Any one make it to 10's w/6131e yet

[Marc87GN]

Not a true comment. Sometimes "new" doesn't make it better.



That's good performance. We've had cars run 11.3x-11.5x with very similar bolt-ons, but at 24psi.

My experience with the GT61 is that if you were to turn it up from your 23psi to say 26psi you would either gain nothing or lose HP. Whereas the Ta/Te61 would continue to gain and outperform the GT61.


K.

I think that is more a function of the exhaust wheel and not the turbo itself. I have several videos of EVOs making over 600 whp with GT-35R turbos which uses the same compressor wheel and only 2.0/2.3 liters engines.

I'm confused by the fact that a TA/TE-61 can make more power in the upper boost range unless you are comparing it to the GT61 turbo mentioned using a 31E wheel. I'm sure one with a 52 wheel and S cover or larger exhaust wheel would not experience what you are describing. The only way to find out is to test one on a GN at 25+ psi. I have accidentally hit 23-25 psi and the car felt anything but like it slowed down, but I have a different exhaust wheel.

 

[bison]

The 61 is actually a much better turbo than the 54. It has an updated newer Garrett GT compressor wheel which is like nearly 78% efficient at 22 lbs of boost, and makes about 50 more horse than the 54. It also spools the same if not quicker. I'd be in the 10's with mine if it wasn't for a bunch of small stuff going against me. Plus my car is HEAVY. High 10's turbo for sure. Maybe mid 10's with everything perfect and a light weight car.

I went 6.70@102.9mph in the 1/8th(no cage in my car and they were giving me a hard time about running full passes even with radials ) with an old PT54. Are you stating i would go 2-3mph faster with the new 61? I highly doubt that if i ran the two turbos under the same conditions i would have gone much faster with the new 61. I agree it would be a more streetable turbo than the old 54 but as far as hp is concerned i dont think there is that much to be gained with either or. I also went 12.00@124.5mph the same day as the 6.70 with a 2.00 60' with a vacuum launch with the 54. I think the 54 was pretty much done at that point, but so was my fuel system. my runs were at 24-26psi.

 

[Marc87GN]

I went 6.70@102.9mph in the 1/8th(no cage in my car and they were giving me a hard time about running full passes even with radials ) with an old PT54. Are you stating i would go 2-3mph faster with the new 61? I highly doubt that if i ran the two turbos under the same conditions i would have gone much faster with the new 61. I agree it would be a more streetable turbo than the old 54 but as far as hp is concerned i dont think there is that much to be gained with either or. I also went 12.00@124.5mph the same day as the 6.70 with a 2.00 60' with a vacuum launch with the 54. I think the 54 was pretty much done at that point, but so was my fuel system. my runs were at 24-26psi.

I don't believe anyone is saying that. Being that they are rated about a 10 hp difference, it might be foolish for someone to say that. What is being said is that the new GT wheels are a more efficient design. You could clearly see how imports are performing with the new GT series turbos over the previous designs. Unfortunately, we get a weaker version of it. When/if a GT-35R is available for the GN, it will be no contest between any of the TA/TE or similar turbos. We get only the compressor wheel and non BB version which is far from the same.

 

[2QUIK6]

When/if a GT-35R is available for the GN, it will be no contest between any of the TA/TE or similar turbos. We get only the compressor wheel and non BB version which is far from the same.

I've had an experimental version of the GT35R and for some reason it just will not spool very well with our round 3-bolt exhaust side. Seems to work well for the square 4-bolts. Finally at around 3600 rpm it spooled and would smoke the tires at 60mph, but would take it a few seconds to get to that point. It would need a huge stall to work well, but if thats the case, why not go bigger then... This was with a PTE housing, a .82 A/R and also tried a .63 A/R.
The next one I had was the GT6131E, then a hybrid TE6031E, and also a GT3251?? can't remember on the last one, it was actually a stock replacement I tested on my TTA. The GT6131E was my favorite hands down so I kept that one.

 

[bison]

I've had an experimental version of the GT35R and for some reason it just will not spool very well with our round 3-bolt exhaust side. Seems to work well for the square 4-bolts. Finally at around 3600 rpm it spooled and would smoke the tires at 60mph, but would take it a few seconds to get to that point. It would need a huge stall to work well, but if thats the case, why not go bigger then... This was with a PTE housing, a .82 A/R and also tried a .63 A/R.
The next one I had was the GT6131E, then a hybrid TE6031E, and also a GT3251?? can't remember on the last one, it was actually a stock replacement I tested on my TTA. The GT6131E was my favorite hands down so I kept that one.

I agree with this. I think a major bottle neck in itself to us that still run the old 3 bolt design is the the 3 bolt flange itself. When someone designs an affordable set of stainless headers that will put everything in nearly the stock location, we will be able to really take advantage of what these new turbos have to offer. The exhaust side on theses 3 bolts is killing us at the power levels were trying to achieve.

