1st time tuner-help

[Martin U]

Hi all
I have been working out some kinks on my car and now I have some numbers for you to take a peekand and offer me some help on learning the correct way to tune
iac=0
lv8=52#
tps=.51volts...moved after setting?
02volts=598Mv
Mass air=11g/s
o2xcnt=30#
integrator=128
Block learn=115
mat=80.6
rpm=1150-this does not match my autometer tach. off by about 300rpm
this was taken with tlink
fp=44#
I just replaced a leaking intake gasket and fixed a couple exhaustleaks.
I have made some 18# runs and show no knock on either tlink or caspers gauge. I'm not sure if I trust the tlink just yet, it keeps cutting off when I hit it?? Cable does seem looser than I would like them....screw in connector would be a noce touch.
Anyway thanks for giving me a hand. This car should have pretty good potential I would think.
Mart Urbanski

 

[Dwayne]

I see that your tps is a little high....try setting it at .42 with the car off, usually when you start the car back up it will move to .44.......another I see is the iac is a little low, most people try to keep it between 10 and 20, although some cars like them lower than others....Concerning your o2 volts, was this with the car idling or was this what you saw at wide open throttle ? Your o2 volts at idle dosn't mean much, you need to get to the top of 3rd gear, wide open throttle and in closed loop to get a good reading.....good luck to you .

 

[BRAD_PADGETT]

Take a look at the post" Tuning the Akly Kit" by Razor under the Alky board. It will get you started. Brad

 

[Martin U]

Well the tps did move to those numbers after it was started. and everything was at idle. I guess I'm at a loss at to what controls what. I've tried resetting the IAC a number of times. I think I'm off the throttle plate now with the screw, so trying to lower idle any more is usless. The chip is a turbotweak.

 

[Martin U]

PS Do I believe the tach(the one I want to) or tlink for rpm?

 

[tenright]

ok first IAC is at 0..that means it's closed...adjust for between 20-25 that should put your idle around 800 or so...This will throw off your TPS which is off anyway. Turn the ign on engine off and set TPS to 42-44 you can try to get the WOT set but I have never been able to get mine past 4.5 and frankly I could care less, car runs fine and pulls like a son-of-a-bitch. BLM's are low, this means your car is running rich. If you are using the cheesy liquid filled gauge to set your FP thats probably why. My liquid filled gauge is completely unreliable. I use it as a cap since I don't have a shrader valve anymore but I set my FP with an "Auto-meter" gauge. The difference between the 2 gauges is about 5 PSI. I set my auto meter for 42 and the liquid gauge reads 36...if I set for the liquid gauge for 42 I run low BLM about 116...so I know the autometer is correct since when I set for 42 with it I get 128 exactly. MAF is off to should be down around 6-8 grams might have a bad MAF...

Basically you are running rich, that is why you have no knock at 18# boost, you should see knock around 16 or 17. The car will also run a bit ruff, and if you really get on it might even backfire..thats always fun. I would lean it out till the BLM's come up to 120 or better...

 

[Martin U]

Now I'm getting somewhere! When i have tried to adjust the IAC, I was more concerned about getting the idle down. I do have the throttle plate screw backed off so much I doubt its even touching anymore.
So it's OK to let the idle come up to let the IAC start working,am I starting to think along the right lines ? The FP gauge I have is from Caspers about 1.5 dia. smallish,non-filled. I set it at 44# as per the Turbo tweak instructions.
What do you think I should go by for my RPM? Tlink looks closer to the stock dash panel tach, but the Autometer tach sounds closer to the true RPM????
Did I read that hotairs like LESS fp,somehow that is rolling around up in this dead air space between my ears!
I will say this thing is getting closer,miss is gone,lopey at cold start-up,but when warm runs lots better than when I started and if it keeps getting better...WOW
I do want to say thank you again, I know it must get boring when the same questions keep getting asked over and over, My problem is my mind needs to know how and why things are doing what they are.( I can't just drill a hole, I need to know why I'm doing it. diemaker in me)
What do the MAF # mean, I'm getting to much air?? I do have all the incoming air path opened up as much as possiable...almost
Mart

 

[cool 84]

If the throttle plate is closed and the IAC is at 0 and the idle is still high, you have a problem. I like to have my IAC near 0 when the car is fully warm because it seems to work best with the intercooler. Trust the T-link rpm, the stock tachs are usually off.

