Failed emissions in VA

[bbbbaad]

I just went through my second test today, the first one was Saturday, both failed with the following results:

Saturday's results:

15 MPH
Limit Reading Result
HC 72 155 Fail
CO 0.29 1.57 Fail
NO 947 482 Pass
25 MPH
Limit Reading Result
HC 132 169 Fail
CO .042 2.44 Fail
NO 921 356 Pass



Today's results:

15 MPH
Limit Reading Result
HC 72 166 Fail
CO 0.29 1.58 Fail
NO 947 410 Pass
25 MPH
Limit Reading Result
HC 132 181 Fail
CO .042 2.33 Fail
NO 921 333 Pass

The mechanics said it was due to the high octane racing gas I put in at Budds Creek this summer. I don't run the car much and I could smell the high octane in the exhaust (I actually kinda like that smell). They recommended that I run it down and put in fresh gas. So, Saturday, I put in one can of GTP and one can of SeaFoam with the little remaining gas in the tank, less than 1/4 tank. I ran that low and filled the tank with 89 octane. I turned the FP down as far as it would go. I ran it for another 15 miles or so and took it in today. You see the results above.

I have until the end of the month to register the car. I would like to get it to pass without having to get a 30 day temp. They told me to run a few more tanks of fuel through to get whatever was in the tank out and have it re-tested. I would appreciate any advice you all can offer.

 

[turbofrank]

Did you change oil before test? tune up lately? Race gas makes an 02 sensor
lazy .

 

[bbbbaad]

good point

I keep forgetting that a lot of time passes even though not a lot of mileage. The motor is fresh, only 7000 miles on it, but it has been 4.5 years since it was done. It went through the 1500 miles on break in oil but it still has the synthetic in it for the past 5500 miles. I suspect that it has been contaminated over that time and is most likely the culprit. Duhhhh <--- my part.

I have replaced a lot of tune up parts recently, trying to eliminate false knock. That was the primary reason for using the race gas, to determine if it was truly false or not. I finally won that battle but I think that the O2 sensor took the brunt, as you mentioned. I am going to go through the car and do the tune up, oil change, things that it is probably due for now anyway. It flew through emissions with flying colors two years ago, it should be able to do it again, just gotta get the old gas through it, tune it, and try it again.

Any further advice anyone can offer from the readings in the original post would help immensely. Thanks for your support!

 

[TurboBuRick]

89 oct? You should always run premieum from a good scource lik BP or Shell.

You can not just turn fuel preassure down like that. Do you have a gauge?

Do you have a scanner?

 

[bbbbaad]

got it

I normally run 93, good quality, normally Sunoco. Since the guy told me that the race gas was the problem, I wanted to go with less octane, which was logical but probably not sensible. I will run this tank out and go back to my 93.

I do have a gage, it was only down to 40 with the line off. I have put it back while it is not being tested.

I do have turbolink.

 

[TurboBuRick]

Lead and other impuritys is what makes race gas bad. Not octane. Premium fuels are more refined to burn cleaner.

You should only be adjusting fp if you are trying to raise or lower BLM's

 

[TurboBuRick]

Did you change oil before test? tune up lately? Race gas makes an 02 sensor
lazy .

I would take this advice from turbofrank in tuning up the car with plugs, wires, o2 etc.
From there throw the scanner and set IAC,TPS at full temp. Once your TPS is at .42 and your IAC is around 15-20 you can adjust fp acording to BLM's.
Your trying to get it to hang around 130 @ idle. When driving BLM can swing as far as 10 + or - of 130. If it swings more you have other issues.

 

[mikestertwo]

Your emissions numbers indicate you are running rich. I agree with above, change your O2 sensor and put 93 octane back in.

 

[matswtt]

i just payed 225.00 to get my non-cat outfitted black bitch through that hoop. the only problem with that is the friggin white vans parked on the side of the "on" ramps that check emmisions. I've had to put the car in "N" and turn it off to coast by. The bastards!@@#$%

 

[turbo2nr]

Drive down South to get the inspection. I've never seen or heard of any emissions test here in Richmond.

Scrape off that rejection sticker first!~!~

 

[turbo2nr]

i just payed 225.00 to get my non-cat outfitted black bitch through that hoop. the only problem with that is the friggin white vans parked on the side of the "on" ramps that check emmisions. I've had to put the car in "N" and turn it off to coast by. The bastards!@@#$%

What is this??? What white vans?? Where? In VA??

 

[TurboDave]

I normally run 93, good quality, normally Sunoco. Since the guy told me that the race gas was the problem, I wanted to go with less octane, which was logical but probably not sensible. I will run this tank out and go back to my 93.

I do have a gage, it was only down to 40 with the line off. I have put it back while it is not being tested.

I do have turbolink.

