Just for the Anti Nitrous Guys

[galoush]

For Those who are always sayin " Youll Blow your motor on Nitrous " Ive run the hell out of the car again tonight with the 100 shot 30psi(CPT65) and C16 tonight . 20 deg Turbotweak chip . Still running fine . It seems alot of these headgasket problems are with the high timming chips but thats another topic. There is no rymme or reason to these cars sometimes all i know is the car enjoys the bottle very much .

 

[broke1]

Was this on the strret or the track???If at the times please

 

[galoush]

Do a search for full details on times and what not in this forum . my last track outing was on the 4th of July . Tonight was street use .

 

[galoush]

last track time was 4th of July 90+temps, high 11 @ 117 with 100shot 20 deg chip 27psi and no launch ( Auburn is dead )12;00s@112 no juice. With older combo TA4925psi 11:64@115 w spray low 12s @ 108-9 w/o Tonight street use 30psi 100 shot much cooler , A posted kill No times. Im hoping with a hard launch the 30psi ,100shot and cool air low 11s or better . Will post , that or the 150 shot . I shot that 2x On the street .

 

[Razor]

C16 gas. huh

Do it on 92/93 octane

We'll see if you have problems

This is the point you miss... its not we dont say nitrous doesnt work, its that on 93 octane.. :nono:

Timing high.. timing low... no octane.. your gonna blow

 

[galoush]

(Razor)I was mentioning to my buddy how the C 16 lets you get away with alot . Although i just read a post with someone who popped a HG and was using it . I guess anything is possible . Ive been lucky so far i guess . I just get sick of hearing the guys who answer nitrous questions like its some evil substance .

 

[Razor]

On our motors octane is what lets you get away with a lot. No problem, its no evil substance. Its only evil when trying to use it with insufficient octane.

See for nitrous you run C16 at 7-9 dollars a gallon, possibly damaging O2's due to lead, and the cost of bottle refills. The point is the price of an alky kit vs nitrous kit = same. And the alky kit doesnt need any expensive gasoline, or expensive bottle refills.

On an all out race application, nitrous can be a tremendous thing.. just for typical street cars.. especially with turbo's.. its way easier, safer, and cost effective.

It costs money to go fast, how fast ya wanna go? You cant drive your car 1000 miles a month on C16.. unlees your "funded"

 

[galoush]

Razor thats where the duel fuel system comes in handy . I switch off the stock tank and pump and turn on the 10 gallon cell with the C 16 in it and turn on the solinoid to return the race gas to the cell . Drive on 93 race on 116 I know alot of guys have success with the alky i just think the race gas needs less tuning to get it right than the alky . As far as the nitrous it picks up the car a good amt . Im going to throw a cam and heads on it soon most likely . Right now trying to go up in boost would lean it out too much 30+ i have 009s so its fun to play with at the moment . Being my local track closed im going to have to go to NJ to get some new times with the cooler weather coming and the 150 shot . Also Denso solved that O2 problem . I recommend them highly if you run race gas with lead they last a long time .

 

[Razor]

Originally posted by galoush
I know alot of guys have success with the alky i just think the race gas needs less tuning to get it right than the alky

Now days, I find this to be a false statement. And in your case.. the additional fuel carried, extra lines, valves, etc to switch over.. thats way more hassle than an alky kit.

NX kit is typically 500 for an EFI kit. Lets say 300 used, plus the fuel cell, plus the different chips, plus the switching over one to another.. the O2 is the least of the worries. I know your making it work, most dont go through that trouble.

And we havent gone through the what if's the fuel solenoid quits working.. there is less margin for error. If your alky kit doesnt work, by the time your at 18 PSI you'll know. Your fuel solenoid doesnst fire.. you'll know.. one is way more pleasant than the other.

So its not a $$ thing, cant be a tuning thing, performance.. maybe?? If you add the plus and minus. Alky in 2004 on a TR hands down wins.

 

[sixgun86gn]

I hate to bust your bubble but those times are slow for that amount of boost and nitrous.I would kick your tail at the track on pump gas and 16# (from idle)if thats as fast as you get.I would imagine that thing should have hit 10s without trying.

 

[galoush]

Sixgun since your from Texas and probibly a little slow ill help you out. The car the car went 11:63@115 with the TA 49 and the 100 shot and 25psi on a Hot Humid NY summer day . Last time i went i ran the bigger turbo CPT65, 27psi and the 100 shot same weather due to my posi being shot and not launching with over 5psi it went 11:79@117 untuned (i had one bottle that i did a street pass or two on ) same weather . The car has to weigh over 3600 and i weigh 220 and 15gallons of fuel . Oh i also hate to bust your bubble but i dont have Ported and polished heads like your self or a 218 cam They are complety stock untoched 100k+ so other than pissing me off what is your point . So your saying your car runs 11s or better on pumpgas in hot weather 90+,weighs around 4000lbs with you in it and a 20 deg street chip . I never said the times were super i just stated the truth and as much info as possible . There seems to be ALOT of missing details from peoples post on combos like the i did x with stock turbo , they just forgot to mention the Ported heads cam and 3000 lb weight . The reader is trying to figure how the car runs 10s .

