Any down side to Vacuum brakes?

[streetknight]

Just wondering. I'm looking for a car and ran across one I like, but it has been converted to vacuum. I don't know anything about this system on a TR. It just seemed to me if the check valve failed while under boost you could have a nasty problem.

But then again, didn't the TTA's come with this setup?

Thanks

 

[turbot2112]

no problems here. turbo tas come with the vacuum brake seyup. i switched over to vacuum after going trhough 3 powermasters. now i have better things to spend my money on.

 

[V6POWER]

If you race, you probably won't be able to build boost at the line. Other than that, vacuum works well.

 

[streetknight]

I would most definately be racing the car when I have the chance. My last one saw 25PSI on almost every pass with at least 13-15psi launches.

Thanks again

 

[V6POWER]

When my pm went out I converted to vacuum. I could not hold more than 2-3# boost while brake torqueing, even after adding S-10 wheel cylinders and two long/soft brake shoes per wheel. I have since converted back to pm unit so I could build boost while brake torqueing. Others say they can hold many pounds with vacuum brakes, but I never could.

 

[GNocide]

while many people, especially ones that sell vacuum brake kits call it an upgrade, its really not.

a vac system will not hold 600-700 psi of brake fluid reserve for you when you hit the pedal the first time.vac will be even slower to recover the second and third time you pump the brake.

its like getting rid of sequential fuel injection in favor of tune port injection because all other gm divisions did. funny how sequental is still around on ls1/ls6 cars today 17+ years after the fact.

every new high end car and truck today has a power assisted brake system-not vacuum.(toyota, lexus, benz, ect) in less then 10 years most all cars will have an assisted brake system.

vacuum sucked on old big and small block cars with cams, and it sucks today too.

 

[Turbo6inKY]

Originally posted by gnocide

every new high end car and truck today has a power assisted brake system-not vacuum.(toyota, lexus, benz, ect) in less then 10 years most all cars will have an assisted brake system.

And every one of those has 20 more years of development than the Powermaster, and also has replacement parts easily available.

Use the powermaster as long as it lasts, but when it breaks, it simply does not make economic sense to maintain it.

An entire vacuum replacement setup with pedal, booster, and master cylinder costs less than just that stupid pressure switch.

 

[GNocide]

and every one of those systems will be a techs worst nightmare to service.

the more things change the more they stay the same.

economic or not , understood or not, a good working powermaster system will outperform vacuum every time.

 

[streetknight]

But will this vacuum system be able to hold up to 15psi launches after I upgrade the wheel cyl. soft shoes, etc.

Thanks

 

[Turbo6inKY]

Originally posted by streetknight
But will this vacuum system be able to hold up to 15psi launches after I upgrade the wheel cyl. soft shoes, etc.

Thanks

Probably not. You need a transbrake.

 

[crispydworst]

about vacum breaks

I had t-type power master breaks, i had until the breaks falied and hit a pole. Even if power master breaks are more advanced or hold more boost on the line at least you alwasys know there when deer pops out of no where or some Foriegner in a hyandai cuts in front of you . and on top there not hassel

 

[Red Regal T]

I have sold many, many, vacuum brake kits. I sold the kit LookQuick has on his car. While LookQuick has had a problem with holding more than a couple pounds of boost, many guys have told him repeatedly on this board, in this forum, they have no problems holding 10 lbs of boost at the line, but his complaints just go on and on.

I have vacuum brakes on my car. They are very good in panic stops. TTAs also come with vacuum brakes after TRs were no longer manufactured. There are NO DOWNSIDES to vacuum brakes.

Personally, I'm not worried about holding 10 lbs of boost at the line, but if I was, I can assure you that I could achieve that setup. Your brake adjustments, pads, and shoes, must be set up properly. Probably the only reason new cars have complicated brake system is so they can get deeper into your pockets.

If you're so worried about holding 15 lbs of boost, go spend $1000 and let us know if that did the trick. It might not.