What shape is your cat. converter in?? EGR functioning?? Good smog chip??

 

[GNTIM]

What is this??? What white vans?? Where? In VA??

Remote sensing units. They park them on the on and off ramps to major highways, measuring the emissions of vehicles passing by. They take a picture of the tag on vehicles with high emissions and if they get flagged twice, a nice letter comes in the mail telling you to bring your car to an emissions station even if you live in an area that does not require emissions inspections. They are only in countys that require emissions. They are also in place to catch people that commute in "dirty" cars from non-emission areas to countys that require emissions.

 

[turbofrank]

As Tim says and emissions and inspection are not related.

 

[bbbbaad]

still failing

I have been working all day with the mechanic on getting my car to pass. We have tried every combination we can think of and have run the test six times, each one failing.

I am still failing on CO and HC, even though they have come down drastically, they still aren't low enough.

Here is what I have done since the last time it failed until today:

- Replaced oil twice, both times with synthetic. (twice because the oil was pretty grody on the first change)
- Replaced spark plugs with R45TS at .035
- Replace O2 sensor
- Replaced fuel filter
- Replaced PCV valve
- Replaced vacuum line to EGR
- Tested EGR, smooth operation, stalled car when moved
- Set TPS to .44, IAC at 15
- Purchased turbotweak emissions chip
- Set FP to 38 hose off per Eric (TT) instruction
- BLMs and INT were nearly solid at 128
- O2 hung in around 440, moved during throttling, locked in at idle
- Ran two tanks of gas through, filled with 93 Texaco
- NOX isn't failing so the CAT seems to be working
- MAF was 24@25MPH, 22@15MPH, 4@idle
- Cleaned the intercooler with carb cleaner
- Cleaned top end with top cleaner

I am totally baffled at this point. The mechanic (he is actually the owner of the station) is going to continue working on it next week. I would like to find out if there is anything else I can do before then that might make this work.

He offered that the hi-flo CAT and mufflers (bowling greens 3" cat-back) might be causing the problem, not keeping the exhaust in the system long enough for the cat to work. I passed two years ago and have done little driving on the car since, no work on emissions items.

Any help on this would be greatly appreciated!! I am at wits end.

Thanks

Andy

 

[Eric Stage I]

The O2 should not be hanging around 440. It should be cycling up and down anywhere from 100 to 700. You might want to check the grounds at the back of the passenger cylinder head. One of those grounds (a brown wire) is the ground for the O2 sensor. Make sure it has a good connection.

Regards,
Eric

 

[GNTIM]

The O2 should not be hanging around 440. It should be cycling up and down anywhere from 100 to 700. You might want to check the grounds at the back of the passenger cylinder head. One of those grounds (a brown wire) is the ground for the O2 sensor. Make sure it has a good connection.

Regards,
Eric

He is right. If that is not the problem or symptom than I suspect the catalytic conv. I have seen a lot of aftermarket converters die in just a few years. Just because the car passes for NOX does not mean it is good.

 

[bbbbaad]

The O2 should not be hanging around 440. It should be cycling up and down anywhere from 100 to 700. You might want to check the grounds at the back of the passenger cylinder head. One of those grounds (a brown wire) is the ground for the O2 sensor. Make sure it has a good connection.

Regards,
Eric

I appreciate the feedback, I am still trying to figure this stuff out. I get lost in what is "normal". I see that people post exact numbers for their readings and have never figured out how they do that when INT, BLM, O2, etc are always fluctuating. My O2's run all the way down to <100 and >800 when I am driving, which makes sense...drop off throttle, MAF goes down, less air, less O2, goes rich, BLM goes up...I see trends, just not how someone can claim a certain number when it is so variable. <----- All of that is a sign of my learning....

----> From your post, I am assuming that my grounds are all good since my O2's do fluctuate and all think (O2 Xcnt, O2mv, etc) shows that, plus I just went through the car for false knock for six months and grounds was a biggie, all of them are re-done due to that. Pretty confident in that one. You have, however, validated one of the things that I considered but was uncertain, replacing the CAT. I was considering replacing the EGR, just to add to the long list of things I have done to fix the problem and eliminate it from consideration. At some point, I am going to get a waiver for putting in enough money and it doesn't have to pass.

Thanks again for the help. If anyone has other advice, I am willing to learn and listen.

Thanks

Andy

 

[mikestertwo]

I may have missed it somewhere but what is your combo? Injector size, turbo, intercooler, MAF, air intake, cam, heads, exhaust, etc.

 

[dvernst]

My car failed twice on those same things with a Turbotweak emissions chip. For the third test I turned the fuel pressure down so the car barely had enough power to do the test, and it didn't even have to run the full test. It passed right away. I turned the pressure down right before i got to the emissions place. i know everyone says you are not supposed to do that, but it worked for me. Good luck