Tired of chasing 100 octane, want to go Alky

[Gnx6]

I have discovered in the California bay area a lot of stations that had 100 octane at the pump are not really 100 octane. I used to run 25 psi all day long but now it seems my car knocks when everything is good. Did some research and found out some of the stations had changed suppliers. Turns out the Motor octane of the local station (trick fuels) 100 is 92+, VP street blaze is 96 and the Sunoco is 95. I can run Sunoco or Streetblaze with no problems but they are around 7.50 per gallon and not close by. I know everybody raves about the Alky systems so I am wanting to look into it further.

How much boost can I run with Alky and super junk California 91 octane?

My current setup is 87 GN with 3.5 inch MAF and extender chip. Precision Front mount Intercooler and there is a Tial Blow Off Valve on the inlet pipe to the throttle body (10" away) and a TE-60 Turbo running 25 psi with a 3" Terry Houston downpipe and Torque Tech dual 3" exhaust with Ultra Flow Mufflers. 2800 stall 9/11 converter with a Built Trans. Racetronix pump, 60lb injectors and injector harness. Motor also has a power plate, adjustable regulator, yada yada. The rest probably doesn't matter... Will I be able to run 25 psi with Alky or will I be pushing my luck and better to keep it at 20? Love to hear some thoughts, thanks!

 

["Turbo-T"]

I'm going to go out on a limb to be safe and say with 91 octane, 20 would be ok.

I currently run 23 PSI on 92 octane with a Razor's alky kit. Only a few stations around here actually carry 92 octane.

Have you considered a Turbo Tweak chip?

 

[Gnx6]

I suppose this is a loaded question but what would be the benefits of running a Turbo Tweak chip versus an extender chip? I know Eric's chips are good and they make the car drive very well but don't want to be flying blind at high boost.

 

[XLR8]

I got alky because I was tired of buying 100UL for the street where I do 90% of my driving. I used to 22# on 100UL and am running 22# on 91 and alky. The fact that I live at 5400' and my track is at 5800' may have somehting to do with the boost that I can run.
I used alky at the track up to 23# and ran a 11.82 @ 115 on a fat set-up (still a lot of tuning to do) but am still a bit afraid of it and I may consider 116 the next time I go which gives me a very comfortable feeling

 

[Rodney87GN]

How much boost can I run with Alky and super junk California 91 octane?

I have run 28 psi numerous times with no knock on 91 octane and alky. But I normally run 25 psi on the street, again with no knock and crapola 91 octane....using a Turbotweak alky chip. I can't comment on the extender chips as I've never used them before.

Of course, many things depend on how much boost you can run besides octane alone...and still keep your motor in one piece.:biggrin:

So yes, alky is your friend!

 

[H2Ogbodies]

I have an idea for you to try...realizing detonation is a factor of intense combustion chamber heat creating hotspots in the form of unburnt hydro carbon molecules, how about adding a simple water mist injection to control it? Water mist will rapidly expand during combustion and will help eliminate carbon deposits and that will aid in boosting combustion efficiency while helping to reduce detonation. You can also utilize a covalizing agent in your gasoline itself to help break the fuels covalent bonds making them shorter thereby making the fuel burn much easier and slightly more rapidly. My work centers around water fuel technologies but invariably, there are a lot of crossover techniques that everybody can utilize. An easy way to add a water mist injection is to get a 6" diameter PVC pipe trap section about 6" tall with (2) screw on caps. Tap a hole on the bottom for a drain plug, tap a hole in the top for a 90 degree brass barbed fitting say, 3/8 pipe thread size and drill a 7/16 hole in the top also for a hollow 5/16 stainless steel tube that needs to extend down into the container about an inch from the bottom. Add stainless mesh in the bottom of the container and re-route your PCV hose to the stainless tube and the other barbed fitting routes a hose back to your original PCV port. Fill the container approx. 3/4 with water and you're done. When excessive blow-by gasses escape into the tube, the gasses bubble up to the surface releasing water mist, heavy oils get trapped in the mesh and engien vacuum draw the water mist into the intake trac. Instantly you'll notice a smoother idle, cleaner emissions, and a boost in power. Also, it will help control detonation. This is a simple way to go-I like to use stainless fittings, clear tubing, a sight-tube for viewing water level, a water level indicator sensor, etc. You can get really creative. I now use an insulated stainless steel tube I designed in CAD and rolled/tig welded myself but I started with a PVC mock-up. This was a first step in my progression to my water fuel cell which is in production right now. It's my experience that detonation is more of a chemical anomoly that can be totally eliminated through electrolysis but for a simple mod, the PVC 'scrubber" works well and best of all, you can get all the parts at Home Depot for under $40.

 

[boostingbuick]

The pcv system will not inject a water mist under boost. This is were alky is injected, and helps control knock.

