The Numbers Game with the (SPI) Trunk ID Label - Kirban

[Dennis Kirban]

kirban 2 cents worth

On above responses having no tilt is very unusual. I remember the first one I bought to resell kept wanting to make it tilt. My guess is original owner probably did not splurge for delay wipers or cruise either?

A shame compared to current crop of American cars they really did offer a lot of options for our cars back in the 1980s. I am thinking about the 2004-2006 GTOs that offered very few options.

So, on the plus side, we all have a chance of having a unique car because of so many different combinations that original owners picked when they purchase their car new.

Personally I would have checked the block that said " Yes, I want a high quality paint job applied by happy workers!"

Even the guy who laid down the chip guard seemed to have problems keeping a constant flow with the gun or whatever method they used back then.

kirbanperformance.com


denniskirban@yahoo.com

owned a more than a few over the years

 

[turbo39151]

Well, since we're talking about options... What about Cars with the Astroroof and Power seat option. I have been told these were low production due to some error. With both the power seat and the astroroof option you loose a lot of head room. I'm not very tall and I needed to remove the power seat and swap it for manual just to have some headroom.

Can anyone elaborate on if this is fact or myth?

 

[Just a Six??]

Well, since we're talking about options... What about Cars with the Astroroof and Power seat option. I have been told these were low production due to some error. With both the power seat and the astroroof option you loose a lot of head room. I'm not very tall and I needed to remove the power seat and swap it for manual just to have some headroom.

Can anyone elaborate on if this is fact or myth?

The build sheet for my Canadian 87 LTD has Both to be installed but they wouldnt install the Power Seats due to just the reason you stated of headroom. I added one on each side myself.

 

[Dennis Kirban]

kirban 2 cents worth

Pertaining to question above. Same holds true for a T-Top car with power seat. Has to due with a weight issue and meeting epa gas mpg requirements from what I recall. Same reason Buick introduced the liteweight WE4 in the fall of 1987.

They even promoted the WE4 as being faster than a GN, but by doing so allowed them to crank out more GNs which made them more profit.

Those cars exist probably in small numbers T-Tops with power seat and astroroof with power seat. Its like seeing one with chrome fixed mirrors. Not an every day occurance.

You would be surprised at how heavy that astroroof assembly is. Its all about weight.

(Side note: Just look at the initial info on the recent rash of plane crashes!)

They obviousily used lite weight materials for the bucket seat tracks one reason many break over the years. Plus the fact low end torque pushing you back in the seat. Plus the fact not every Turbo driver tips the scales at 100 lbs. GM even had the same problem in the C5 Corvettes.

I had to replace the seat track in my C5 as it was busted when I bought it with just 38,000 miles on it.

Keep in mind none of us were present when the cars were built. Quirks happened, screw ups happen. I remember a customer who bought his GN new had the chip guard down one side of the car and not the other. Never noticed it for several months. Another guy bought his GN new console was all one color. Obviousily that is not on the window sticker and most people now would say you changed the console rather than believe it as being true.

kirbanperformance.com

denniskirban@yahoo.com


good questions, glad to see the interest.

 

[TurboDave]

kirban 2 cents worth

like I said before my 87 it has 13 rows and I was unsure as I thought other years number of rows varied. Yours probably has the clear lamination over the trunk ID label also.

Having 92 codes is a high number....your car was pretty costly when it was new. My guess probably $18,300 or $18,500 retail.

kirbanperformance.com

denniskirban@yahoo.com

Good to see so much imput....owned a few over the years some even had the factory paint look the same on both sides of the car!

Upon further checking you were almost dead on! I checked my window sticker and the bottom line was $18,8xx.xx

 

[TurboBob]

kirban 2 cents worth

Pertaining to question above. Same holds true for a T-Top car with power seat. Has to due with a weight issue and meeting epa gas mpg requirements from what I recall. Same reason Buick introduced the liteweight WE4 in the fall of 1987.

They even promoted the WE4 as being faster than a GN, but by doing so allowed them to crank out more GNs which made them more profit.

Those cars exist probably in small numbers T-Tops with power seat and astroroof with power seat. Its like seeing one with chrome fixed mirrors. Not an every day occurance.

You would be surprised at how heavy that astroroof assembly is. Its all about weight.

(Side note: Just look at the initial info on the recent rash of plane crashes!)

They obviousily used lite weight materials for the bucket seat tracks one reason many break over the years. Plus the fact low end torque pushing you back in the seat. Plus the fact not every Turbo driver tips the scales at 100 lbs. GM even had the same problem in the C5 Corvettes.

I had to replace the seat track in my C5 as it was busted when I bought it with just 38,000 miles on it.

Keep in mind none of us were present when the cars were built. Quirks happened, screw ups happen. I remember a customer who bought his GN new had the chip guard down one side of the car and not the other. Never noticed it for several months. Another guy bought his GN new console was all one color. Obviousily that is not on the window sticker and most people now would say you changed the console rather than believe it as being true.

kirbanperformance.com

denniskirban@yahoo.com


good questions, glad to see the interest.

