alchoholic nitrous junky seeks 12 step program

[national84]

I recently acquired a 25-225 horse adjustable wet system, and have ordered the SMC kit from the group purchase. My original intention was to use the alky to run higher boost on pump gas, but since I got the NOS things may be a little different. I would like to use alky as an additive, then crank the pump and spray @ 75 or so at the track or when a pesky Mustang rolls up. Any comments on this testosterone induced lunacy?

 

[bobc455]

Since it's a wet system, why not just inject alcohol as your enrichment for your N2O instead of gasoline?

-Bob Cunningham
bobc@gnttype.org

 

[NOSjohnWE4]

wet system

intriguing answer....has anyone done this yet ? inquiring minds want to know ! hahaa

 

[IRaceAV6]

That is my plan

Have a dual stage Compucar system and Steve's alky system.

Timing is everything with NOS, and alky could really assist with the additional octane requirement. How much? What rpm/boost setting to engage the system?

A winter project.

 

[bobc455]

Wet System

I haven't done it, *yet*. However I'm considering a few alternatives right now, because I've destroyed one too many pistons to want to deal with that any more. I talked with my nitrous company about injecting alcohol like the SMC system, and they are the ones that suggested using alcohol as the enrichment. They have worked with all combinations- gas engines using gas enrichment, gas engines using alcohol enrichment, alcohol engines using gas enrichment, etc.

As they explained it to me, using alcohol enrichment will a bit more forgiving than using gasoline enrichment- if you do run a bit lean or too much advance, you'll just slow down instead of blowing things up. However it is trickier to tune.

That approach is different that how IRaceAV6 described it, but I think either way would work.

The other thing I'm considering is to run pump gas, but have an additional fuel cell so that I can use race fuel as my N2O enrichment.

-Bob C.
bobc@gnttype.org

 

[NOSjohnWE4]

nitrous

BOB,
some good ideas. the only problem with running an external tank with some race gas for fuel enrichment is that you won't get a good mix of fuel. really, it depends upon the amount of spray you want to use. i've thought about using another tank but the cost of the tank, pump, lines and install doesn't equal the ease of just filling my regular tank with race gas. anything over a 150 shot NOS recommends GOOD fuel. a few examples of what the mix would be with pump & race gas:

1) gal.of pump gas: 5
pump gas octane: 94
gal. of ace gas: 5
race gas octane: 108
octane after mix: 101

2)) gal.of pump gas: 5
pump gas octane: 94
gal. of ace gas: 5
race gas octane: 116
octane after mix: 105

these are just examples but u can still see, it's VERY difficult to get a good mix of gas with an additional tank. it's not to say that people don't do it but if anyone plans on spraying with over 200hp of NOS (which i don't think many are going to do), then i wouldn't recommend it. i hope this helps. just my .02 cents.

VIGOR, who is on this board, has the OCTANE calculator which was VERY nice to download and for him to build for us. i recommend using it or just toying with it (there are some other nice utilities that come with it) ....it's FUN !

 

[bobc455]

Interesting point about the distribution.

At first, I'm just going to be useing a 150HP shot. In theory, I should be fine with pump gas only (not a turbo motor), so the fact that I'm adding race gas should be that much the better. If I do step up to 250HP (which I will do eventually), then I'll probably go for the mixing race fuel right into the gas tank (in addition to getting my enrichment fuel from a fuel cell). It's more expensive to lug around the extra fuel cell & hardware, but it's nice to always be prepared (if you know what I mean).

On the octane calculator thingy, isn't that just a weighted avegage between the two (or more) octane levels?

For running alcohol as enrichment, if memory serves you have to go about 10% bigger on the enrichment jet, like instead of a 70 jet you might have to use a 77 jet (or something like that, consult your nitrous system supplier to be sure!).

But back to national84's original question, if you run alcohol/water additive like the SMC kit, I'd be willing to bet that you'll wind up running a bit rich, and may have to lean out somewhere else (FI or N2O) just a bit to get better times. It'll take some tuning to get right, but since you're working with alcohol, you'll have some comfort area. Can you still read plugs the same way when you run alcohol?

So, national84, what are your thoughts?

-Bob Cunningham
bobc@gnttype.org

 

[national84]

Form what I'm told it is very difficult to get a good read on plugs with alky, the signs are not there like with gasoline.
I am not intending to use more than a 125 shot. I don't feel that I'll need it. The car will be tuned for low 11's and all I want is a 10 from time to time. (but then again don't we all.) I think what I'm going to do is start off with the 25 shot, and work my way up making adjustments as I go. All the while monitoring the 02's. I really believe that with the in car adjustability of the SMC kit, you could make adjustments on the spot. This should be the hot ticket versus the hassle of changing jets to make adjustments if you substitute the alky for the fuel enrichment. Besides, Iam looking at the fuel enrichment as a metered 7th injector that cancels out the ill effects of injecting the nitrous. The alchohol just adds a little extra insurance.
Of course this is all just theory, but I am willing to work on it until I get it right. Like I said before, the n2o is just going to be an occasional use, not an every pass occurrance. I think the key here is to get the chip burned to be used with the nitrous. And the problem with that is that I will be so sporatic with the n2o that there will be no time for chip changes. So, I will try it that way at first, but know I will end up with atranslator plus and extender for timing tunability.
With all of the on the fly adjustments I'll be making , Ill look like a mad scientist at the starting line. At least until i find the right settings for optimum performance.
Just my .02$

 

[mike]

Someone told me that you could get a blank thumbwheel chip from Caspers and get the equipment to burn it from BMScomputer and then have another shop burn the settings for the extender. This way you only need the one chip and can adjust it whenever you need it. I hope this is actually true because it's what I'm planning on doing.

 

[BOTLFED]

IT WORKS!

BOTLFED HERE!

The chip does really work i have all the different setting on one chip and i use it depending on the amount of hurt you wnat to spray on the comp.. its really nice wlikinshc and i take the care out do some directscan runs on it and tune in the chip for what we want the car to do the only thing is that once you get a taste of the more radical settings all the other ones are just boring who wants to keep the front wheels on the ground anyways. the sky is just so nice to look at sometimes. i think that cloud looks like a GNX! NO BUT REALLY IT WORK PRETTY GOOD.....GOOD LUCK!

 

[wilkinshc]

The thumbwheel is the way to go if running nitrous, just a click of the switch and you have your new settings (nitrous and no nitrous). As to having the patch added for the translater plus you really need to call ramchargers to see if they will add it to your chip once it is dialed in. The patch is so it will see the extra air (512 instead of 255). I also plan on adding alky on the gas side of the nitrous this winter so I would appreciate any info or experience anyone gets.


Chuck

 

[national84]

How difficult is the chip burning process? and about how much$$$ are we talking for hardware and software? I originally considered this, but was afraid of the programming end of it, so any help would be appreciated.