have any knowledgeable folks taken the time to list??

[TTAfreak]

a winning combination of parts and prices so us novices will know exactly what to expect as far as costs.

Im doing a lot of reading, and as always, there are tons of combos and tons of opinions.

can anyone just give me a basic list of parts and prices if I want to go mid 11s and not affect the driveability or value of my car?

is that even possible?

basically I want to get solidly into the 11s with only bolt ons and be able to put the car back stock if I ever want to sell it???

from my reading I have learned this....things needed are

chip (which one would be helpful)
fuel pump
presure regulator
alky kit (from my reading this seems to be a biggy)
turbo (again, which one would be helpful)
mild stall conv.

im not new to performance by any means, but I am COMPLETELY new to turbo 6 performance.

also, some opinions on the best places to buy this stuff. does anyone know of a website that sells a complete kit thats a proven 11 sec combination?

thanks

 

[87buick3825]

1 Learn to drive the car
2 do basic things ..fuel pump and reg ect
3 stocker's can run 11s

RD

 

[89ICBM]

Originally posted by TTAfreak

can anyone just give me a basic list of parts and prices if I want to go mid 11s and not affect the driveability or value of my car?


Yes! I have a list that was put together by 2 members of the TTA mail list a few years back. I will copy it to this thread but be warned, it's kinda long;

Recommended Mods for an 11 Sec Stock-Appearing TTA
This is for the layman who is starting to get interested in some performance mods for his TTA. If the car is clean and stock , I would only recommend these basic mods at this time. Everything should be tuned properly i.e. setting the IAC and minimum air, TPS, and cam sensor, etc. per the Gnttype.org page and max out it’s base potential. Use that as a baseline and then start the bigger more extensive mods as the need for speed strikes. Check John Pearcy’s website out (www.johnsperformance.com) and see if he has any of this stuff 1st and then try the other vendors I mention below if for some reason he doesn’t have that particular item.
Hope this helps. Please feel free to make suggestions or ask me any questions.
Good Luck,
--------------------------------------BEGIN HERE-----------------------------------------------------

THE FIRST LEVEL - Your 1st step is to get your car tuned to spec once you have a scantool.
1. ___Scan Tool
Scanmaster2 $249
Phone (810) 293-0099
http://www.modernmusclecar.com/
and/or
TurboLink $149.95 + $100 for boost sensing option (cable + 3-Bar MAP sensor)
TDS Technologies - Ken Mosher
1 (402) 292 6707
kenmosher@turbo-link.com
http://www.turbo-link.com

Then do the following tuning procedures per John Pearcy and/or the gnttype.org page:
___Set the minimum air (write up by John Pearcy)
___Set the IAC & TPS (http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/faq/IACreset.html)
___Set the cam sensor
(http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/ecmsensors/camsensor.html)
When setting your cam sensor, I would like to recommend a cam sensor tool that might make setting it much easier.
*___Cam Sensor Tool
p/n PE483362 $28.50
Poston Enterprises
1-800-635-9781

Then remember to check John’s website 1st for all these parts.
2.___Knock Gauge $65
Casper’s Electronics 1 (847) 247 0484
http://www.casperselectronics.com
and
Pillar Gauge Holder
(1 Pod), ATR, p/n TA417-S, $24.95

3.___Boost Control Vacuum Hoses (Y-hoses), $12-$24
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html
*leading cause of overboost,should replace
every 3 years & always have one handy

At this point, you may want to purchase a GTech to allow you to check the car’s true base performance before any other mods.
After doing so, it might be interesting to perform these free mods to see if your car picks up any performance. I wish I would have thought of this stuff when my car had relatively few mods.
Free Mods:
___Block off Throttle Body Coolant Line
___Remove Turbo to Valve Cover Line and plug holes
___Remove Screen from Intercooler
___Remove one MAF screen.
*___GTech Performance Meter $139.99
Summit Racing Equip
1-800-230-3030
http://www.summitracing.com

*___Throttle Body Bypass Plugs
ATR, p/n TA118, $3.95

*optional or you can block them off yourself
4.___Valve Cover Breather $49.95 custom w/ Pontiac logo that plugs hole in valve cover (i.e. oil line from turbo to valve cover)
Johns Performance(www.johnsperformance.com)
1-425-355-7149
johnsperformance@compuserve.com
*also helps reduce crankcase pressure

-----------------------------------HESITATE HERE FOR TESTING-----------------------
THE FIRST LEVEL, Part 2
5.___ Adjustable Wastegate (OEM style)
p/n GM511 $129.95
Applied Technologies & Research (ATR)
1 (864) 972-3800