 

[tenright]

No you should not worry to much about idle if your IAC is at 0...the idle will more then likely come down as you get your settings right, set the IAC and the TPS then worry about idle if it's still a problem. FP can vairy depending on the car, some like 44 or 45 with the vacuume line off..some like it much lower I have seen some say they're car runs best at 38 vacuume line off. Personally mine runs at 42....Brads we set to 44..depends on the car. The idea with FP is to get the best performance with the least amount of fuel, because as I always say, the leaner the meaner. But be careful because the lower the FP the more likely you are to get knock.

I mention the MAF because you are running 11 grams that is too high. If you have an after market or rebuilt MAF it's probably bad. You will go through 10 of the rebuilt MAF's and be lucky to find 1 that works...the translator and LS1 MAF is almost a manditory conversion for us at this point.


T

 

[Martin U]

RE:x6

Ya, I got a problem allright I did the iac reset at least ten times tonight,no help at all, I opened the thottle plate, using the screw and tried to disregard idle. Reset iac, tps and then watched the iac counts start hight running down to 0??? The tach I am using is a autometer! Rechecked for leaks,none. the only reaction I ever got was spraying directly into filter just to see if that would burp the idle...it did. reset ECM nada.
I did take it out just to try and get some numbers. I turned FP down to 38# and did see 2.0 knock. blms stayed at 128 I did notice that MAF was pegged at 255, it is orginal eqip. Shifted early also
If I can't get the IAC correct what are the effects, damage I'm risking?
The damn thing runs great ??????????????????????????????
I just found a new frame
RPM=4225
TPS=4.43
MAF=255
02=770
xcnts=0
lv8=255
int=128
blm=128
RTD=10.2
esc=146
IAC=99
Which means what----------I do understand the knock value

 

[cool 84]

No you should not worry to much about idle if your IAC is at 0...the idle will more then likely come down as you get your settings right, set the IAC and the TPS then worry about idle if it's still a problem. FP can vairy depending on the car, some like 44 or 45 with the vacuume line off..some like it much lower I have seen some say they're car runs best at 38 vacuume line off. Personally mine runs at 42....Brads we set to 44..depends on the car. The idea with FP is to get the best performance with the least amount of fuel, because as I always say, the leaner the meaner. But be careful because the lower the FP the more likely you are to get knock.

I mention the MAF because you are running 11 grams that is too high. If you have an after market or rebuilt MAF it's probably bad. You will go through 10 of the rebuilt MAF's and be lucky to find 1 that works...the translator and LS1 MAF is almost a manditory conversion for us at this point.

T

If the throttle plate is closed all the way and the IAC is at 0 there is a problem. The IAC at 0 is not a problem by itself but if the throttle plate is completely shut he has no control of his idle. It should not idle period with it set that way but instead it has a high idle. Tell me how the idle will come down if everything is already adjusted as low as it can possibly go. The IAC could be bad or he could have a vacuum leak.

If the idle is high and the MAF is reading high, the car is obviously taking in too much air. I doubt the MAF is bad. A bad MAF will not make the car idle too high even if it reads too high.

You might want to make sure the TB is closing all the way. Mine used to stick just above idle.

 

[tenright]

The reason I sugested the MAF might be bad is it was at 11 grams, should be at 6-8 grams...those #'s can't be acurate at idle, you have your tps at 4 volts thats wide open....it should be .42-.44...ignition on engine off.

IAC at 99????? set it to 20-25...It may very well be bad...but setting it correctly and still having a problem will be the tell tale sign of that. If it is bleeding down to 0...replace or reset it..any adjustment to the IAC will effect the TPS...it's a balencing act to get it right...

Vacuume leak with 128 blm??? doubt it..your BLM's would be very high if not maxed at 150 with INT's pushing it higher, low BLM means a rich condition, high BLM's is a lean condition, and usually an indication of a vacuume leak. Your BLM's were low set to 44 PSI on the FP. Now at 38 your BLM's are 128..excellent but you get 2 degrees on KR..so tweak it up a bit till the knock is gone.

Also I will tell you how his idle can be high with the IAC at 0..the car will compansate for certain conditions...My IAC was low with my idle highwhen I set my IAC and TPS correctly it settled down to about 800 or 900 rpm... This is not to say the IAC isn't bad, it very well may be. But first get everything as close to nominal as you can before jumping into changing out stuff..




