currently im running 12.2's on C16 but been really been thinking about an alcohol kit. i was wondering, does alcohol substitute C16 meaning i'll run the same times or would it make me a little faster or use both and be even faster? i was told you could run it with pump gas and like nitrous, just use it on demand. if someone could make it clear to me that would be great cause im really thinking about it. thanks.
C16 or alcohol
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Red Regal T
Senior Member
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In a nutshell, there's no reason not to have alcohol injection. It's cheap to use and install and without it, you have no choice but to run race fuel. Just check my thread on this page.....ALCOHOL INJECTION IS FOR YOU. 
12.2's on alky are no problem...its a different tune. Typically done on a lower timing chip and increasing the boost to make up for the timing difference.
You can be faster, but depends on a lot of things. Increasing the boost and not seeing knock retard will make you faster. How much boost depends on turbo, motor, etc..and how much alcohol your able to spray. So choose wisely your system and you wont run out of kit
Alcohol is a detonation suppressant. It eliminates knock when combined with 93. Its how it works in laymans terms. Its not NOS...
Do some reading on this forum, and ask your questions. You'll find your answers typically..
If I can help..hollar
Julio
You can be faster, but depends on a lot of things. Increasing the boost and not seeing knock retard will make you faster. How much boost depends on turbo, motor, etc..and how much alcohol your able to spray. So choose wisely your system and you wont run out of kit
Alcohol is a detonation suppressant. It eliminates knock when combined with 93. Its how it works in laymans terms. Its not NOS...
Do some reading on this forum, and ask your questions. You'll find your answers typically..
If I can help..hollar
Julio
Typically race gas is run with a race chip that has upwards of 26 degrees timing. That timing makes power.
Typically alcohol is run with a lower timing chip, the reduced power due to the lower timing has to be offset by increasing boost to get the car back where it was at. If the turbo can sustain the increased boost and charge air temps maintained where it doesnt detonate, then yes you can equal the performance.
My car is faster on alky than C16. Becuase of the stock IC. Whereas I cannot run the boost I do on C16 without detonation. Ive beat this horse many times over the last year, spent tons of race gas..back to square one, leave the alky kit alone and go fast.
Advantage to race gas is higher timing which typically produces better 330 foot at the track. As far as MPH pull on the top, alky is rite there with race gas. Controlling the alcohol as the car leaves and keeping it from detonating.. Running higher timing in 1st then bringing down timing in 2nd etc...helps overcome a lot of the performance lost. Takes a little work and tuning.
my .02
Typically alcohol is run with a lower timing chip, the reduced power due to the lower timing has to be offset by increasing boost to get the car back where it was at. If the turbo can sustain the increased boost and charge air temps maintained where it doesnt detonate, then yes you can equal the performance.
My car is faster on alky than C16. Becuase of the stock IC. Whereas I cannot run the boost I do on C16 without detonation. Ive beat this horse many times over the last year, spent tons of race gas..back to square one, leave the alky kit alone and go fast.
Advantage to race gas is higher timing which typically produces better 330 foot at the track. As far as MPH pull on the top, alky is rite there with race gas. Controlling the alcohol as the car leaves and keeping it from detonating.. Running higher timing in 1st then bringing down timing in 2nd etc...helps overcome a lot of the performance lost. Takes a little work and tuning.
my .02
sorry if my question wasent clear but stevemon hit it. i know its not NOS but when you engauge it, is it a toggle/push button/in the TPS or all? it still sounds good to get but still one thing i sorta dont get, THE TIMMING, is that in the different chips that i would have to get (chips controlling the timming?) or by the cam sensor? thanks again guys
salvageV6
Daily Driver
- Joined
- May 25, 2001
- Messages
- 20,965
You may need an alky. chip burnt, maybe not.
What timing is in your race chip now?
It's controlled by boost pressure and you set it to come on about 10 psi.
Some people do run race chips with alky. at a few pounds lower boost than with good race gas.
Depends on the car and chips.
I prefer 100 octane type chips with alky. and raise the boost up a bit.
That translates to about 21*-23* timing in the chip at WOT.
What timing is in your race chip now?
It's controlled by boost pressure and you set it to come on about 10 psi.
Some people do run race chips with alky. at a few pounds lower boost than with good race gas.
Depends on the car and chips.
I prefer 100 octane type chips with alky. and raise the boost up a bit.
That translates to about 21*-23* timing in the chip at WOT.
My systems work with the MAP(manifold air pressure) sensor to activate the alcohol. I have a progressive kit that as the boost increases so does the rate of pressure the pump puts out. low boost low pressure, high boost high pressure.
Timing depends on a lot of factors. Some cars like higher timing than others. You start with a low timing chip and get the car making power without knock. Once your at the boost level your comfortable with, and no knock..you then get another "chip" that has more timing than you currently have and see if the car doesnt detonate with increased timing.
You can vary your timing also by having a translator plus.
There is no perfect chip for your car year round. You can get great performance from a lot of the aftermarket street chips.
I dont recommend someone start playing with alcohol with a chip higher than 19-20 degrees total.. get a hang for tuning it, then increase the timing. Its a lot less frustrating.
Lastly, leave your cam sensor alone. All is does is syncronize injector 1 firing when you start your car. Its not a chevy
As the Razor-Man says, it is too good not to use, but the tuning is not trivial and takes a lot of trial and error, depending on how well you want the car to run.
I think it is more difficult to dial it in with that huge Shurflo pump than SMCs external pump which you can pretty much run wide open with a hobbs switch/relay and the right size nozzles.
Also I have found there is a significant charge cooling effect that is almost like an intercooler itself. I've just started running it on my nonintercooled Turboed/Nitroused GTO that runs a mixture of race/pump gas and I found the charge temperature coming out of the turbo dropped from 300* to 200* once the ALky started going and I'm not using very much. I'm sucking thru a Holley so I've had to lean out the secondaries a lot and now the car is totally dependent on the stuff, so it's one more thing I have to be sure doesn't fail.
I think it is more difficult to dial it in with that huge Shurflo pump than SMCs external pump which you can pretty much run wide open with a hobbs switch/relay and the right size nozzles.
Also I have found there is a significant charge cooling effect that is almost like an intercooler itself. I've just started running it on my nonintercooled Turboed/Nitroused GTO that runs a mixture of race/pump gas and I found the charge temperature coming out of the turbo dropped from 300* to 200* once the ALky started going and I'm not using very much. I'm sucking thru a Holley so I've had to lean out the secondaries a lot and now the car is totally dependent on the stuff, so it's one more thing I have to be sure doesn't fail.
