Propane Injection
- Thread starter SpoolinGN
- Start date
- Joined
- May 27, 2001
Here are the main differences. I haven't compared the two side by side so I may be missing some things.
Our kit uses all steel braided line. This was done for two reasons. First, in testing, we originally used a different type of line. There have been some problems with that car showing wear on that line due to vibration. While it could have been eliminated with installation changes, I don't want anything out there that could potententially cause problems so we went with all steel braided line.
The other reason for doing this was to minimize any objections people may run into at their local track. NHRA has a limit on the amount of rubber line allowed in fuel systems. While they may not consider the propane injection a fuel system, I didn't want to leave it open to chance so we used all steel braided line. There could still be some remaining issues like a firewall, etc seperating the rest of the car but that will probably have to be dealt with by the end user. The rules are a bit murky about that.
We have electronics inside the car that allow you to change the cut on point of the system and control the amount of propane injected via a control module that allows you to pulse width modulate the solenoid. This allows for tuning on the fly.
We have a custom made propane regulator for pressure control. The IPO kit also uses a regulator and I am familiair with the piece they use however we wanted to have control at over 100 PSI of tank pressure so we had a regulator constructed for us from scratch. The company that designed and built the regulator had EVERY engineer in the place examine it and sign off on it before they would sell it to us. It has a ridiculous inlet pressure limit and 400 PSI outlet pressure control. It also has an inlet and outlet pressure gauge.
Regulator photos
Regulator 1
Regulator 2
Regulator 3
As was pointed out in another thread, yes, it looks like a welding regulator, no, it is not. There is a sticker attached to each regulator that says "DANGER: DO NOT USE FOR ACETYLENE SERVICE". This is the real deal, 100% constructed for propane use only.
Along with controlling the pressure and allowing you to pulse width modulate the solenoid, we also use jets up front at the engine that allow for more tuneability. The IPO kit uses a needle valve. Accomplishes the same thing pretty much.
We use a nozzle for injection, I believe IPO uses a standard hose barb you thread into your up pipe. Our nozzle can be mounted in metal or into hose so people with front mounts can put it down underneath the car in the intercooler hose and it would effectively be hidden.
Out kit ships with a tank and a custom made mounting bracket. IPO's kit does not ship with a tank. Im not sure about a mounting bracket.
Our solenoid is a custom piece, designed for our use and has a very large orifice for maximum flow. It's bigger than any nitrous solenoid I have ever seen. For an idea of the size, click here. Please note diet Pepsi does not endorse propane injection.
That's about all I can tell you at this point.
Our kit uses all steel braided line. This was done for two reasons. First, in testing, we originally used a different type of line. There have been some problems with that car showing wear on that line due to vibration. While it could have been eliminated with installation changes, I don't want anything out there that could potententially cause problems so we went with all steel braided line.
The other reason for doing this was to minimize any objections people may run into at their local track. NHRA has a limit on the amount of rubber line allowed in fuel systems. While they may not consider the propane injection a fuel system, I didn't want to leave it open to chance so we used all steel braided line. There could still be some remaining issues like a firewall, etc seperating the rest of the car but that will probably have to be dealt with by the end user. The rules are a bit murky about that.
We have electronics inside the car that allow you to change the cut on point of the system and control the amount of propane injected via a control module that allows you to pulse width modulate the solenoid. This allows for tuning on the fly.
We have a custom made propane regulator for pressure control. The IPO kit also uses a regulator and I am familiair with the piece they use however we wanted to have control at over 100 PSI of tank pressure so we had a regulator constructed for us from scratch. The company that designed and built the regulator had EVERY engineer in the place examine it and sign off on it before they would sell it to us. It has a ridiculous inlet pressure limit and 400 PSI outlet pressure control. It also has an inlet and outlet pressure gauge.
Regulator photos
Regulator 1
Regulator 2
Regulator 3
As was pointed out in another thread, yes, it looks like a welding regulator, no, it is not. There is a sticker attached to each regulator that says "DANGER: DO NOT USE FOR ACETYLENE SERVICE". This is the real deal, 100% constructed for propane use only.
Along with controlling the pressure and allowing you to pulse width modulate the solenoid, we also use jets up front at the engine that allow for more tuneability. The IPO kit uses a needle valve. Accomplishes the same thing pretty much.