 

[Razor]

I have an idea for you to try...realizing detonation is a factor of intense combustion chamber heat creating hotspots in the form of unburnt hydro carbon molecules, how about adding a simple water mist injection to control it? Water mist will rapidly expand during combustion and will help eliminate carbon deposits and that will aid in boosting combustion efficiency while helping to reduce detonation. You can also utilize a covalizing agent in your gasoline itself to help break the fuels covalent bonds making them shorter thereby making the fuel burn much easier and slightly more rapidly. My work centers around water fuel technologies but invariably, there are a lot of crossover techniques that everybody can utilize. An easy way to add a water mist injection is to get a 6" diameter PVC pipe trap section about 6" tall with (2) screw on caps. Tap a hole on the bottom for a drain plug, tap a hole in the top for a 90 degree brass barbed fitting say, 3/8 pipe thread size and drill a 7/16 hole in the top also for a hollow 5/16 stainless steel tube that needs to extend down into the container about an inch from the bottom. Add stainless mesh in the bottom of the container and re-route your PCV hose to the stainless tube and the other barbed fitting routes a hose back to your original PCV port. Fill the container approx. 3/4 with water and you're done. When excessive blow-by gasses escape into the tube, the gasses bubble up to the surface releasing water mist, heavy oils get trapped in the mesh and engien vacuum draw the water mist into the intake trac. Instantly you'll notice a smoother idle, cleaner emissions, and a boost in power. Also, it will help control detonation. This is a simple way to go-I like to use stainless fittings, clear tubing, a sight-tube for viewing water level, a water level indicator sensor, etc. You can get really creative. I now use an insulated stainless steel tube I designed in CAD and rolled/tig welded myself but I started with a PVC mock-up. This was a first step in my progression to my water fuel cell which is in production right now. It's my experience that detonation is more of a chemical anomoly that can be totally eliminated through electrolysis but for a simple mod, the PVC 'scrubber" works well and best of all, you can get all the parts at Home Depot for under $40.

This is not going to happen on a turbo charged application especially under boost. Water can be used to control detonation, in this section we rather use something a little more aggressive like methanol alcohol shot into the engine under a high pressure pump/nozzle setup. Works wonders, you should try it sometime.

You are not going to get 30 PSI boost on 93 octane fuel with a water mist setup.

 

[Roc87]

28psi on 91 octane, see sig

 

[daily driver]

Outside air temp will matter too. Don't know what the avg daytime temp is in SF bay where you are but 70F outside is a whole different thing than 90 F outside when it comes to how much timing and boost you can run with a certain octane. Get a progressive system also so you can start to spray some alky in pretty quick (anywhere from 6-10 psi I think for most people)and then be at max spray prior to your max boost level. There are many choices on which "alky" too, so check up on that. I use Methanol.

 

[Razor]

Outside air temp will matter too. Don't know what the avg daytime temp is in SF bay where you are but 70F outside is a whole different thing than 90 F outside when it comes to how much timing and boost you can run with a certain octane. Get a progressive system also so you can start to spray some alky in pretty quick (anywhere from 6-10 psi I think for most people)and then be at max spray prior to your max boost level. There are many choices on which "alky" too, so check up on that. I use Methanol.

Why would you want to spray max prior to your max boost level? Lets say max boost set is 23 PSI, and for whatever reason your boost goes to 28 PSI by accident, shouldnt the system have headroom to compensate for that?

Like 100 PSI liquid pressure at 23 PSI and 150 PSI liquid pressure at 28 PSI?

 

[La8agn]

Razor's alcohol kit was the best product/kit that I've installed on my car. I usually run between 23 and 25 lbs of boost, it just depends on the tempertures here in Texas, without adjusting my boost controller on a cooler day the boost will be about 25lbs and on a hot day (90-100+) it will be about 23......I have no knock!!!! I only use methanol, about $4.00/gal at the race tracks around here. Why gamble with other alcohol elixiers if you want to run high boost.....Not here! Buy Razor's kit and you will never look back actually you will be asking yourself "Why did I what so long".... Performance wise I started running 13's now I'm running 11's (11.44 last time at a 1/4 track with 1/8 mile time 7.25, since than I've improved the 1/8 time to 7.08....once I take care of the boost creep I will be back to the 1/4 track). I need to add that, I use super unleaded 92/93 around here. Also make sure to get a alcohol dedicated chip, there's no since screwing around without one unless you like picking up parts....

 

[daily driver]

I know Razor is an expert but if I don't hit max spray within or at my max boost then am I not short changing myself most or all of the time? I get the same 2-3 psi range as the other TX guy that posted above and it is due to outside air temp. I guess I have never had to worry about an overboost situation.

 

[Razor]

You can control this by increasing the nozzle size's' so you can deliver greater volume at a lower pressure. This way you always leave headroom on the system.

Never good to max out any sensor or system. Sometimes we have to becuase of system shortcomings like the MAF on the Buick which stops reading at 255. And why Extenders where made to address this problem.

 

[imjoesnuffy]

Day 1: Ordered Julio's Alkycontrol kit
Day 3: Recieved and installed Alkycontrol kit
Day 4: Went to the track, did a little tuning, 28 psi on 93 octane, trap speed of 122 mph Just 1 mph off my best ever, this was in mid 80s heat.