how about a supra motor in a GN?

[rtviper]

Also on the question of how many vette motors are making 6 7 or 8 hundred hp their are probably more making that kind of power then supras sold in the states? Many of the so called vette motors are making that kind of power n/a. The same motor design s/b v8 with mods to the internals like the supras have done will make up to 1000 hp n/a with no power adders. Yes these are race motors used for the strip but hey you asked if they had similar potential? I will guarantee you their are turbo powered vettes and vipers with much more power then 6 7 or 8 or 1000 hp. The svi turbo dodge made 900 on 14 psi

 

[WICKEDGN]

True rt viper but look at the extra 2cylinders or even the 4 cylinders on your viper, see the beauty about owning a gn or supra is that it is only a 6 and it's fun beating you eight and 10 cyl. guys for you only to hear that youve gotten smoked by a litle 3.8 or 3.0 wich is my supra. I think it would be fun driving a gn with a supra motor wicked87.

 

[rtviper]

wicked I am not saying the v8 or v10 is a better option. I am just responding to the question do vettes have 6 7 8 or 1000 hp and yes they do. Since F and F movies many kids think the supra motor is the second comming. Yes it is a very nice motor the factory built to handle a lot of power but is does not corner the market on hp. I am just confused at what would be enjoyable in driving a supra powered GN when you can obtain the same power with the 3.8 motor. Yes it would have to be a stage motor to last with 1000 hp and more but it can and is being done and up to 1700 hp. Now it may be fun to drive a car with a supra motor that could not obtain similar hp with its own motor. But in a GN or vette or viper or cuda or etc etc I dont see the reason as all these cars can obtain the same power with their own motors
A while back someone on the buick site had an 80s model camaro for sale with a low performance 454 with twin turbos that was runnning low 9s with low boost . Thats what can be accomplished with power adders on many motors

 

[JordanCVP]

This topic caught my attention because I always had the idea in my head myself. But apparently, there are some narrow-minded people on this forum. What the hell is so sacrelige about swapping a motor in a GN? Didn't most of you buy a GN to be UNIQUE, instead of being like every other camaro, trans am, mustang, civic, etc. wannabe racer on the road? These cars are special, and it doens't make them any less special just because they don't have a buick motor in them. If they go fast, they're still sleepers. Even if a 2JZ does cost miles more than a stage motor, maybe it's worth it to someone for the whole unique one-and-only feeling.

I couldn't have said it better than turbosam or raven... Chris Chow's GN may not exactly be a sleeper with two gigantic turbos sticking out of the hood, but its still fast as all hell, right? Would a 1khp supra motor not haul some balls in a TR? Theres a reason they are so popular to gearheads. All fast cars and engines deserve SOME respect, even if they don't have the buick logo plastered all over them. I swear, some of you guys need to think out of the box.

 

[rtviper]

Having a hand growing out of your forehead is also unique but not necessarily a desirable thing The response that others are assholes because they dont see any merit in bastardising a gn for no reason other then to be different is the typical response of the F and F groupies. Their just isnt any advantage to the swap but its your money to do with what you want. If you cant handle the opinions from those you ask then dont ask. Easy deal. Just remember many people did not get caught up in the F and F fairy tale so dont get upset if some of us look at the idea as foolish

 

[TRiv]

Having opinions and being loyal to a particular brand does'nt make us narrow minded, it makes us the competition, it's what we like and what we choose to have.

No one except your finances and maybe wife/girlfriend can keep you from putting a Supra,GN, Chevy,Ford, Cummins, General Electric turbine, or whatever engine in whatever vehicle you choose, no one here can do that, but the GN guys, as the Supra guys or any other make would do is voice their opinions to this swap.

I, as have others here stand behind the Buick GN and the engine they came with, and just do'nt see any point to this swap, though WICKEDGN said he has no plans to do such, just wondered what we think, well here are the results, just conversation.

I like many makes and models, and respect most hi perf cars and engines, to be real all engines are just glorified air pumps that produce rotating motion all in thier own way. In my experience with swaps, switching from one respected hi perf engine brand to anouther respected brand body causes the same arguments out there as they do here and it does'nt stop. I put a 396 in a 70 GTO Judge when GN's were still a decal package and Toyotas were just commuter cars, and even though it was faster and cheaper than finding a Ram Air engine (High 12"s) I did'nt get much respect for that and always had to deal with " that goat has a Chevy motor" in general disgust. Sure it could beat others but just did'nt fit in too many circles.