6. ___Adjustable Fuel Press Regulator
Mark Martone version $65 (stock appearing)
Upper Billet version $119 (not stock appearing)
Cotton’s Performance 1 (800) 639 0531

7.___ Fuel Pressure Gauge $38
Underhood gauge that mounts to fuel rail and incl. long steel braided hose
Casper’s Electronics 1 (847) 247 0484
http://www.casperselectronics.com

8.___K&N Cone Air Filter
8” K&N (p/n RE-0910) or
P/N: E-0870 Replaces AC A633C
*double check these part numbers against one another
Description: GM V6-231 (3.8L) Turbo & F/I
local parts stores
or
Summit Racing Equip
1-800-230-3030
http://www.summitracing.com

9. ___Intercooler Hose Kit
Heavy Duty w/ clamps $15 - $22
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html
*stronger hoses & clamps less likely to blow off

10.___Engine Tie Down $20
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html
or
Home Depot (Do-it-yourself)
*Ask me about this if you want details.
*reduces engine torque over and chance of false knock

11.___Thermostat (160 degree) $8.95
Cotton’s Performance Center - Jack Cotton
1 (800) 639 0531
turbo38gn@aol.com
www.cottonsperformance.com
*car runs cooler & most aftermarket chips are designed to run with one

12. ___Chip
*must be matched to injectors
(93,100,108) $50 each + $7 S&H
updates $25 each
Joe Lubrant
1 (219) 996 7834
*He can custom design your chip if you specify mods.
or
Thrasher (92, 108) $25
Russ Salerno, rsalerno@li.net
*great idle quality & performance but currently only for stock or BlueTop
injectors

Other chip makers:
Red Armstrong, , Modern Muscle, Max Effort, etc.
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html

13.___Hot Wire Kit to the Fuel Pump $55
direct plug in with no wires to cut
Casper’s Electronics Inc.
1 (847) 247 0484
http://www.casperselectronics.com
*ensures against voltage drop to fuel pump under throttle

-------------------------------------------STOP HERE-----------------------------------------------------

THE NEXT LEVEL - After you have maxed out the car’s base level of mods. All mods I marked with an * I consider optional.
*___Pillar Gauge Holder
(2 Pod), JEG’s catalog, $25 made by Accel
or
(3 Pod),Lo-Tek Engineering, approx. $45
1 (919) 479-0749

Other Gauges for the cockpit:
*___Boost Gauge
ATM-5703 Boost/Vacuum, 30 in Hg/ 30 psi.............$46.95
*___Fuel Pressure Gauge
ATM-5709 Fuel Pressure, 0-100 psi, electrical.........$79.95
Both are white-faced, 2’ - 1/16” from AutoMeter, from
Summit Racing Equipment
1-800-230-3030
http://www.summitracing.com

*___Valve Springs, approx. $40
Comp Cams 979-12 ~80lbs or 980-12 ~85lbs
*if your car has over 30,000 miles and an aftermarket cam
Comp Cams direct at 1-800-999-0853
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html
or
LT-1 100 lb springs, $38
*Ok if you still have the stock cam
Johns Performance(www.johnsperformance.com)
1-425-355-7149
johnsperformance@compuserve.com

*___Magnetic Drain Plug, Trans
ATR, p/n TA609, $8.95
*attracts metallic particles to reduce liklihood of damage

*___Magnetic Drain Plug, Oil
ATR, p/n TA612, $4.95

*optional
14.___Subframe Connectors $149.39
*stiffens frame, prevents squeeks & rattles
SouthSide Machine p/n SSM-1415
Summit Racing Equip
1-800-230-3030

15.___ Injectors
BlueTops or Bosch 868’s - 36lb or MSD 50’s - 50lb injectors $249 - 299, $439 Cottons, Quad Air, Modern Muscle, PTE, etc.
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html
*chip needs to be matched with injectors

16. ___Test Pipe (in place of Cat) $65
*replaces cat converter & removes backpressure, along with dp may provide
40hp gain
Modern Muscle (810) 293-0099
or
Eastern Performance, contact Bill M. i.e. millerwg@aol.com

17.___High Performance Muffler
*Stainless, reduced back pressure, good sound quality Dynomax UltraFlow Muffler(p/n WLK-17266)
$114 + $7 S&H = $121
Summit Racing Equip 1-800-230-3030
http://www.summitracing.com