I had a friend with a late 87 car. The Gas Gauge plate had PRNDL, but it was a console shift car so there was no pointer. We always figured it was due to the plant running the parts stock to zero or something.

Bob

 

[strikeeagle]

To Dennis' point, there were only 4 choices on our 06 GTO:

exterior color - choice of 7
interior color - choice of 3, depending on exterior color
transmission - choice of 2
wheels/tires - choice of 2

Of the above, only 2 are what I'll call "extra cost options" - manual transmission and 18" wheels/tires.

Even so, there are a host of RPOs - obviously, not all RPOs are associated with options, and the same is true of our TRs.

There are advantages and disadvantages to cars coming limited to options. GTOs are loaded and that's fine with me. There weren't many options on our 06 TBSS either, and that's fine as well. For that matter, there were limited choices with extended build GNs, but it didn't prevent them from selling.

 

[86 TR]

Here's mine. It's a 1986 Regal T-type with 45/45 tan leather, column shift, Dark Blue Metallic, power antenna, windows, locks, drivers seat, etc ,etc . I counted 81 codes.

 

[turbofish38]

Mr Eric you seem to be a tad bit upset over something I posted as being entertaining and fun to see how many codes people that are on this forum have on their trunk ID labels. I am not here to figure out what codes specifically on the label are specific for options versus codes that are standard on the label. You having worked in the GM system are more in tune with that end of it and that is fine.

Than why start a thread like this at all. Upset? No. Maybe a little perturbed. Sounds like you are upset over my suggestion of building the perfect SPID label. Personally I don't like threads like these. Along with the original owners threads, whose owned a GNX thread,etc,etc. Threads like these do take the fun out of owning these cars. You've just established a class structure based on how many or how little codes you have. If you haven't noticed I'm the self appointed police on weeding out the BS over here. If you post a fact than also point out the source. I don't know how many times I've read "Kirban says this,Kirban says that". None of us have a pipeline of information from Buick or GM, that I know of. Lets do some fact checking before hitting the enter key from now on,is all I was asking. Now opinions are always welcomed.

Since when do you care about codes on SPID labels? I have a stack of really old newsletters from you. IIRC you wouldn't give the time of day to a TR if it had digital dash or T-tops.

Here's my SPID label. 91 codes. Guess what's missing. Complete with faded tape. 1986 GN. Built 2nd week of Feb,86. I'm the second owner. Bought it with 6,000 miles in the fall of 87. IIRC I paid $12K and let the other schmuck take the hit on depreciation. It now has 278K on it. I don't care what it's worth or how many codes or how fast it isn't or whether I should sell it and if Heather Locklear digs guys with blond hair and who use their GN as a DD.

 

[JOHNDEEREGN]

Than why start a thread like this at all. Upset? No. Maybe a little perturbed. Sounds like you are upset over my suggestion of building the perfect SPID label. Personally I don't like threads like these. Along with the original owners threads, whose owned a GNX thread,etc,etc. Threads like these do take the fun out of owning these cars. You've just established a class structure based on how many or how little codes you have. If you haven't noticed I'm the self appointed police on weeding out the BS over here. If you post a fact than also point out the source. I don't know how many times I've read "Kirban says this,Kirban says that". None of us have a pipeline of information from Buick or GM, that I know of. Lets do some fact checking before hitting the enter key from now on,is all I was asking. Now opinions are always welcomed.

Since when do you care about codes on SPID labels? I have a stack of really old newsletters from you. IIRC you wouldn't give the time of day to a TR if it had digital dash or T-tops.

Here's my SPID label. 91 codes. Guess what's missing. Complete with faded tape. 1986 GN. Built 2nd week of Feb,86. I'm the second owner. Bought it with 6,000 miles in the fall of 87. IIRC I paid $12K and let the other schmuck take the hit on depreciation. It now has 278K on it. I don't care what it's worth or how many codes or how fast it isn't or whether I should sell it and if Heather Locklear digs guys with blond hair and who use their GN as a DD.

Mr Fisher, get off your high horse. You are not the only guy in the know in the Turbo Community.

I don't know how many times I see you get so pissy when somebody posts something they happen to know about these cars.

It is almost like you take a personal agenda to prove people wrong or make anybody and everybody look inferior to Mr Eric Fisher...

I am sorry I am just tired of your rants and raves.

No doubt you are very knowledgable about these cars but so are a lot of other people in this community! You do not have to try and prove everybody wrong.

If it makes you feel better then so bet it but in a lot of people's eyes you look like.......

If you do not like threads like these then don't read them,,, go start your own forum....

I figured I had better clean up my post...... or I would probably be banned for life......

 

[strikeeagle]

I'll probably regret posting this, but personally, I think there's room for both "styles", if I may, storyteller and perfectionist.

I think both Dennis and Eric bring a lot to the TR community.