My opinion, both cars are highly respected and run, and both can be made to run the extreme with thier respective engines so what would be the point? I am sure the Supra guys would say the same if someone wanted to put a Buick 6 in a Supra.

 

[SinistrV6]

Swapping a different motor into a GN or TR is unacceptable to me solely because of the inherent value of the car. Limited production, growing collectability, etc. Having said that, I love hybrids. Building one myself (see sig). Want to put that badass rice motor in a Buick? Great!! Just not a TR!! Any old Regal will have the same effect cosmetically.
I wouldn't put my LC2 in a Hemi Cuda. Or an L88 'Vette. Or a Shelby Mustang. Assuming all of these cars are "real" and not "clones" they are inherently valuable in large part because of the motors that came in them from the factory. The TR's are no different. Clone any of the aforementioned cars and put whatever motor you want in it. I saw the video of Mr. Chow's GN yesterday and was duly impressed. Only throught the context of this thread did I find out it was SBC and TT. Very nice, but inappropriate in a real GN. Of course, it's his car and he may have the chassis set up for alot of HP before the SBC and didn't want to start over from scratch (I wouldn't!) I wholeheartedly approve of hybrids of any kind where you're replacing a motor that was...
a. underpowered
b. powerful enough but too common
c. in a car that was produced in high volume and added no
specific value to the car.

This OPINION is worth exactly what you had to pay for it......

 

[WhiteT78Supra]

Hello guys,

I just wanted to say that the TR/GN is a great platform and that I know how bad ass your cars can be built to run. I have a lot of respect for them.

I did want to clear up a few things though...

HKS cams do not cost $3000 a pair they are about $1400 at full retail or $1100 a pair if you know where to look. You can get a pair of JUN cams for about $1000 at full retail or about $700 discounted price. Cam gears are about $135-150 each.

I built my own fuel system for about $1700.

Toyota does not sell long blocks. I can pick up a brand new Toyoya short block for $1800 from the dealer, and a head is about $2800.

A GReddy T88H turbo setup (capable of supporting 1150+ rwhp) retails for $4100, but you can get one for $3750 all day long.



OR, for the ultimate in reliability at 1000+ rwhp...

You can buy a race motor from Titan Motorsports.


A Titan Motorsports prepared fully assembled 1000HP proven built race/street engine. This is a complete long block from oil pan to HKS 272 cam shafts (no turbo kit of course).

Carillo/GReddy high performance shot-peened rods, JE forged pistons with the large wrist pins. Clearance and balanced rotating assembly with clevite bearings and all the oiling tricks and mods to make this the winning motor combination utilized in the worlds fastest Street Supra from Titan. Level III race cylinder head with oversized valves (1mm), Titanium retainers, 9500 rpm valve springs. This is truly a HIGH RPM head and bottom end. Duplicating this motor would cost $18000 plus weeks of time, and this motor is ready for immediate shipment. Your good complete core (bad piston okay, but a good block is a must) is required in exchange. We will pay for shipping, you just crate it. A good complete core, means the entire engine from oil pan to camshafts (no turbo or fuel system).

Nothing has been held back on this motor, period.

This motor "retails" for...

$13,750 plus core.

You just add turbo and fuelsystem of your choice.


I bet I could build my own motor up for less.

OH...BTW...A Supra was never $60,000 new. I have a 93 and it was $43,600 new.

Bob

 

[turbosam6]

I'd love to see someone try to build a 1000 hp stage 2 for that price. I don't give a sh!t if you do it yourself, a similar stage 2 will cost more, not to mention be a pain in the arse to find all the parts for. Everyone likes what they like, I'd rather see a TR with a supra motor in it than a TR rotting in some dumb asses shed because its broke, or he's broke .

If I won the lottery, I'd do it and go to the nats and piss all you guys off. Buicks are great cars, thats why I own one, but theres other stuff out there, just as good and fast. I'd bet if someone did this swap, and it was greatly successful, alot of you guys would do it too. Don't knock someone because his brain was working while you were sleeping.

