It Worked!!

[jacksorroche]

Just wanted everybody to know that I have finished converting a lot of the electrical system to the 86/87 style.
I first got the coil pack and module converted with the caspers plug and play adapter. I then converted the ECM and installed the electric fan and the MAT sensor. All instructions were pretty straight forward and easy to follow. On the electric fan, I went with the electric fan out of a Fiero. It was cheap, and the blades are bigger than the fan out of the 86/87, which means more air is pushed. Best thing, is that the fan slipped right in using the same mounting holes as the 86/87 fan. I did have a hard time finding the brackets to use, I ended up using the radiator brackets from the 86/87. Even they are hard to find.

I used the stock 86/87 chip in the ECM when I started the engine to test it. I got the "Service Enging" light for about a minute and then it went out. The next day I took the car for a drive. I had noticed that the car, which had been running rich with the stock 84/85 ECM, didn't seem to be running rich anymore. I am currently using the stock fuel regulator with Green Strip injectors, and still using the stock 84/85 MAF. The car started great, revved great, and ran great. No "Service" lights ever came on.

Next I am going to replace the Radiator. I have heard that the Radiator for the 91 Camaro RS is the best to use, it is bigger and it will slip right in.

I want to thank everybody on this site for helping me with this project. Without this site, I probibly would have given up long ago. I give you all my most humble and sincere THANKS.

 

[Turbo Riviera]

Hands down, the ECM upgrade IMO is one of the best upgrades to make to a hot air. I think that even the minor improvement in computer technology from '84 to '87 makes a big difference with these cars.

For some reason, it seems to take away *most* of the driveability problems that the hot airs have.

 

[TType84]

i have an aluminum radiator out of an 88 trans am GTA..... works perfect with a diesel cutlass radiator hold down plate.....

 

[esinger]

Great going, so did you notice any improvement in performance after switching to the electric fan? I'm going to do the conversion in a couple of weeks myself, I bought a RC fan and waiting for the Racetronix fan harness to arrive. So you didn't change out the MAF, I have an 87 MAF, but I'll try using my 85 MAF first.

 

[6SENSE]

There are two different fans that came on the Fiero. The one that came on [most] of the V6 cars is the same as what came on the 86/87 TRs and is the one of choice. It is supposed to be stronger than the other. I have had and looked at both. The 86/87 type definately seems more heavyduty.
Best and most affordable radiator upgrade I have ever done is the Aluminum Camaro Rad. Lots of info through doing a search in this forum or the General Tech. Hold down was also used on .307 V8 Buick, Olds... Its the same hold down that is used on the 86/87 TRs without the small brackets welded on from the factory for electric fan.

Also, recently my 87 MAF that I had on my daily driver '84 started causing the car to hiccup. I threw on one of my 84 MAFs. Car runs great with it. Always had high BLM issues (and KR easily) with the 87MAF which I blamed on header leaks. BLMs are now lower (120's) with the 84 MAF which is great. However this may be because the 84 MAF is making the A/F richer[??] so beware. Guess I will find out for sure when I weld the headers up.

 

[jacksorroche]

Actually I since I had changed so many things before starting and testing the car, it was hard to tell which particular part contributed most to the improved performance. It was more than likely a contribution from all parts. I have heard that the 86/87 coil pack and module produce a stronger spark than the 84/85's. Turbo Riviera mentioned that improvements in computer technology could have been a factor. I have no doubt of that as well, and of course, the fan did help also.


Although I didn't get any error lights using my 84 MAF, I have heard of some people getting the error light when using their's. Next up on the plate is to install the Translator with the LT1 MAF, and get a chip from Casper's. After that, performance rebuild on the engine and the transmission. This should take the whole summer saving the funds for it.

 

[jacksorroche]

6SENSE
That is some great info that you just provided. I am going to have to copy and paste your post to a text file for future referance.
Good point on the Fiero fans, now that I think about it, I don't know if my fan came out of the 4 or 6 cylinder. I am going to have to check into that. Thanks again.

 

[Turbo Riviera]

I can tell you that I picked up ET with an electric fan... Mostly in the 60 foot. about 2 tenths in the 60 foot time. After that the clutch fan would have likely shut off anyway, so not alot in the MPH area. But for ease of maintenance, the electric is definitely the way to go. Alot easier to work on the motor without the big shroud in the way.

Be prepared for people to ask you "where the other two cylinders went?" since there will be a big gap... LOL

 

[FWD turbo]

I find this post most interesting. It has always been my understanding that if you upgraded to the 86/87 ECM with out also using the 86/87 MAF that you would have driveability issues. But you are saying it solved some even though you kept the 84/85 MAF? Could someone please help clarify my understanding of this issue please? I was wanting to do this, but I thought I needed to wait until I had the LT1 maf and translator as well. If it works fine with the 84/85 MAF what's the issue?

Also, I guess I thought that using the 86/87 ECM would cause it to run rich? Even with an 86/87 ECM? Aren't all the fuel tables completely different on the intercooled ECM?

Can somebody help me out here? I would really appreciate some more information.

 

[jacksorroche]

FWD turbo
Unfortunately I don't have any easy answers for you. I have noticed that every TR will have its own characteristics. That being said, my car had always run rich, and I couldn't figure it out. Now, with all the changes, it runs so much better. I was also waiting for my LT1 and Translator to come in so I could change out my MAF. However I was too anxious to try everything out. My best advice is to try it yourself and see what gives and post the results. Sorry I couldn't be anymore help.

 

[Turbo Riviera]

Mine have never worked well with just using the '84 maf. I've always had to convert to the later maf. But people have said that theirs works well with the early maf. I'm going to have to sit on the fence with jack on this one. Try it out, but be prepared to upgrade the MAF if it doesn't work well.

Still hands down one of the best hot air mods to make.

 

[cool 84]

The 84 and 87 MAFs are calibrated differently. With the 84 MAF and 87 computer, the car will run rich.

 

[FWD turbo]

Thanks for the info guys. I will be pulling the car out of its winter hibernation in the barn in 3-4 weeks. When we custom made the harness for my car, we ran the wires for the MAT sesnor just in case I wanted to upgrade to the 86/87 ECM sometime in the future. So swapping to the 86/87 ECM is a quick process in my car. We did have it running with one in it once, however it was before the car was finished so I didn't drive it with that ECM. I will try swapping in an 86/87 when I get the car out and let you know what happens.

Turbo Riv, did you have to get a custon chip burnt to get it to run right with the 86/87 ECM on a hot air? Or did it work OK with the stock 86/87 ECM and MAF?

 

[FWD turbo]

Originally posted by cool 84
The 84 and 87 MAFs are calibrated differently. With the 84 MAF and 87 computer, the car will run rich.

Thanks cool. That's kinda what I thought. If you use the 86/87 ECM and MAF, are the fuel tables etc considerably different so that you need a custom chip to get it to run properly on a non intercooled car? Or will it run fine on a stock 86/87 ECM and MAF?

 

[Turbo Riviera]

I didn't have a stock '87 chip at hand when I swapped, but I used a Red Armstrong 108 chip for stock injectors and '87 combo and it's what is still in the car today. I don't think there is a huge difference. The computer still meters the air the mass air sees and adds the proper amount of fuel and spark. You might be able to fine tune it to the hot air combo, but i doubt it's worth the effort. Mine seems to do well with it.

 

[FWD turbo]

Thanks for the info guys. I will slap one in there when I pull the car out in April and let you know what happens.