 

[sixgun86gn]

Whoa hey bud,I wasn't putting it down.I was just saying i would expect it to be faster.I mean a few guys have been 10s on untouched stock motors with that 30# of boost and no juice.Hot and humid?You don't know what hot and humid is.Texas makes NY look like autumn in the summer bud.I don't know the elevation where you are so i cant take that into consideration.I was suggesting there may be something keeping you from getting the full potential of that shot of juice,which BTW takes place of the HP made by my heads and cam.I was assuming that HP is HP no matter how its made.My mistake.

But since I am a little slow now....yes my car can run LOOOOOOOOW 11s on pump on a 105*day with 85% humidity(5# launch) 16# 93 gas 19/17 timing.I guess that proves nitrous isn't the great equalizer now doesn't it.

Oh and the car weighs 3800 with me in it.The only thing removed is the A/C because I hated working around it.Still has full sheetmetal and even the bumper supports.

Lighten up man,I aint trying to piss nobody off.But since you imply that I'm stupid,have at it.

 

[galoush]

Ok Ok i got a pretty bent out of shape i guess ,sorry for that. I have Bi Polar im told and i decided to not take the meds so i get a bit crazy here and there . I did drive to Texas a few years ago from NY so i know it gets hot there . Well ill have to admit your car is fast . Now i must head to the bar and get really bannanas . I belive its a full moon , i could be wrong . Maybe ill calm down im pretty keyed up . Ok that does it im removing the motor from my ZO6 and adding it to the Buick and putting in pills for a 300 shot also, then im coming back to Texas , ice down some beers please ill behave i promise .

 

[sixgun86gn]

Its all good! You should try to make it to the Buick vs Ford shootout in Noble,OK if you don't mind a long drive to stomp some mudstains.With that juice you would be beating them at their own game.

I know its hard to beleive,but its true.There are some of us down here that just run harder than we are told we are supposed to.I have alot of local friends on this board that will back me up.I have been called the idiot savant of turbo buicks by a local club member before LOL!

I think you will see easy 10s next time at the track providing traction is good and no parts break with that bigger turbo.I picked up .5 one time just from backing out on the fuel pressure.Just get it tuned and it should run awesome.Good luck.

 

[tim87tr]

Drive 93, Race 93!

Originally posted by galoush
Drive on 93 race on 116 I know alot of guys have success with the alky i just think the race gas needs less tuning to get it right than the alky .

I may eventually try nitrous on another car, and have just started using alky. If you ever try it, you'd enjoy the easy tuning with the progressive systems (I'd never used any other system). I just leave my fp at 42 and adjust one knob on the alky and check the scan tools. I've only made 2 passes on 24 psi for my times, and less than 20 total track passes on the car.

 

[Munday]

I don't run a gnx but I am running a stroker vette. I can't wait to start floggin the crud outta my new motor. As long as you don't run lean your fine. I'm not that familiar with turbo cars, but I am familiar with mine. 100 shot no prob. If anything does break, it was gonna break eventually anyways. Ya'll should read David Vizards Making HP book, not alot on turbos, but very informative on nitrous. Oh And I sprayed my 99' Lightning for 30k miles and lost my motor do to a factory supercharger problem, but not nitrous.

 

[Razor]

You can richen it up... but if you dont run sufficient octane...

If richening it worked, hell we'd have 30 PSI Buicks on pump gas.. no alky.

But there comes a time where the power made exceeds the given octane... you detonate at high cylinder pressures.. Kaboom.... get the shovel.. DOTC

Watch for detonation.. and keep a safe AFR.. no problem.

 

[Munday]

what is this alky? are you running achohol in addition to your 93 oct. or are you running straight alchohol. I am familiar with carbs that require different jets. can injectors run both? sorry for my ignorance i am a vette person with much respect for the gnx.


www.vettespeed.com

 

[Razor]

Alky is shot into the motor at high pressure to reduce/eliminate detonation. I have a Faq's page on my site.. there is some reading. Typically used in forced induction applications, yet throughout the last few years used in racing applications.. like the Ron's flying toilet for NA applications.

Actually, to be correct the cars that came with these motors were the 86/87 Turbo Regals which comprised of the GN, T-types, and GNX. Then in 89 the Turbo Trans Am. They all basically have the same power train. A lot of us here respect the Vette's.. ZR1, Z06, etc.. Tho the GN's were all the same motors unlike the Corvette which had those variations on certain years.

HTH

 

[psikuout]

I was looking in this forum 'cause I'm interested in Razor's alky. kit & read this thread & Hummmm! I'm confused how you say you can run that much boost & spray juice with 009.s. I'm maxing my inj's. with my combo & don't have a big cam or oversized valves.Wat up?