We use a nozzle for injection, I believe IPO uses a standard hose barb you thread into your up pipe. Our nozzle can be mounted in metal or into hose so people with front mounts can put it down underneath the car in the intercooler hose and it would effectively be hidden.
Out kit ships with a tank and a custom made mounting bracket. IPO's kit does not ship with a tank. Im not sure about a mounting bracket.
Our solenoid is a custom piece, designed for our use and has a very large orifice for maximum flow. It's bigger than any nitrous solenoid I have ever seen. For an idea of the size, click here. Please note diet Pepsi does not endorse propane injection.
That's about all I can tell you at this point.
- Joined
- May 27, 2001
20 degrees or so.
Kenny Brown is running about 24 PSI with a street chip in his car also. I believe he saw a gain of 7 PSI versus non-propane.
Rob's car was kind of interesting. It had severe detonation at around 15 PSI. With the propane, he went right up to 22 with no knock whatsoever.
Kenny Brown is running about 24 PSI with a street chip in his car also. I believe he saw a gain of 7 PSI versus non-propane.
Rob's car was kind of interesting. It had severe detonation at around 15 PSI. With the propane, he went right up to 22 with no knock whatsoever.
import power on
New Member
- Joined
- Jul 18, 2002
Hey all,
I know since this is a Buick site most will support a fellow Buick Shop and with good right. And After all, Jays kit is very nice and does offer some things ours does not. It comes at a price but I don't think his prices are out of line.
Just to add or clarify about our kit:
All our parts are Specifically Propane only parts. No generic use parts. This also is not a Diesel truck kit. Nor was it a converted kit. It was all built from scratch. We do use a shop and thier knowledge whom are well respected in the propane for diesel world though. The Needle control valve is machined to our specs and has 6 complete turns from open to closed for maximum tuneablilty (very small precise changes can be made) Not electronically however from in the driver's seat like jay's (hats off!)
We have just upgraded to a very expensive ($75 retail) Pound for Pound High Flow 100psi Regulator. Little heavier duty, better flow, more acurate and reliable. The reason we did not see a reason to get a reg any higher than 100PSI is the tank pressure at given ambient tank temps. According to all the spec sheets we found 100PSI tank pressure happens when the tank hits ambient temp of just shy of 70F, at 90F it will put out 150PSI. Since most vehicles will be driven for a part of the year well below 70F we saw no point in having a reg capable of adjusting to a point that can not exist. Not putting down Jays Reg at all. Even at 110F the tank is only going to see 204psi. Just to clarify these are not my figures, just quoting from spec sheets. you can use a tank heater like nitrous though to raise temp and tank pressure. We have been able to tune very well running only 85psi. Not to say there are not benefits from running at 150psi.
We actually have some GN guys, some even from GN referals, that love the kit.
Jays 100% right about the steel braid line. We just have not got the supplier lined up for that yet, and with our cross country move this 22nd everything is on hold for a few weeks.
With jays pulse width solenoid and cockpit tuning he definitley has a great product. I think we all expected that!
For $300 the IPO kit is a good buy. For the extra money and what you get the Jay kit is also worth the cash!
I know since this is a Buick site most will support a fellow Buick Shop and with good right. And After all, Jays kit is very nice and does offer some things ours does not. It comes at a price but I don't think his prices are out of line.
Just to add or clarify about our kit:
All our parts are Specifically Propane only parts. No generic use parts. This also is not a Diesel truck kit. Nor was it a converted kit. It was all built from scratch. We do use a shop and thier knowledge whom are well respected in the propane for diesel world though. The Needle control valve is machined to our specs and has 6 complete turns from open to closed for maximum tuneablilty (very small precise changes can be made) Not electronically however from in the driver's seat like jay's (hats off!)
We have just upgraded to a very expensive ($75 retail) Pound for Pound High Flow 100psi Regulator. Little heavier duty, better flow, more acurate and reliable. The reason we did not see a reason to get a reg any higher than 100PSI is the tank pressure at given ambient tank temps. According to all the spec sheets we found 100PSI tank pressure happens when the tank hits ambient temp of just shy of 70F, at 90F it will put out 150PSI. Since most vehicles will be driven for a part of the year well below 70F we saw no point in having a reg capable of adjusting to a point that can not exist. Not putting down Jays Reg at all. Even at 110F the tank is only going to see 204psi. Just to clarify these are not my figures, just quoting from spec sheets. you can use a tank heater like nitrous though to raise temp and tank pressure. We have been able to tune very well running only 85psi. Not to say there are not benefits from running at 150psi.
We actually have some GN guys, some even from GN referals, that love the kit.
Jays 100% right about the steel braid line. We just have not got the supplier lined up for that yet, and with our cross country move this 22nd everything is on hold for a few weeks.
With jays pulse width solenoid and cockpit tuning he definitley has a great product. I think we all expected that!
For $300 the IPO kit is a good buy. For the extra money and what you get the Jay kit is also worth the cash!
T
Turboniam
Guest
Jay, thanks for the info and pics!!! 
T
Turboniam
Guest
Jay, could you expand a little more about putting the "nozzle" in a hose that would be located in an intercooler hose???
I am a little fuzzy on where you would locate it and why etc?
Thanks
T
Turboniam
Guest
- Joined
- May 27, 2001
I talked to Dan last night. Preorders should ship on Friday.
I didn't verify this today but I know what part he was waiting on and I'd imagine if he didn't get it from where he ordered it, an alternate source could be found with ease.
I also found out last night that all kits will include overboost warning free. We originally were going to make this an additional option but decided to make it standard.
I didn't verify this today but I know what part he was waiting on and I'd imagine if he didn't get it from where he ordered it, an alternate source could be found with ease.
I also found out last night that all kits will include overboost warning free. We originally were going to make this an additional option but decided to make it standard.
WE4
TBcom Admin /Prayers NYFD/NYPD
- Joined
- May 24, 2001
Jay..
I am VERY interested in this. With me being out here and of low to med intelligence, I would like to buy one if not the first one and test and run myself. I want it just the way you say it should be done. All your stuff all your design. I am willing to put up all the trans parts you would like in trade if you so desire to try this. ( cash is not out either but )You name it and you set it up. I have all the fittings already located so I am on my way. I also have teflon braided hydryluic hose crimped to 2500 psi. Please contact me as I am ready to do something right now.
Bruce We4
916-739-0510 shop
I am VERY interested in this. With me being out here and of low to med intelligence, I would like to buy one if not the first one and test and run myself. I want it just the way you say it should be done. All your stuff all your design. I am willing to put up all the trans parts you would like in trade if you so desire to try this. ( cash is not out either but )You name it and you set it up. I have all the fittings already located so I am on my way. I also have teflon braided hydryluic hose crimped to 2500 psi. Please contact me as I am ready to do something right now.
Bruce We4
916-739-0510 shop
- Joined
- May 27, 2001
I dont sell the kit, Bruce nor do I stock them. All the assembly work and sales is handled by Dan McCann at OGS Distributing. I just basically came up with the design then he and I expounded upon the idea. Contacting him direct would be your best bet.
As I said above, the kits should be ready to head out the door today. When I spoke with him last night he was waiting on a roll of vacuum tubing. I think people are going to be amazed at the amount of detail and "Its all in the box" this kit has. He has gone way beyond the call of duty in his attention to detail.
Amazingly, of all the preorders we have, only 1 is for a Buick. The rest are for imports and SyTys.
As I said above, the kits should be ready to head out the door today. When I spoke with him last night he was waiting on a roll of vacuum tubing. I think people are going to be amazed at the amount of detail and "Its all in the box" this kit has. He has gone way beyond the call of duty in his attention to detail.
Amazingly, of all the preorders we have, only 1 is for a Buick. The rest are for imports and SyTys.
"Amazingly, of all the preorders we have, only 1 is for a Buick. The rest are for imports and SyTys."
all the beating to death of this an I am the only Buick????...I have at lease 5 guys waiting for me to get this on my new
"beater"....
the parts Dan had @ Bristol looked awesome, well made "stuff"
all the beating to death of this an I am the only Buick????...I have at lease 5 guys waiting for me to get this on my new
"beater"....
the parts Dan had @ Bristol looked awesome, well made "stuff"
