Diff between ser l and ll

[only"T"intown]

I finally got by to look at my 96 sc engine from the regal. How do you tell if it is a series l or series ll without the cover that says it? Mine is missing this cover obviously.

 

[deanh8]

I finally got by to look at my 96 sc engine from the regal. How do you tell if it is a series l or series ll without the cover that says it? Mine is missing this cover obviously.

if you know the cars, you can just tell. For one the supercharger is alot smaller, and the whole motor looks different. I will try to find some pics for you to compare.

 

[deanh8]

M62 (Series I Supercharger):
http://www.corvettejunk.com/PartImages/dcp_1325.jpg

M90 Gen 3 (Series II Supercharger):
http://www.corvettejunk.com/PartImages/dcp_1297.jpg

M90 Gen 5 (Series III Supercharger):
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v347/DavesGTP/GenVShawn.jpg

 

[only"T"intown]

Thanks deanh8. That settles it, I have a series ll. OK I have a question. How much difference is there between this long block to that of a 3800 in a Camaro of the same year? I'm guessing the sc block should be stronger but will they interchange? If so, what would be the harm in swapping them out and turbocharging it in the camaro? I'm just curious.

 

[deanh8]

Thanks deanh8. That settles it, I have a series ll. OK I have a question. How much difference is there between this long block to that of a 3800 in a Camaro of the same year? I'm guessing the sc block should be stronger but will they interchange? If so, what would be the harm in swapping them out and turbocharging it in the camaro? I'm just curious.

1997.5+ Have the series II, if you have a 1996 then its a series I.

The Non-Supercharged 3.8 Series II in the regal's and gp's is the same block (L36) as the camaro.

The difference in the L67 and the L36 (supercharged and non-sc series II) is pretty small. They are basicaly the same, but has little changes like throttle body, compression ratio, intake manifold and little stuff mainly on the top end of the motor. So those would be the only differences I would think between the camaro and the supercharged series II. Besides tranny and all that other stuff.

 

[only"T"intown]

deanh8,
So what you are saying is; that my 96 series ll block and heads (long block) is the same as the long block of a 97.5 or newer 3800 n/a in the camaro. The intake and assories from the camaro should bolt up to the sc long block. In this case if it is strong enough to stand up to the sc then it should support a turbo with no problem in the camaro. If that is the case then with some fuel management tweaks(stronger fuel pump and larger injectors) and a performance chip (I assume they make them for the 3800 camaro) what would stop the 3800 from reaching over 400 hp with an ic turbo set up?

 

[Brad Zeidler]

Camaro 3800

Okay, the series II was first begun towards the end of the 95 model year in the F-body. Comp. ratios in the n/a 3800's is I believe 9.5 to 1, and the sc 3800's are 8.5 to 1 done via different pistons that also have a thermal barrier coating on the top and utilize full floating piston pins. The heads on the L67 also have the injector bosses machined into the heads, not the intakemanifold. This was to make the room necessary for the M90's width. If you're wodering what some people have done with the stock 3800 go to firebirdv6.com.

 

[kshef]

what would stop the 3800 from reaching over 400 hp with an ic turbo set up?

nothing....just a little $$

 

[only"T"intown]

Looks like the crank would have to be thicker or stronger in the sc engine. Isn't that one of the differences in a na 3.8 and a 3.8 from a grand national?

 

[JasonGS]

Yes, the Series II did start in 95 in some models. I'm almost positive the Regal had it in 96. Therefore, if it is SC, you have the L67.

And as far as I know, the cranks are identical between the L67 and L36 (N/A) engines.

As for the Camaro, why not just turbo the L36 that's in there (assuming that's the engine that it has)?

 

[only"T"intown]

Yes, the Series II did start in 95 in some models. I'm almost positive the Regal had it in 96. Therefore, if it is SC, you have the L67.

And as far as I know, the cranks are identical between the L67 and L36 (N/A) engines.

As for the Camaro, why not just turbo the L36 that's in there (assuming that's the engine that it has)?

If they are exactly the same I guess that would be the way to go. How about a sc Camaro?

 

[henschman]

sounds like an awesome idea. Most grand prix's and regals with turbos are easily in the 12s, and with rwd it would be even better. The l67 longblock would be able to stand up to a little more boost than the l32 due to forged pistons/rods and lower compression, so if you have the block anyway you might as well use it in the firebird. I would probably use the n/a manifold and heads on the l67 block so you don't have to worry about the fuel injector thing. Some turbo gtp's use a gutted supercharger casing, but why waste the charger if you already have the n/a manifold and everything? While its out, you oughta put a decent cam in there so you can run even more boost. It's much easier to do with the engine out, and it would really increase your performance. Good luck on the project.

 

[CTX-SLPR]

You have L32 and L67 backwards. An L32 is a Series III Supercharged motor with coldforged powdered metal rods and hypereutectic pistons, an L67 is a series II supercharged motor with cast rods and pistons. The reason why you don't use the NA intake on a L36 is because its composite and will burst if you stuff too much booste into it. While I don't know the limits the ticket is the Series III NA L26 motor with its cast Aluminum intake. There is a guy on the RegalGS.org board who sometimes haunts here with an L36 block, L32 rotating assembly and custom pistons using L36 heads and an L26 intake. I hope if I screwed that up he'll correct me but the differences are minor between the different motors.

Hope this helps you out,

 

[only"T"intown]

Over my head!!

 

[CTX-SLPR]

Over my head!!

pick it apart and ask specific questions. I can answer most of them if you ask.

 

[BillyRValentine]

pick it apart and ask specific questions. I can answer most of them if you ask.

only"T"intown, I hope you will forgive me for hi-jacking your thread but I have some questions for this gent. I bought a 3800 motor and (auto)tranny out of a 1997 Firedird. I am assuming that it is the L36 motor; is this correct? I am in the process of rebuilding it now and fabricating a turbo kit for it to go in a 48 Chevy. My questions are these -

I noticed that it has crossbolt mains and that the crank appears to be a faily stout piece. What are the reasonable limits on the block, crank and rods in relation to HP/TQ?

The bottom section of the intake is composite. As such what is a reasonable limit on the CFM or manifold pressure that they will withstand? Is there a better peice out there to replace it with should it not be up to par?

Are there any pitfalls that you are aware of that I should be on the lookout for while I have it apart? Items such as lifters, oiling issues, valve train; etc.

Thank you in advance for any and all help you may provide.

Jim C.

 

[CTX-SLPR]

You have an L36 Naturally Aspirated 3800 Series II V6. You are right the mains are cross bolted. Think of it as V6 LS1 though the Series II predates the LS1 by 2 years. The composite intake won't take a whole lot of booste before bursting, probably only about 10psi though I don't know the actual limit. The hot peice is an early F-body 3800 Al peice or the new L26 Al one. They can be hard to find though. I do believe they are coming out with a metal one from the aftermarket. Its a stouter peice than the older 3.8 engines, heads flow much better too. Timing chain is known to go south sometimes, not much else that I've run into as a trouble spot on the motor. Love the improvements they made to the motor between the old LC2 and the modern L36 and L26.