Seriously guys, if someone did this, I bet it would get more attention at the nats than most other cars. Don't you get tired of going to a Buick event and seeing 50 GN's, all exactly the same? I think its hilarious that so many guys ride C. Chows jock but bash this guy because he sees a different way to accomplish the same goal. How many times have you laughed at someone for saying something stupid about TR's because they don't know jack about them? Guess what? Now you guys sound like them. Talking about stuff you have no clue about.

 

[rtviper]

Turbosam I dont think you would piss too many people off cause you spent 13500. to put in a high hp supra motor just to get your butt handed to you by a regular gn. Just take the time to read the new national dragster that has all trhe race results form import racing. These are the legitimate times where they are on calibrated clocks with safty rules and class rules. The quickest times were in the low 8s with a couple of 7.9s from the equivalent to funny cars in the import models. Rado who had fogged supras since the early 90s has swithed to a quicker ride and is in the low 8s in his toyota celica rwd car.He is running right their with times like some street gns are running. I know you want too mention all these 6s and 7s the import mags write about but I guess they just dont want the fame that comes with an nhra title??Believe me if their is a kid with a gn in his garage he cant afford to get running the option of putting in a supra motor in his car just to drive it is laughable. This has turned into the kind of debate the car chatt room gets into every night. Seems like the import guys are like the 4 foot kid who talks about all the big kids he has beat up lately. Most of the stories are just that stories Their is a reason most of the 1000 hp supras run 10s and 9s and that wont change just because you put it into a gn.

 

[wiked87gn]

on the contrary times will change if you put a supra motor in a GN just by the weight transfer factor times will change, the reason why supras run those crappy times with that much horse power is because they can't put the power to the ground due to weight transfer and suspension, but if you put that 1,000hp motor in a GN it would be a different story cause the GN can transfer the weight and put the power down, therefore it will just be faster, use common sense dude.

 

[rtviper]

wicked that is great recomendation common sense. If you will remember even with the 1000 plus hp and ford 9 inch and powerglide and race only suspesion the supra was stuck in the 8 sec range for many years. The problem isnt just the suspension probs it is the way the motor puts out its power. The torque curve is not condusive to 1/4 mile racing. With the tires available for drag racing you can put the power to the ground in almost any application even fwd. With all that power and race car suspension and ford 9inch and high stall converter with a powerglide the supras were at 8.2 to 8.5 for about 2 years Where they are now I do not know as many of the racers have switched to other models in the toyota line

 

[Weazel]

Originally posted by salvageV6
go stand under a hose if you want to be cool by yourself.

That's genius!! I had to laugh.

And while I'm not one to shoot down new ideas, this one wouldn't be at the top of my list. There is just NO WAY you could make 1000 HP in a GN cheaper with a Supra motor than a Stage II motor. There are complete Stage II CARS going on here for $15k-$20k all the friggin' time. To dump $13.5k into the Supra motor, then buy a GN, then wrestle with the motor to get it into the GN engine bay, Christ, it just sounds silly to me. Of all the cars to swap a Supra motor into, why make it a heavy as hell car that already has a capable line of motors? Get an all-trac Celica and beef up the drivetrain or something. Damn, don't light this fire with the GN owners talkin' KRAZYtalk.
SURE it'd be fun driving a GN with a Supra motor. It'd be fun driving a Supra with a GN motor. It'd be fun driving a Metro with a blown Hemi, but who the hell in their right mind would go through the effort to do such a thing?? Nobody sane IMHO.

And for all you lottery winners that are gonna do this to piss us off, good luck. I suppose I'd waste some money too if I won the lottery.

PS I'm doing a 20B (3-rotor RX-7) swap into my original '70 Superbird this weekend if anybody wants to help.

 

[rtviper]

Weazel now their you go that is a much better idea put a gn 3.8 into that supra thats sitting in the garage cause the owner is too broke to fix it. Guys like Geno can get a stock block 3.8 into the 9s in a heavy Gn. With the Gn 3.8 you wont need 1000 hp to run 9s Best part is you wont have to wait untill you win the lottery to do it. Now all we need is someone with big enough gonads and a thick enough skin to bring this great idea up in the supra chatt rooms lmao. Maybe wicked who must be getting used to abuse will try it

 

[Taffy]

Originally posted by rtviper
Having a hand growing out of your forehead is also unique but not necessarily a desirable thing The response that others are assholes because they dont see any merit in bastardising a gn for no reason other then to be different is the typical response of the F and F groupies. Their just isnt any advantage to the swap but its your money to do with what you want. If you cant handle the opinions from those you ask then dont ask. Easy deal. Just remember many people did not get caught up in the F and F fairy tale so dont get upset if some of us look at the idea as foolish

I like how you refer to the Fast and the Furious. What movie would you blame if the FATF never came out? That movie is nothing more than a comedy.