18.___Downpipe
2-1/2” p/n TA101 $179.95
ATR 1 (864) 972-3800
or
3” Terry Houston DP Complete with 3” Test Pipe $465 - 550
*May want the Magnecore 8.5mm wires w/ 90 degree boots $69 (needed to clear 3” DP)
Cottons Performance 1 (800) 639 0531
19.___High Capacity Fuel pump up to $139
Walbro 307 or 340
http://members.home.com/syclone/APE/fuelpump.html
or
Cotton’s Performance 1 (800) 639 0531
or
Red’s XP Pump $145
Quad Air, Inc. - Red Armstrong
1 (440) 235 3232

20. ___Transmission Cooler $49.95
B&M Transmission Cooler(p/n BMM-70264)
Summitt Racing Equip 1-800-230-3030
*reduces trans temps and ensures longer trans life

21.___Stock Torque D5 Converter est. $300-400
Reworked for higher stall i.e. 2800
Rich Gomez - custom torque converters
M-Th 12 noon - 8PM ET after 5pm
1 (800) 803 1003
1 (540) 832 7872

22. ___Shift Kit
B&M $49.95 to 69.95
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html
or
TransGo $119.95
PMAC Performance - Mike Kurtz
1 (888) 661 5118

23.___Drag Radials
Nitto Extreme Drags NT555 245/50/16 $125 each
Discount Tire Direct 1-888-916-3211
mention “TurboBuick.com Discount”
http://www.dicounttiredirect.com
Alternate Source: .www.LS1speed.com, contact JBolds442@aol.com for info
or
BFG Drags, Hoosier QuickTime Pros, MT ET Streets, etc
26x11.50x16 size

24.___Driveshaft Loop
www.jegs.com, approx. $35
(still waiting on one that does not require drilling)

25.___Fire Extinguisher
*Have no preference on where to get this at yet....Wal-mart,etc.(?)
------------------------------------------STOP HERE-------------------------------------------------

THE FINAL LEVEL - I really don’t think these items are necessary unless you are very serious about racing the car, but here they are. I am still trying to emphasize stock appearance.
26.___Transbrake $189.95
*Allows you to launch with as much boost as you want by using trans instead
of brakes
Mike Smith
TurboMike.Com
trbomike@hotmail.com
*jury is still out on whether this will cause premature trans, driveline, or
rearend failure, but outstanding results have been reported

27.___Intercooler
*Intercooler and a half added to the bottom, very low on ground clearance,
Stock appearing, extra rows with big neck
Cotton’s Performance 1 (800) 639 0531 $679
or
ATR 1 (864) 972-3800
p/n RP360B1 $695
*a realistic 2 tenths improvement


28.___Turbo
TA49 - TA61 (stock appearing) $650 -800
PTE, Cottons, etc.
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html

29.___High Stall Torque Converter $650 -800
Precision Industries Vigilante 2800-3200 stall single clutch
http://www.gnttype.org/vendors/index.html
30.___High Performance Cat-Back Exhaust System
Edelbrock, PaceSetter, Hooker (Contact John Pearcy for details)
Summit Racing Equip 1-800-230-3030
http://www.summitracing.com

----------------------------------------------THE END-----------------------------------------------

 

[2QUIK6]

Don't forget that first step...getting a scan tool and learning how to read/use it...otherwise there will be no returning to factory unopened motor cause it will be in pieces.
The best bang for the buck unless you have lots of patience and learn to tune and take the car/motor to the edge of destruction is to get a bigger turbo/convertor. A PT61 with a 3200 stall will put you into the low 11's easy and not have to tune the motor to the brink of destruction...can be done with a lot lower boost this way.

My GN runs the times in the sig with just the bolt ons listed.

 

[TTAfreak]

89ICBM, thanks for that post.

2QUIK6, I think your set up is just what im looking for.

thanks.

 

[Lee_Burough]

Here is a poll on the modifications that were the best bang for the buck for our boardmembers

Good Luck

lee

 

[TTAfreak]

2QWIK6

i have read over and over again that the VERY FIRST STEP is getting the scan tool.

ok, i get that......but can you actually make changes with the scan too? or does it ONLY provide information?

 

[2QUIK6]

Originally posted by TTAfreak
2QWIK6

i have read over and over again that the VERY FIRST STEP is getting the scan tool.

ok, i get that......but can you actually make changes with the scan too? or does it ONLY provide information?

