GN1 irons vs. 8445

[justabuickv6]

Are the GN1 irons a 8445 casting but only ported and polished? Or is it a whole different head?

I'm ready to purchase but don't know if I want GN1 irons or just a really nice set of 8445's.

I know that there are individuals running 10's on 8445's however, if you car is running 11.50's on ported and polished 8445, I'm sure the GN1 irons would be better.

Will the GN1 irons flow better out of the box compared to ported and polished 8445?

 

[musclecar neal]

The Champion's are 8445's. I have set. They have larger stainless valves,CNC ported and polished runners and chambers They are very nicely done. For the money they are very nice. They don't flow as much as a max ported set but will flow more than enough for a 109 based combo.

Hope that helps

Neal

 

[aperrego]

Originally posted by musclecar neal
T. They don't flow as much as a max ported set but will flow more than enough for a 109 based combo.

Neal

Dumb question neal who's max that you are referring to?

 

[aperrego]

Originally posted by musclecar neal
T. They don't flow as much as a max ported set but will flow more than enough for a 109 based combo.

Neal

Dumb question neal who's max that you are referring to?

 

[CopGn]

GN1 out the box will out flow any ported 8445 irons. Champion makes both but you can get your irons ported from a lot of head shops. GN1 are also aluminum letting you run more boost but people have reported problems with the GN1 and I have never heard of a complaint about a set of ported irons. Irons will take you to low 10 no problem with all the supporting items.

Go HERE for more info.

 

[Snorman]

GN1 out the box will out flow any ported 8445 irons.

Sure about that?
I have a set of ported 8445's that flow 227/184cfm.
The GN1's definitely have more potential.
S.

 

[justabuickv6]

I appreciate the info. As you just stated, GN1's will out flow any ported 8445. I understand this but are you talking about GN1 aluminum or iron?

 

[justabuickv6]

I think I have answered my own question. GN1 is aluminum and CNC is the 8445.

Any 8445 that's been opened up, i.e. larger valves, ported and polished should be equal to the CNC Champions right?

 

[frankg]

Not any 8445's but a set done by a good porter will outperform the Champion CNC irons. Champions Irons flow 205cfm hand porters can get close to 230cfm intake. I do a set like that for $1000 that's $200 less than Champion. Frank

 

[CopGn]

With 1.9 intake 1.6 exhaust valves and being able to run more boost because they are aluminum I don't see any 109 block making more power with any 8445 Iron head. Educate me if I am wrong though.

 

[azgn]

I guess the point would be, a good set of ported irons will make enough power to blow up a 109.......it might make a bigger boom with GN1's.........

 

[CopGn]

I agree with Woody. My opinion you don't need GN1 unless you want to run a 9.

 

[laz]

I guess a good head porter should do our iron champion heads they only flow 199@450 lift intake and 175@550 lift exhaust but there good for 9.64@141.18. Flowbenches have different flow numbers in different places but champion iron heads are hard to beat and very consistent. I think champions irons offer a good return on investment also . Try and sell a set of heads done by your local shop and see what there worth down the road .

 

[J Banning]

Originally posted by laz
I guess a good head porter should do our iron champion heads they only flow 199@450 lift intake and 175@550 lift exhaust but there good for 9.64@141.18. Flowbenches have different flow numbers in different places but champion iron heads are hard to beat and very consistent. I think champions irons offer a good return on investment also . Try and sell a set of heads done by your local shop and see what there worth down the road .

Good point.

 

[frankg]

I think he was confused in the first thread, confusing the GN1 and CNC irons. We all know the GN1 that is alum. is better than an 8445, but i think he wants to compare CNC Irons and regular ported Irons. Correct me if i'm wrong. It's not always about resale what about the performance NOW!! Not a few $$$ later when maybe i sell them. They only get more $$ resale because people are confused and don't know they are not the best 8445 iron head you can get for the $$$. I rather get some quicker ET's than a few $$ back 10 yrs from now, if you dont want the best out of your $$$ just stick with stock unported and dont loose any equity down the road!! Frank

 

[justabuickv6]

Thanks frankg. You are correct.

Thanks to you also laz

 

[musclecar neal]

Champion was calling both the irons ( 8445's) and aluminums GN1's. That is what gets confusing. All thier Buick products get the GN1 trademark. I personally like the irons over anything else for a 109 combo. Like was said earlier they will make more than enough power to break a 109 in time. I also like the port to port consistancy (sp) that the CNC porting offers. I have professionally ported all type of heads, intakes and 2 strokes for 20+ years and have done 100's of hours of flow bench work. Each bench is different, each operator is different. You can put a lame set on a bench and show figures that look like those heads are magic, the next operator could retest them on the same bench and get a much different result. You can use port entry fixtures to smooth out the intake flow, you can use clay to make a radius too. You can use pipe with different length, size and bends on the exhaust to show many flow numbers. Only back to back testing on the SAME bench with the SAME operator with the SAME testing set up can truly compare heads flow numbers. Using quoted numbers from porters or manufacturers will get you in the butt everytime. Just like dyno numbers , they are not all the same. When was the last time we raced on a dyno or a flow bench? It is what the head does on the engine combo that counts.

Neal

 

[AsphaltAnihil8r]

Originally posted by CopGn
I agree with Woody. My opinion you don't need GN1 unless you want to run a 9.

OR want to run,10's without all the risk... kaboom

 

[UNGN]

Re: POWER PLATE

Originally posted by mcponch
NEAL SINCE YOU HAVE DONE WORK ON THE BENCH. MAYBE YOU COULD ANSWER THIS?? WITH THE AMOUNT OF AIR BEING FORCED DONE THE TURBO-V-6 INTAKE. HOW COULD A POWER PLATE BE OF ANY BENEFIT? IT WOULD SEEM TO ME YOU WOULD HAVE AIR STACKED UP WAITING TOO RAM DOWN EACH RUNNER? WITH MORE THAN ENOUGH AIR FOR EACH RUNNER. WOULD THERE NOT; IN FACT, BE ENOUGH AIR STACKED THAT ALL RUNNERS WOULD GET ALL THE AIR THEY NEEDED AND THEN SOME? THANK YOU .MCPONCH.

The power plate appears to work due to the vortex effect of air being forced through a sharp sided opening. This is the same effect that creates a smoke ring.

The power plate basically fires a vortex ring down the intake runner. This wouldn't be an effecicient way to make HP in a normally aspirated engine, but in a turbocharged engine, the extra boost pressure required to make it work is very small.

You have to remember that the definition of boost is air stacked up waiting to be rammed down a runner. Slightly more is stacked up above the plate and the rolling vortex that would be caused by the plate helps to direct in down the runners.

 

[musclecar neal]

I must say that the explaination by UNGN is outstanding.

Last year we built a unit simlar to what Jason used to develop the Power Plate. We wanted to see flow dynamics in the stock lower intake with and without the PP. A good friend is an engineer for Pratt&Whittney so we used thier develoment lab for around 60 hours doing testing. We used the stock intake as a baseline and made about 30 interations with the PP for a precision plenum and other plates we made along with mods to the plelum that we wanted to try based on naturally aspirated theories. It really surpirsed us when the PP equipped set up yeilded the most consistant runner to runner readings except for 3 set ups we built with a highly modded lower with no plate.

We found out just what Jason found out. If you let the air in the lower go where it wants to you will have major flow imbalance from runner to runner. With the plate "pointing the discharge" where it does it evens things out in the lower intake considerably.

I for one thnk Jason did a great job on it. He must have sepnt tons of time figuring it out.

Hope this is logical

Neal