 

[GNocide]

Originally posted by Red Regal T Probably the only reason new cars have complicated brake system is so they can get deeper into your pockets. [/B]

come on man,cars companys could care less about getting into your pockets with a brake system or the compotitional threat you pose -they want to sell you a car


it has to do with evolving technology since stopping distances are getting better and shorter on cars today.ive noticed it more and more on cars like the caddy cts-v and about dozen more vehicles since this post has started.
remember its only complicated when you dont understand it.

 

[V6POWER]

Originally posted by Red Regal T
I have sold many, many, vacuum brake kits. I sold the kit LookQuick has on his car. While LookQuick has had a problem with holding more than a couple pounds of boost, many guys have told him repeatedly on this board, in this forum, they have no problems holding 10 lbs of boost at the line, but his complaints just go on and on.


Red Regal---I just stated that the vacuum brakes work fine, except that I had trouble holding boost at the line even though others may not. I don't think my input qualifies for your statement "but his complaints just go on and on."

 

[Red Regal T]

Originally posted by gnocide
come on man,cars companys could care less about getting into your pockets with a brake system or the compotitional threat you pose -they want to sell you a car


it has to do with evolving technology since stopping distances are getting better and shorter on cars today.ive noticed it more and more on cars like the caddy cts-v and about dozen more vehicles since this post has started.
remember its only complicated when you dont understand it.

I'll stick by what I said. I see plenty of cars in the junkyards like chevy Cavaliers and most other front drive cars, with trick, anti-lock brake systems............as though those 2500 lb cars couldn't stop just as well with vacuum brakes. Fix vacuum brakes for next to nothing instead of getting a repair bill for $1000 with your "technologically advanced" brakes.

Vacuum brakes were good enough for 50 years but suddenly we need all the bells and whistles. I don't think so.

 

[tonka]

Vacuum brakes here, 15 lbs on two(2) long shoes, not four....

 

[GNocide]

Originally posted by Red Regal T
I'll stick by what I said. I see plenty of cars in the junkyards like chevy Cavaliers and most other front drive cars, with trick, anti-lock brake systems............as though those 2500 lb cars couldn't stop just as well with vacuum brakes. Fix vacuum brakes for next to nothing instead of getting a repair bill for $1000 with your "technologically advanced" brakes.

Vacuum brakes were good enough for 50 years but suddenly we need all the bells and whistles. I don't think so.

ABS is NOT POWER assisted OR the same as!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(i find it hard to believe you sell anything with irrevelent crap you talk.)

Every high end new car and truck today will stop shorter and better than your vacuum brakes.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

1000 dollar this and repair bill that.
your scare tactics dont balance out here pal

if you and the rest of your followers cry over repair bills, this car aint for you .
go buy a honda or something else but watch out if its new, cause the brake system will probably not be a straight vacuum system.

 

[Red Regal T]

Hey pal...........high end late model, a GN is not. Why do we want to know about Cadillac brake systems or whatever else you're referring to. I think you got your "irrelevant crap" mixed up.

This forum is about TRs. I don't know what the hell you're talkin' about?

every new high end car and truck today has a power assisted brake system-not vacuum.(toyota, lexus, benz, ect) in less then 10 years most all cars will have an assisted brake system.

blah, blah, blah..........

After you install one of these high end brake systems on your TR, let us know how it all shakes out.

 

[TurboBuickSix]

JUST TO CLEAR UP A MYTH

There WAS NO POWERMASTER setup AVAILABLE for the TTA ever that would fit the firewall of an F-body,so GM had no other options BUT vacuum right??.I prefer the Powermaster by far and have had all systems at one time or another.Expensive but really simple once you dig into it.

 

[streetknight]

Well I wasn't trying to get everyone into a pissing match or anything. My particular application is that my car will be raced more than street driven. In fact it will probably only be driven to the drag strip and back. So holding 15psi on the line is very important to me as I'm trying to get the car to ET as fast as possible in my street class.

A TRANSBRAKE is out of the question cause my class rules won't allow it. The main concern I had with vacuum is that I was "told" that if I'm at the line building boost, for some reason I have to let off, I'm going to have to pump the pedal again which will make me roll forward and then I'll have to back up and stage again.

Thanks for the input