The scan tool will only provide you information on your state of tune. You can then raise/lower fp, or change timing or fueling if you have ways of adjusting it (like with a Translator+, or adjustable chip liek Max Effort, or Erics "TurboTweaks" chips, or burning your own chips) or add/subtract boost. If you are running rich, you may not have any knock, but won't be the best performance you could have, you might could raise boost a little. Or if you are lean and getting Knock (which you won't be able to hear unless its severe) you need to back off boost and/or timing before you blow something!
Scan tool also helps daignose idle problems, idle and cruise fueling and overall tune of your motor...very useful for this as well as the track. There's tons of info on this site an gnttype.org when its up for all of the different parameters you can see with the scan tool.
I got the scan tool, then later learned to burn my own chips...it is time consuming and lots of folks think that its easier to just adjustable chips and Trans+ etc...but once you learn to burn your own, the possibilities are endless and you'll never have as good a tune as your own. I have a Trans+ but only use it for the LS1 MAF

 

[TTAfreak]

2QUIK,

another question. (thanks tons for the help so far)

say I decide to go with a bigger turbo, injectors, fuel pump, presure reg, and a few other things.......can you special order a chip that is burned for your specific mods?

if so, from whom?

and wouldnt that prevent you from needing to learn how to tune on your own?

thanks

 

[2QUIK6]

Originally posted by TTAfreak
can you special order a chip that is burned for your specific mods?

if so, from whom?

and wouldnt that prevent you from needing to learn how to tune on your own?

thanks

Most modern day chip vendors will ask about you combo, they must know the injectors size and turbo at a minimum, turbo size is needed and the amount of boost you expect to run because that factors into the WOT fueling since in most cases the MAF is maxed out.
You still need a scan tool to tune by, because the "Custom" chip is going to be a rough guess at best. If you don't make your own chips, you still have fuel pressure and amount of boost to adjust in order to get WOT O2s/EGTs and no Knock (KR) for that "perfect" tune making max power.

Without a scan tool and minimally a knock gauge, your asking for trouble if you are going to do any WOT blasts no matter what the boost amount is. Knock will kill a motor quick, and with todays wimpy octane gas with tons of additives, its worse than when these cars were new.

I'd recommend a chip that has adjustable features such as WOT fueling and timing, like Eric's (Turotweak) or MaxEffort, or if you have a Translator/MAF a Bob Bailey Extender chip.
If you not doing much track action, then a street chip from many of the other vendors will work with less complexity, but still need a scanner of some sort and knock gauge is my recommendation.

 

[HOFSGNX]

Bringing back this post - Any Updates

Guys, this appears to be a great post with lots of good advice. It is about a year old, are there any updates to these ideas? I have a couple initial questions for my low mile pure stock TTA:

1.) In some of the initial steps it says to block off the throttle body coolant line - how is this done? What does it look like? What does this do?

2.) How do you remove one MAF screen? What does this do?

3.) To set the IAC, what and where is the ALDL diognostic lead/connector that has to be grounded? Where is the IAC connector? Do you really want the car to run at 500+/-50 RPM's as http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/faq/IACreset.html says to do?

4.) How important is it to the CAM sensor adjustment, looks pretty involved according to http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/ecmsensors/camsensor.html .

 

[Quiky One]

Guys, this appears to be a great post with lots of good advice. It is about a year old, are there any updates to these ideas? I have a couple initial questions for my low mile pure stock TTA:

1.) In some of the initial steps it says to block off the throttle body coolant line - how is this done? What does it look like? What does this do?

2.) How do you remove one MAF screen? What does this do?

3.) To set the IAC, what and where is the ALDL diognostic lead/connector that has to be grounded? Where is the IAC connector? Do you really want the car to run at 500+/-50 RPM's as http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/faq/IACreset.html says to do?

4.) How important is it to the CAM sensor adjustment, looks pretty involved according to http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/ecmsensors/camsensor.html .

2. Take the MAF off the car and look inside. There will be two screens there. Remove one. Flows a little better.
3. Nothing has to br grounded. The IAC adjustment is on the drivers side of the motor in front of the FPR.
4. Don't adjust it unless it needs to be.

Jason

 

[Quiky One]

Here is a quick pic of the IAC adjustment screw. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g139/Quikyone6/IAc.jpg Sorry the typing is a little small. It says "IAC adjustment screw".

HTH Jason

 

[HOFSGNX]

Thanks for the prompt response. Getting my scanmaster tomorrow so I want to be ready. What does IAC stand for (idle air control?) and what do we set it at? Where is the IAC connector that has to be disconnected? They want .42 - .44 on the TPS, but do they really want the idle speed set at only 500 +/-50 RPM's?

