tight to get a braided line back there with 90 degree fittings and clear the flywheel.

 

[LV GN]

Originally posted by KendallF
FWIW, it's VERY tight to get a braided line back there with 90 degree fittings and clear the flywheel.

this is so true . i had to use arp 12 point converter bolts. they have very thin heads.

 

[Silver 6]

What I was talking about would be three seperate mods.

1. Front cam bearing with only an inlet so all oil pressure there is for the cam. That should reduce the failures some people see there.

2. In the rear of the block, remove both pipe plugs from the oil galleries. Plumb an oil feed from the passenger side to supply the driver side lifters. This could be just two 90* fittings and a short length of 1/4" hard line with flare fittings. I would think those would be smaller than AN fittings and braided lines.

3. With a remote mount oil filter, such as the Turbo Saver, you now have the option of where the oil is fed into the block. Why not bring it right into the side of the block where it needs to go? This would avoid at least four sharp turns and a couple passages in the front cover and filter adapter. Direct feed the oil from the filter to the block.

 

[KendallF]

Originally posted by Silver 6
What I was talking about would be three seperate mods.

1. Front cam bearing with only an inlet so all oil pressure there is for the cam. That should reduce the failures some people see there.

2. In the rear of the block, remove both pipe plugs from the oil galleries. Plumb an oil feed from the passenger side to supply the driver side lifters. This could be just two 90* fittings and a short length of 1/4" hard line with flare fittings. I would think those would be smaller than AN fittings and braided lines.

3. With a remote mount oil filter, such as the Turbo Saver, you now have the option of where the oil is fed into the block. Why not bring it right into the side of the block where it needs to go? This would avoid at least four sharp turns and a couple passages in the front cover and filter adapter. Direct feed the oil from the filter to the block.

I have essentially done all 3 of these..of course, on the S2 I have a tower at the front of the block to use as the oil inlet. You can't use hard lines at the back very well because you can't screw them into place without being able to flex them.

The other annoyance is that the back galley plugs are something weird like 3/8" pipe; I had to take 3/8-1/4" pipe reducer bushings, chuck them up in the lathe and shorten them, and then thread them in as far as possible to fit two 1/4" pipe-AN-3 right angle fittings and a short piece of -3 braided line.

 

[Lee Thompson]

street ell

An easy way to plumb into the back openings is to use what is called a street ell (90 degree ell with a male end on one end and a female end on the other). These come in brass and are a TIGHT radius. These come in both 1/4 in. npt for the stock block and 3/8 in. npt for the stage block. If you want to tie the ports together, point both fittings down, then use adapters from pipe to tubing, and a short piece of premade 1/4 or 5/16 brake line and hand bend it into a U going from one opening then down below the crank and back up into the other opening.

 

[Red Regal T]

I purchased an assembly from Postons years ago that plumbed oil from one lifter galley to the other for my 455. While an upgrade over stock, this mod only lubes the lifters. Getting oil to the mains is much more important. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there a boss on the rear of the S2 that can be drilled to provide oil to the mains?

 

[JDEstill]

Originally posted by Silver 6
3. With a remote mount oil filter, such as the Turbo Saver, you now have the option of where the oil is fed into the block. Why not bring it right into the side of the block where it needs to go? This would avoid at least four sharp turns and a couple passages in the front cover and filter adapter. Direct feed the oil from the filter to the block.

Ah so! That's a good idea, I hadn't thought of that one. That would indeed reduce a lot of the pressure drop between the pump and the block.

John