120 LBS and stock fuel or stock modified fuel lines

[marleyskater420]

Hey guys got some fuel pressure data....

I'm going to say NO. The stock lines aren't going to do the job supporting 120's.

I'm seeing fuel pressure regulation issues when the 2nd pump is running. The expected pressure is 66psi with the 120's running around 60% duty, and it can achieve 66psi, but I'm also seeing spikes to 72psi. Looks like the return line is too restrictive and it's making the regulator bounce.

Your fittings are also restrictive. Look at those 90deg. elbows on the back of your rails. You probably have 2-3psi in restriction just from your fittings.


FatGnat- Jegs ProFlo 200 series hose is rated to worth with e-85. its cheaper than teflon by a long shot.

 

[BEATAV8]

Your fittings are also restrictive. Look at those 90deg. elbows on the back of your rails. You probably have 2-3psi in restriction just from your fittings.

those are -8 fittings on the back of the rail

 

[turbo6x2]

I run 120 pound injectors and stock lines but I also run two pumps. If going into the 9's I would start to seriously think about upgrading the lines. Also from my home work, if you really want to run E85 on an intercooled motor I'd go 160's and have some room to work with. I have had great luck other then you must really monitor the E85 closely. It breaks down really fast especially in humid conditions, cold weather and in non sealed containers. I would highly recommend a quick fuel technology E85 test kit and test your fuel often. Within one month we had our e85 go from e85 to e88 and one can tested e90, if you don't tune for this it will cause lean conditions and bad stuff unless you run fast with a flex fuel sensor then you will be safe. I'm still waiting for Big Stuff to add the flex fuel sensor capability for Buicks so I will have this available. Maybe some day.....

 

[Pronto]

KevinB, a few questions on your fuel system. First, what is special about this fuel regulator? I've only seen 2 aftermarket ones that fit on the stock fuel rail, the Billet style ones and Accufab. Is it a different one than those? You mention turning the fuel filter around as you are using the orginal feed line as a return line now. What are you using as a fuel filter with that Weldon pump? I'm starting to get curious about E85 since it may be available around here soon.

 

[KevinB]

I have 2 in tank 307's not a Weldon. My old car had a Weldon on it for some time. I turned the stock filter around because it is now the return. For the feed I bought a filter from jegs. Its their brand. Comes with a 10 micron paper filter but they make a a 40 micron stainless steel replacement element. That's what I bought for it. It is about 12 inches long, anodized, and has -10 fittings. I think it was about $80 Including the ss element. Says its rated for 1000+ hp and can be used with all alcohol. No problems so far. Unfortunately I went back to race gas for the bg race. I was borrowing the 160s and had to give them back. I truly miss how fast e85 spools up. As soon as I find a deal on some 160s, I will be back.

 

[marleyskater420]

I have 2 in tank 307's not a Weldon. My old car had a Weldon on it for some time. I turned the stock filter around because it is now the return. For the feed I bought a filter from jegs. Its their brand. Comes with a 10 micron paper filter but they make a a 40 micron stainless steel replacement element. That's what I bought for it. It is about 12 inches long, anodized, and has -10 fittings. I think it was about $80 Including the ss element. Says its rated for 1000+ hp and can be used with all alcohol. No problems so far. Unfortunately I went back to race gas for the bg race. I was borrowing the 160s and had to give them back. I truly miss how fast e85 spools up. As soon as I find a deal on some 160s, I will be back.

dude 160's go for 25-400 on yellowbullet all day long. theres a company selling 8 160's for 500$ right now...

 

[KevinB]

dude 160's go for 25-400 on yellowbullet all day long. theres a company selling 8 160's for 500$ right now...

I've seen them...should have said when I got money to spend on them lol. Wasn't expecting to drop $500+ on the rearend this week.

 

[Turbo-Archie]

Stupid question but can't the WB correct the change in E85 to E88?


..

 

[daves87gn]

Hey guys got some fuel pressure data....