Any specifics on blocking off the Throttle Body Coolant line?

Tips on installing the Scanmaster?

 

[Quiky One]

Thanks for the prompt response. Getting my scanmaster tomorrow so I want to be ready. What does IAC stand for (idle air control?) and what do we set it at? Where is the IAC connector that has to be disconnected? They want .42 - .44 on the TPS, but do they really want the idle speed set at only 500 +/-50 RPM's?

Any specifics on blocking off the Throttle Body Coolant line?

Tips on installing the Scanmaster?

Installing the scanmaster is a breeze. Comes with great instructions. Yes, IAC-Idle Air Control...should be 5-20 at hot idle. DO NOT mess with it unless you have to. If the car starts and idles fine leave it alone. Dont ask me how I know.... . You dont disconnect the IAC. What chip do you have? Most and all chips have the idle at 700-800 rpms. I wouldnt really worry about it unless it is really high. Sorry for the choppy reply. I was reading then answering. O and I dont really remember how I blocked off the throttle body coolant line. Someone who remembers chime in.

Glad to help,

Jason

 

[HOFSGNX]

Thanks for the info. I have a completely Stock TTA (except test pipe) so I still have the stock chip. I thought that 500 +/- 50RPM's was a little low. So it sounds like the main thing to do is get the TPS at .42 - .44. I thought this was a good post to look at to get my 8,000 mile stock TTA into the 12's without slicks. I just want to do it right and keep it stock with only bolt on parts.

Right now the car starts and idles fine just sitting there, but sometimes when you drive it, the idle seems quite high, so high that it will shift from 1st to 2nd without touching the accelerator. It also does not downshift (even when in Drive) as you are attempting to slow down towards a stoplight, That means I have to fight the drivetrain with the brakes to get it to stop because it is running around 900-1300 RPM's most of the time during driving. Any ideas on this? Could this be a IAC problem?

Anybody out there block off the Throttle Body Coolant line and have some specifics on how to do? What does this do to increase performance?

 

[72firebird]

Anybody out there block off the Throttle Body Coolant line and have some specifics on how to do? What does this do to increase performance?

I just took on of the hoses on the coolant pipes that sit on the passenger valve cover and looped it from one to the other (there's 2 of them stock that run to the throttle body). Then I got some plugs at like Home Depot or somewhere similar and covered the little nipples on the TB. Stock coolant flows around the outside of the TB blade so that during winter it won't freeze and the blade get stuck open or closed. If you're not going to be driving you car during the winter (which with 8k miles I hope not) then you'll be fine removing it.

Now for removing the MAF screen I'm going to have to disagree with everyone on this mod. I have had friends who descreened their MAF and actually run into problems with it reading correctly. I believe that the MAF was made to read with the screens on and the resitrictions there in order to read correctly. If you're going to say that you're just removing the screen after the actual sensor, I still believ that it was made to read with the slight backpressure that is caused by that screen being there. It really isn't going to make really any difference because the holes are fairly large in it and your air filter probably restricts airflow more than your MAF.

 

[Quiky One]

Right now the car starts and idles fine just sitting there, but sometimes when you drive it, the idle seems quite high, so high that it will shift from 1st to 2nd without touching the accelerator. It also does not downshift (even when in Drive) as you are attempting to slow down towards a stoplight, That means I have to fight the drivetrain with the brakes to get it to stop because it is running around 900-1300 RPM's most of the time during driving. Any ideas on this? Could this be a IAC problem?

It could be the IAC. Get the scanmaster and get us numbers. It could be a BLM issue also. A new chip might be the cure.

Jason

 

[Quiky One]

Now for removing the MAF screen I'm going to have to disagree with everyone on this mod. I have had friends who descreened their MAF and actually run into problems with it reading correctly. I believe that the MAF was made to read with the screens on and the resitrictions there in order to read correctly. If you're going to say that you're just removing the screen after the actual sensor, I still believ that it was made to read with the slight backpressure that is caused by that screen being there. It really isn't going to make really any difference because the holes are fairly large in it and your air filter probably restricts airflow more than your MAF.

If you remove both screens you will have problems. If you remove only one of them you won't have any issues at all. I have run with one screen for awhile as did the previous owner and never an issue. All cars are different though.

Jason

 

[Dabigguy]

Great post guys !!!! The newbys will love this info, but there is one thing that should be added. Make sure your car if performing at it's peak before you start modifications. The Spring cleaning should be the first step.

http://www.gnttype.org/maint/basics.html