Also going from 44 to 38 is a big jump, you sould have stepped it down till the BLM's were at 128, although you seem to have accidentally arrived at 128. If your getting 2 degrees of knock at 38 with stock boost turn it up to 40...

look this is simple....don't jump to conclusions, adjust the settings, then your #'s will tell you whats wrong...small changes make huge differences...So don't sweat anything till you get your #'s right....If one of your #'s won't play replace it...if you can't get the IAC to stay set with all your other #'s correct then replace the IAC....


T

 

[tenright]

One more thing..if I read that correctly that frame is at WOT and you have 10+ degrees of knock...good advice? keep your foot out of it till your happy with your tune, and the #'s are correct...


T.

 

[cool 84]

128 blm is what most chips lock at @ WOT. It's a common feature. Also, common sense tells you that if the idle is high and the MAF reads 11, then probably it's taking extra air somewhere. IAC at 99 is normal for WOT. Also, how the hell can the car be compensating with the IAC at 0? The IAC is how the car compensates. If it's at 0, it's obviously not compensating for a low idle. You can change every adjustment on the car if that makes you happy but the IAC is the only thing that changes the idle. If it's at 0, it can only go up, not down. This is frustrating.

 

[tenright]

If it's at 0, it can only go up, not down. This is frustrating.

Yes it is...we are both saying the same thing, the IAC is probably his culpret. I just didn't want him to jump to that conclusion. When I first bought this car it idled high, around 1,500 rpm or so. The car was stumbling and the ECM was compensating. Using your logic the car would not idle at all with the IAC set the way it is. Ok let me give you an example, lets say your fans kick on, the idle drops, (oh wait a minute..thats not possible right??? because it's set as low as it can get right??) the ECM compensates..If the car is not idling correctly (stumbling or missing) the ECM will compensate, the result....high idle. The IAC is what the ECM uses to compensate...so if it is compensating then the IAC is working yes???

Also look at the original #'s BLM 115...thats a rich condition....not enough air. set at 44# fp

Look I thought I was helping this guy...apparently I wasn't sorry for interfering I certainly didn't want to get into all this....



T

 

[Jerryl]

Mass air=11g/s
integrator=128
Block learn=115

Martin,
What is your location?

 

[tenright]

ok cool maybe I am just wording this wrong...lemme try to clearify what I am thinking....

My thought is the ECM is trying to compensate for the high idle, dropping the IAC to zero. So all I am saying is before you go replacing the IAC, figure out what is causing the high idle. Correcting all other #'s and still having this condition would definately indicate the IAC is bad...So again I fall back to the MAF reading 11 grams. Basically that is where I was heading...stuck throttle plate, bad MAF, something along those lines....

As for the vacuume leak you suggested, I just can't get on board with that if his original BLM's are 115....


T

 

[cool 84]

ok cool maybe I am just wording this wrong...lemme try to clearify what I am thinking....

My thought is the ECM is trying to compensate for the high idle, dropping the IAC to zero. So all I am saying is before you go replacing the IAC, figure out what is causing the high idle. Correcting all other #'s and still having this condition would definately indicate the IAC is bad...So again I fall back to the MAF reading 11 grams. Basically that is where I was heading...stuck throttle plate, bad MAF, something along those lines....

As for the vacuume leak you suggested, I just can't get on board with that if his original BLM's are 115....


T

I think we were saying the same thing.

 

[Martin U]

I'm in Grand Rapids Michigan
I didn't get a chance to get it out today Fathers day and all. But to watch this ongoing dialog is great, this is the kind of stuff I was hoping to find It helps me understand the whole workings of these systems. So that some day I can pass along what I am learning, Just to keep these things alive.
PS
Would the fact that the bore is +.030 ,bigger valves, gutted intake,1.65 rockers, have an effect on the amount of air it is taking IN so the MAF reads more air?

 

[tenright]

Many are using a similar set up...so I would hazard a guess and say no the MAF should still show 6-8 at idle...I can tell you this, my car had pretty severe idle issues when I bought it, after replacing the O2 and converting the MAF to the LS1 that all went away....Cool84's suggestion of a stuck throttle plate is also very common. If the plate is stuck open the ECM will never be able to bring the idle down. That would also account for the MAf reading high, so start there.....

Funny I just noticed you said your in Grand rapids...I will be in Lansing next week Monday to Thurs...not sure how close that is to you...but my days are pretty much free because when I am on the road I work nights..If it's not to far I would be willing to come take a look...



T