It is not that we can not handle the opinions, it is just that people like you come here and tell us how much it costs to build a Toyota, and you have no clue as to how much it really costs.

I researched putting together a Stage II about 2 years ago by talking to a few people on this board, and since they already have Stage IIs on their cars, I consider what they say as good info. I also have a few friends that have built 2JZ and I compared the 2 prices. The Stage II will cost more at any level of performance.

I wanted to put a 2JZ in various other cars WAY before TFATF came out. This engine is not new to me in the least bit.

By the way, the Toyota engine that was in the Turbo Supras in the 80s was the 7MGTE. This engine was flogged heavily in the 80s. Supposedly HKS got their race car to run in the low 7s in the late 80s with htis engine, but this is all rumor as I have never seen any evidence of this. The 7MGTE is not even close to the same engine as the 2JZ.

As for the comment about people sitting on the Supra while staring at the Viper and the Vette, you obviously have never been to a car meet when all 3 of these cars are in attendance. Respect is given to all cars. Not just the slower Vettes and the Mopar Clown Shoes.

 

[Taffy]

Originally posted by rtviper
wicked I am not saying the v8 or v10 is a better option. I am just responding to the question do vettes have 6 7 8 or 1000 hp and yes they do.

And they do this with the stock internals??


Since F and F movies many kids think the supra motor is the second comming. Yes it is a very nice motor the factory built to handle a lot of power but is does not corner the market on hp.

Tell me which other factory engines , that were in mass produced cars, can put 900+ to the wheels relaibly without touching the short block?


A while back someone on the buick site had an 80s model camaro for sale with a low performance 454 with twin turbos that was runnning low 9s with low boost.

That is a soon coming project for an El Camino. Cept I want to use a 502 and see how far I can go with the stock crate engine!

 

[rtviper]

The supra guys just do not understand the the reason the car was priced out of existance was they made a race motor for this car. Yes it will handle 900 hp on stock internals as it was made for this purpose. You could get a 800 hp motor stock back in the 60s from the dealer also at a cost and it was made for racing too.They did not mass produce those cars as the market was a limited one.Their is a reason the 6 cyl supra was priced at 45k plus and it wasnt cause they could charge that amount . They had to charge that amount because of the motor they put together. Not wanting to flog a dead horse here but as the original thread asked what do we think of the idea. Well we dont think much of it. If one cant handle the answers he should not ask the question. After 2 years of hearing about all the fast high hp supras their are and how easy they are to modify I wonder why I have never seen a 9 10 or 11 sec car at the strip Either the mods are such a secret that none of the supra guys know about them here in the north west or they arent that easy to do. A point was made about buying a fast stage 2 car that is 8 sec capable for anywhere from 22k to 35k. I have seen these cars on the board. A similar supra with the hp to make such a run are about 40k to 80k. Are they just trying to make a bigger profit then the gn guys or do you think the selling price is a reflection of the investment?

 

[WhiteT78Supra]

rtviper,

The MKIV Supra was really not priced that badly for the performance on hand. In 1993 the Supra came out to compete with the ZR1 Corvette. The Supra bested the ZR1 in every test at the time and did so for about $15,000 less.

I have a friend that has more money into his ZR1 motor (415 Lingenfelter) than I have invested in my whole car. On motor he makes mid 500 rwhp. On the bottle he makes mid 700 rwhp. I hope to do so on turbo only.

Bob

 

[rtviper]

White not to get in your face here but what magazine were you reading that said the supra beat the zr1 in any test wtf?? The supra was .7 secs slower and the zr1 had some .9gs on the skid pad and I am confident the zr1 had a much higher mph?? so what test did the supra win?? Maybe passengers inside the vehicle? I hope you wont say the old hp per liter test lol

 

[rtviper]

White and by the way both the zr1 and the supra were priced badly which is one reason they are history