I'm going to say NO. The stock lines aren't going to do the job supporting 120's.

I'm seeing fuel pressure regulation issues when the 2nd pump is running. The expected pressure is 66psi with the 120's running around 60% duty, and it can achieve 66psi, but I'm also seeing spikes to 72psi. Looks like the return line is too restrictive and it's making the regulator bounce.

I wonder if you do the mod's like people have done to the return when they run the DW pump if it would help the spike you see when the second pump comes on?

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/e8...patible-fuel-pump-dw300-january-2011-a-4.html

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/ge...-pressure-high-fix-look-here.html#post2740776

 

[BEATAV8]

Here's some screens shots....

Unstable fuel pressure. 120's with double pumper and stock lines. Easy to see where the 2nd pump kicks in around 7-10psi.

Nice clean fuel pressure. 80's with a Deatschwerks pump and stock lines. (yes it runs that much boost -- all the time!)

 

[Hot Air]

Can you get away with it? Maybe. Would I do it, absolutely not! Run new (larger) fuel supply and return lines and be smart!! Of course, this is just my opinion! Why take a chance?
Conrad

 

[TurboBuick86]

120's is possible. I have 120's with accufab regulator , stock rail with - 8 feed. Gabby and myself haven't brought out this combination to the track yet with all the crappy weather lately. I ran before a 6.60 1/8th at 23 psi with 84 lbers and walbro in tank and old style Bosch inline. And we could of pushed that setup a bit further but we decided it was time to do the upgrade. Gabbys confident with the setup so far, especially since the boost is so low, even like that we feel the car is no slouch.

 

[BEATAV8]

I think this is the fitting for the regulator outlet.....

I'm going to order one and see if it fits.
Link:
ACCEL 74748B - ACCEL Fuel Rail Fittings - Overview - SummitRacing.com

 

[BEATAV8]

I'm seeing some better results after increasing the injector duty a bit. Maybe the stock lines will work out after all.

With injector duty in the high 70% range the fuel pressure has cleaned up considerably!

Regardless, I'm still looking to upgrade the fuel lines before next season.

120lb X 75% = 90lb/hr of fuel through a stock 3/8" supply line. So far.....

 

[marleyskater420]

I think this is the fitting for the regulator outlet.....

I'm going to order one and see if it fits.
Link:
ACCEL 74748B - ACCEL Fuel Rail Fittings - Overview - SummitRacing.com

I have a fuel rail we just put in a regular -6 male-male union and it works just fine. We took out the shrader valve on the pass side and ran a -4 into it so the rails were dual fed, albeit 1 side had -6 and the other -4, but -4 is better than nothing!

 

[BEATAV8]

The Accel fitting fits perfect. Correct thread and I can feel the O-ring engage.

It was a bit pricey but it's nice.

 

[Ttype6]

I was having some issues at 127 mph with the stock lines.

Were your stock lines modified to get rid of the bottlenecks created at the four O ring couplings in the feed line?

 

[Pronto]

Think I might go with something like this at the fuel rail 4606-06-S08-16-S | MALE JIC X MALE METRIC DUAL PURPOSE ADAPTOR and a dowty seal. No loss of flow through that dumb Saginaw fitting.

 

[dynoman]

Rats...I'm an e85 covert and running in tank dual pumps through stock lines and rail feeding 120's as well with DC at 90%. Where is everyone finding teflon/e85 friendly lines?

I'm getting my SS lines from siliconeintakes.com , a friend just bought some from there and he likes it, check it out they have lots of goodies there. Sam

 

[MNwe4]

Here's some screens shots....

Unstable fuel pressure. 120's with double pumper and stock lines. Easy to see where the 2nd pump kicks in around 7-10psi.

Nice clean fuel pressure. 80's with a Deatschwerks pump and stock lines. (yes it runs that much boost -- all the time!)

Were those logs on E85 or race gas and what size turbo?