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motorhead

motorhead mike
Joined
Sep 9, 2001
Messages
1,181
I was basically looking to tune the Buick in as best as possible in terms of overall power. MPH was my goal... equaling the power made on 110 with the propane was the task.

Constants: JC100 VT chip, 20psi Boost, 17" Kumho 712s, 1/2 tank of gas, FMIC, ported stock turbo, FP @ 43psi, dual fuel pumps (#2 on @ 11psi), Pro-Pain (on @ 7psi), open exhaust dump, & 3.73s.

Results:

Best ET: 2.17 60' - 13.59 @ 102.72mph

This was done with closed exhaust & slipping it into OD before the end of the track. Damn 3.73s! But, I came up with my best radial tire ET for the car.

Best MPH: 2.30 60' - 13.71 @ 103.40mph

Outcome for Best MPH:
60' - 2.30
1/8 - 9.04 @ 83.36mph
1/4 - 13.71 @ 103.40mph

EGT: 1625*F (low tank pressure, need bottle warmer)
O2s: 760+ range @ top end.
TPS: 4.55v (thinking I need more)
RET: 0-5.5*
MAF: 254g/s

Open exhaust dump & made the run in 1st-2nd-3rd gear (no OD). EGTs hit 1625*F, clearly the propane was running at a low regulated temp. All and all the Buick has run the same MPH as it did on race gas with less timing and lil' less boost.

Now, it is a matter of up'n the boost and adding more base fuel to mix and seeing what happens. But, even with the low tank pressure the car barely knocked at all. Usually only when shifted into 4th at the top end.

When it was all said and done I was happy. Pro-Pain is good. I also like having the EGT gauge and the Tach... it made driving her much easier.

Conclusion:

The car ran just shy of 104mph on 110. The car ran 103.40mph on propane. The car had the advantage of closer to stock gearing with the 110, when the propane did not. A race chip was ran with the 110, and a new VT “100” chip was run with the propane. And because of this, I’d be temped to claim that there is some reasonable gains in what the propane setup has offered.

Yes, the car has a FMIC on it this year, but the overall weather was about equal. Granted it this isn’t a definitive back to back test in the same conditions, but it is close enough. And no. I am will not take the initiative to buy more race gas, and do the test. That would defeat the purpose of the Pro-Pain kit purchase.

Essentially, I found that with less overall tire diameter (25.75” vs. 28”) and the same boost levels (20-21psi) the car performed equally on 110 race gas as it did on pump 94 & propane. Perhaps better.
 
That's good info. Sounds like you had a fair bit of different situations between the 110 run and the propain run, but you qualified all of them. The fact that you were able to get the same MPH with the lower gears and smaller tires is pretty impressive for propain. Time to crank the boost! :cool:
 
I was running c-16 and 25 psi with no knock at the track,car was going 112.For the hell of it I turned on the propane and my mph went up to 113.72 and never went below 113 the rest of the day.Was it the propane? I honestly am not sure if it was or if it was something else,i.e weather,track,my driving etc.Go figure.I am considering trying a diy alchy kit to get a personal experience so I can compare the two for myself.I won't mess with propane at the track no more though,the c-16 insurance is worth the $ for as little as I put the boost over 20 psi.For the street propane is awesome so far minus the bottle cooling problem us northerners seem to have.
 
TurboBuickSix,
Considering that propane is a gas and will mix with the air in the cylinders much more evenly than the fuel, it will eliminate rich and lean spots in the chamber and promote a better burn. I would suspect that plays a part in why you were making more power than straight C-16.

Another possibility is that you had too much octane and not enough timing for the C-16 to burn completely. The propane would help it burn more of the C-16. What were the EGT's and O2volts with and without the propane? If they showed it being about the same and not getting richer (propane is a fuel) I would have to guess you weren't burning all the fuel and needed more timing/less octane.

Propane is still in its infancy and there is alot of tuning to be done with it before we know what the limits for it really are. Five years ago who would have thought that adding propane would even help on a turbocharged gasoline engine?
 
I was running a Jay Carter 110 octane chip and 25 psi.I did not record any data either.
 
Hello,

I am a new T-Type owner, forum member and just added the propain system, please excuse if I am repeating questions answered earlier...

Just bought the car a month ago, so I haven't been to the track yet, will probably go to Sears Pt soon. I'm still quite busy tuning. Currently, I seem to have best performance when propane comes on at 8-10 psi, and set at less than 100% DC (about 3/4 of dial travel, I suppose that's 75% DC).
My question is - What propane injection nozzle are you guys using? I just went straight for the largest one, I think it says 96 on it. In your experience, has the nozzle size made much difference?

Thanks for any info.
Nick G
San Jose, CA

86 T-Type, Hooker 2.5" Exh, stock turbo & DP, cold air/MAF pipe, green-stripe inj, Walbro 340 FP+Hotwire, adj FPR set @ 48psi, Pro-Pain, Scanmaster, Nitto 555R 275-50s, airbags, snubber, etc.
 
I also went straight for the largest one.No bog but it seems sensitive to tank pressure which makes me wish I had an even larger jet to see if it could compensate.I would like to get a few of the larger ones and see where it bogs the cut back from there.
 
HEHEHE

I have the smallest jet installed but mine isn't a normal installation:D :D Still haven't gotten it totally tuned but have gotten it up to 17-18psi without KR but the O2's were around .830-.870 in 3rd gear. Guess I should just turn up the boost some more to add some more air to all that fuel:eek: since turning down the FP messes up the rest of the BLM's. Oh well, it is only a stock turbo so no sense in trying to go past 21psi. Need to take it to the track on a T&T night with the ET-Streets to see what the car is capable of. Last time I was there I got 12 or so runs in, should be able to either tune it or break something.
 
Originally posted by NickSJ
Hello,

I am a new T-Type owner, forum member and just added the propain system, please excuse if I am repeating questions answered earlier...

Just bought the car a month ago, so I haven't been to the track yet, will probably go to Sears Pt soon. I'm still quite busy tuning. Currently, I seem to have best performance when propane comes on at 8-10 psi, and set at less than 100% DC (about 3/4 of dial travel, I suppose that's 75% DC).
My question is - What propane injection nozzle are you guys using? I just went straight for the largest one, I think it says 96 on it. In your experience, has the nozzle size made much difference?

Thanks for any info.
Nick G
San Jose, CA


Nick, you said you just installed propain, have you seen this thread? ProPain wiring

Not sure when your kit was purchased or built, but if you are having tuning issues with the "Injection control" not changing anything then that thread has the fix.
 
Good info, thanks. I guess I'll stick with the big-un for now till I solve that part-throttle knock issue I'm having...

I did see the thread on the solenoid wiring issue - fortunately I'm not having that particular problem (can hear the solenoid clicking away, when set to less than 100% DC).

Thanks!

Nick G
 
I am guessing you bought the kit after I made Dan aware of it and he fixed up the kits he had before sending them out. How long have you had the kit?
 
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