Dennis' contribution to the TR community is admirable. To begin, look at all the parts he's taken on that would *never* have been available to the TR enthusiast, excepting for the fact he cared?

And Eric, I for one would love to see a complete list of RPOs as they pertain to TRs, and if I can help in any way on that score I'd be pleased. Such a list would be an enormously important reference for our community, now and in the future.

 

[usetaboost]

I don't see a problem with a thread like this. It obviously isn't a competition with rpo's, its more like show and tell. 1, who cares who has the most or least options? Who cares who has the rarest car? What is wrong with this turning into a discussion and sharing how different some of our cars are? You guys don't think I would like tilt steering

Yes Mr. Kirban, My we4 does not have cruise or delay wipers. But it does have rear defrost and power windows. Has a few other small items can't remember though. It does have tinted windshield and license plate bracket. There isn't much else. I might count my rpos next time I go to the garage, but I'm sure its over 60

 

[turbojay]

Looks like I've got 87 of them on my 87 GN. Looks like I've got one of the somewhat rare GNs with factory astroroof(CF5) and power seat(WG1).

 

[KevinB]

Somebody replaced the trunk lid on my '87 T, so I can't play

 

[wile87]

like i said before mine is gone to but her are thye options it is obvious it has, dig dash, twilight sent, pwr ant, concert snd, fact anti theft. fact chip grd, posi rear.

 

[Polecat]

As a new guy I think this link is an excellent source of information. I have 90 codes and my 87 GN I believe is well optioned, but I don't have the t-tops or astro-roof. I don't believe the car was made in Canada but was probably an export to Canada. I tried to find, with no success, if one of the codes was an export code. Not to sure what the extra codes would be for a Canadian car but possibly, rear defrost, heavy duty battery and the block heater. I purchased my car from an estate sale of the original owner and unfortunately the only paperwork or known history was an independant appraisal that had been perfomed in 2007.

 

[KevinB]

like i said before mine is gone to but her are thye options it is obvious it has, dig dash, twilight sent, pwr ant, concert snd, fact anti theft. fact chip grd, posi rear.

It's hard to tell what mine had. It's had a rough life. From what I do know, it had:
Original 3.8 turbo
Concert Sound
Rear defrost
power wins and locks
non-power antenna
Hard top
and one of the windows has an alarm warning on it that looks like it's from the factory?? Not sure on that one.


That's about all I know. A buddy had it for a short time before me. When he got it, it had a BBC in it, half ass cage, racing buckets, half ass custom dash, and so on.
Now the car is back to a turbo 6, Analog dash, GN interior, 10pt cage, a/c delete, 9" and so on.

 

[Dennis Kirban]

kirban 2 cents worth

Unfortunately, I don't know how to click on previous comments to give answers to specific people above so my answers will run together if I can't view them in any quick order because of work and travel plans.

I will try and take them in order so here goes:

The owner above with the 1986 with tan leather seats. He really has a rare one. The seats are 45/45 with what I call the funky half style center console. Those seats would appear as an option the following year in the Turbo Limited models in either tan or grey leather. GM kind of cut corners the top surfaces were leather and the sides I believe were a matching vinyl. If you have my book Kirbans Guide to 1986 and 1987 Buick Turbo Regals

What will make your day is in my book I have the exact production count for those tan leather pillow seats in a 1986 T-Type Regal. Just 55 in tan were built. Now add 23 years later and you can see the chances of seeing many today is extremely rare.

I personally had one out of 317 cars. So you got a rare example, a very rare example. I was very fortunate back when I wrote my Guide Book that I had a deep connection in Flint that had access to a lot of records and an interest like I have for these cars. Course he and the records and most of what owners seek is long gone.

On a side note 124 grey leather pillow seats was produced that year in the 1986 T-Type Regal.

Interesting enough those cars still retained the regular style door panels. My guess is if I did not put that in my book or you have not seen it in print anywhere most Turbo owners would say hey why did you put those seats in your blue T-Type?

The owner above hitting 87 codes with a 1987 GN is kind of neat plus having the astroroof option and power seat. Wonder if you are lucky enough to have the manila envelope with the hand crank and directions to manually crank the roof closed should power fail.

Speaking about a manila envelope, the front license plate bracket came in a manila envelope and over the years on some of the cars I have had I found it still in the envelope in the trunk. Our cars for the states that require them a front plate isn't bad, but many of the newer cars today specifically any C6 Corvette and any 04-06 GTO that you gotta put a front plate on looks terrible.

Keep the comments coming I appreciate all the personal emails. I will refrain from the above negative one as I made my point early on and will let that end at that point.

kirbanperformance.com


denniskirban@yahoo.com

Bringing a few ideas to the table hopefully useful info

 

[asto-t]

Dennis, My gray t with the astro-roof and cornering lights only has 70 on the options list. I would of thought well option,but looking at the rest not...What is the rarest option on a regal

 

[rmar]

If they start and run is getting to be a rarity in it self.....:biggrin: Is there a code for that because I believe some cars did not come with that option........:biggrin: