propane is on..

[TType84]

sup guys..

right now the boost is conservatively set at 17psi, propane is doing good, if only i could find a place to refill it that isnt staffed by dumb asses who want to charge me $12.50 for a bbq tank refill.. i keep tellIng them NO IT IS NOT A BBQ TANK, IT IS A FIVE POUND TANK, NOT TWENTY.

the bluetops are in as well, and i think i have the propane nozzle too close to the maf, so later today im going to move it over in the 90* bend in the inlet pipe.

yes, inlet pipe. i decided against putting it in the turbo-intake adapter because jet changes would be a major b!tch stuffed way up under there.. right now its easy to deal with and relatively easy to tune..

when i disregard the false knock, the car pulls good and hard in all gears. i really need to get new motor mounts.

im going to up the boost to 20psi next, once i get the tank filled, to get this thing going..

i will be using a homemade 60 jet, just fyi incase anyone else wanted to know. the 81 jet is way too big for my car it seems.

im gonna go move the nozzle and find a dealer that can fill them.. let you guys know after i do some more testing.

 

[Danster]

Check your local U-Haul places in your area. They charge by the pound/gallon.


Dannyo

 

[TurboBuickSix]

Or a welding supply shop.

 

[BuickTV6]

Nick, will running the jet in the maf inlet tube be the exact same as running in through the turbo adapter? Just curious as to which one will give the best performance. I am still unsure to exactely how propane will increase hp on the hotair setup, so you'll have to explain it to me. And does propane run all the time even under normal driving conditions?do u have to run less fuel rpessure cause of it? I'm intrigued!

 

[TType84]

thanks danster.. i called u haul and at first got the same answer.. called again and got a diff guy and a different answer..

tank took .9 gallons, $2.22



oh btw..

boost spiked to 23psi..

no knock



i relocated the nozzle to the 90 * turn in the inlet pipe.. no more bucking, im going to put the 81 jet in there and see how it works again..

todd, i dunno, jay said the inlet pipe would not be his first choice, so if you can, put that hoe in the intake adapter.. BUT i think tuning the kit will be way harder without easy access to the jets.. which is why i put it where i did, convenience!

im sure the turbo adapter will work better, but for tuning's sake, i think im going to leave it where it is.

on second thought, if i got a short 1ft long section of braided hose and put the jet on the opposite end of the hose frmo the one connected in the turbo adapter, maybe that would be best.. you could just connect the existing line to the new hose section and jet changes would be very easy.. maybe something jay and dan could implement?

 

[joereitman]

Originally posted by BuickTV6
I am still unsure to exactly how propane will increase hp on the hotair setup, so you'll have to explain it to me. And does propane run all the time even under normal driving conditions?do u have to run less fuel rpessure cause of it?

Per Bruce and everything I have read on various boards and web sites and with some personal experience and fuzzy calculations, I believe propane reduces detonation primarily by creating a more homogenous a/f mix reducing hots spots and resultant detonation, secondly by SLIGHTLY increasing octane, and a distant third by SLIGHT reduction of intake temps. IMHO I stand to be corrected if proven wrong.

Hot air or IC, should make no difference in affect.

The propane is injected by a boost signal activating the Hobbs pressure switch which sends voltage to a solenoid (shutoff valve) which opens allowing propane flow. My Hobbs activates at about 10 psi.

Fuel adjustments depend on how much you use and how lean/rich you are tuned w/out propane. I was tuned on the edge, for high octane, so I am able to run Propane plus 93-95 octane with no fuel changes.

Joe

 

[6SENSE]

It will be interesting to see your results, but I honestly believe that the best performance will be gained with the nozzle after the turbo, not before. The air charge in the intake is where you want the temp drop. All incoming air will be heated through the turbo. If the incoming air is cooled via a nozzle in the MAF pipe it will still be heated up when it goes through the turbo. Only way I could see using a nozzle pre turbo is if you have a 2 nozzle set up, with the other one post turbo.
Think about how the intercooled cars are setup. The intercooler is cooling the air after it has gone through the turbo, where it matters. When they add alky or propane it also affects the air after the turbo that is about to enter the intake.
I know it may seem like a b***h to deal with the nozzle in the adaptor, but really it isnt that bad, especially if your not changing jets all the time. This is just something we have to deal with because of how our cars are set up.
Get the maximum benefit from the kit. Just my $.02.

 

[BuickTV6]

Yeah I was thinking the same thing 6sense was saying, that you might see better results with the nozzle on the adapter. Perhaps you should try both. i'm really interested to seeing what results you get from that. And do you have any pics of the system installed so we could see?

 

[JayC]

Actually I think where Nick has it is the best location. After giving it some thought, I think where he's at is the best on a hot air. I'm not real wild about it being before the turbo but I think it's better than it being after the turbo.

 

[6SENSE]

Now thats interesting Jay, please elaborate. Am I comparing "apples to oranges" by using the alky/H2O injection train of thought? There must be a significant difference in how the propane acts.

 

[JayC]

There is a significant difference between alcohol injection and propane. Since people are already trying to build their own kits, I'd rather not say why and let them find out the hard way.

EDIT Actually, since I have already told people where to put it, I guess at this point it doesn't matter if I explain why.

In my testing, I have found that propane injection doesn't work real well when you inject into a cramped area of the inlet track. I believe this is for two reasons. 1) Propane is heavier than air and 2) Propane will displace air (See #1). So, if you are working in a cramped area and you drop a crapload of propane in there, it can cause something of a bottleneck. I found this out initially trying to inject behind the throttle body on an 87 car. Didn't work so well. Caused the sort of funkiness Nick was having initially. His was for a whole different reason, though. The nozzle was too close to the MAF and I think it was causing some funkiness with MAF readings.

I think where Nick mounted his nozzle is the optimum location for a hor air car. Again, Im not wild about it being before the turbo, however I think that given the logistics of the intake, that is the best location. Being able to eye it up on his car and say "Mount it here" helped. I haven't seen under the hood of a hotair car in a long time.

That's also the reason that I told the guy wanting to do port propane injection that it probably wasn't a good idea.