 

[DonnieShort]

This turbo has nice bottom end, but up top it's done. I had a 61 P trim on my old set up ( stock, bolt on only motor ) and the turbo is real strong. I ran 7.20 in the 1/8th with it, but on the big end it sorta peters out. Now if I had it on my new set up ( in sig ) I'm sure that it would pick up on top some but not because of the turbo but because of the heads and cam. If you want a turbo that is as comfortable on street as it is the strip just get a T-70 and be done with it. Has more power from top to bottom than most folks would ever need. And don't let anyone scare you into thinking that it'll have a ton of lag on the street and all that bs. Just not true. A good converter ( which most people already has ) in the 3000-3200 range ( like a Vigilante with the "0" pump ) will do the job. And if you think it's too big for you right now, you can always grow into it. Buy once not often. With my new set up and a Vigilante "6" pump, my 70 P trim spools like a stocker and I have the bigger .82 ar housing, non ball-bearing. And you would not believe the power difference between the T-70 and the 61 just downright scary

 

[d0n_3d]

Ahhh...I beg to differ on the top end of the 61. I think it pulls just fine up top. It can run almost 125 mph with the right conditions.

 

[DonnieShort]

Ahhh...I beg to differ on the top end of the 61. I think it pulls just fine up top. It can run almost 125 mph with the right conditions.

I'm not going to get into an argument on this. I ran this turbo for a while and it's really nice. I loved it. Pulls great on the bottom and mid, but IMHO it doesn't pull as hard on top.

 

[Marc87GN]

I'm not going to get into an argument on this. I ran this turbo for a while and it's really nice. I loved it. Pulls great on the bottom and mid, but IMHO it doesn't pull as hard on top.

I think the problem with your statement is it doesn't paint the entire picture because you said yourself it was on a stock engine so you never had an opportunity to run it with a cam and P&P heads. Those of us that have this turbo with heads and better cam can provide more accurate opnions about the topend pull of this turbo. I'm sure if you replaced it with the T-70, it would have pulled a little harder, but would have sucked compared to a T-70 on the setup you have now.

Comparing a 60 series turbo to a 70 series turbo with a larger exhaust housing and all of the other mods added, in regards to pull upstairs, doesn't make much sense IMO. I'm sure there will be alot of us getting times with this turbo this year so maybe we can put some of the theories that people have to bed.

 

[NCTURBOS]

Ahhh...I beg to differ on the top end of the 61. I think it pulls just fine up top. It can run almost 125 mph with the right conditions.

With a good combination that might be possible.

With the "old standard" Ta/Te61, 60mm comp wheel/Hi-Fi 69-trim exhaust wheel, if I remember correctly, we've gone 4mph faster!! That was running higher boost though I'm sure and that is where the GT61 falls off.

Did we ever determine if the Limit Engineering Ta/Te61 is the same as a PE-54? If not never mind my above statements as the original question is between the PTE-54 vs. GT61.


K.

 

[DonnieShort]

I think the problem with your statement is it doesn't paint the entire picture because you said yourself it was on a stock engine so you never had an opportunity to run it with a cam and P&P heads. Those of us that have this turbo with heads and better cam can provide more accurate opnions about the topend pull of this turbo. I'm sure if you replaced it with the T-70, it would have pulled a little harder, but would have sucked compared to a T-70 on the setup you have now.

Comparing a 60 series turbo to a 70 series turbo with a larger exhaust housing and all of the other mods added, in regards to pull upstairs, doesn't make much sense IMO. I'm sure there will be alot of us getting times with this turbo this year so maybe we can put some of the theories that people have to bed.

That can be said with any turbo, not just this one. Ported heads and cam would make a difference. Don't get upset, I'm not knocking this turbo at all. Heck I loved it. But mostported head and cam guys run a bigger turbo than this one, not all but most and alot of guys who have or buy this turbo are the stock bolt-on only guys. And I think that my experience with this turbo on a stock bolt on car is very relevent. Comparing the T-70 to the 61 is for the folks who might be on the fence deciding if the 70 would be too big for their current set up and don't want have to buy another turbo later on down the road like I did.

 

[Marc87GN]

That can be said with any turbo, not just this one. Ported heads and cam would make a difference. Don't get upset, I'm not knocking this turbo at all. Heck I loved it. But mostported head and cam guys run a bigger turbo than this one, not all but most and alot of guys who have or buy this turbo are the stock bolt-on only guys. And I think that my experience with this turbo on a stock bolt on car is very relevent. Comparing the T-70 to the 61 is for the folks who might be on the fence deciding if the 70 would be too big for their current set up and don't want have to buy another turbo later on down the road like I did.

I'm not upset or anything. We are just having a conversation. I can't disagree with your approach because when I had my 99 GT and decided to turbocharge it, I went with an ITS T-76 for the reasons you mentioned. I just think it might be a little premature to determine how fast this turbo is capable of going with the vast number of setups that people are using it on. I was just looking for an 11 second GN on pump gas and not need alot of stall to do it.

I run a 3K stall and the car pulls everywhere, but it's setup to utilize the turbo alot more than with a stock setup. Guys that are strapping them to a stock GN will never see the full potential of it or any turbo of a similar size through the poor flowing heads. It's the same thing regardless of what car we are talking about. Once guys start running 10s with this turbo using good setups, it will cause more of a stir. I just hate to see it cut down before we have a chance to see it's true potential.

 

[DonnieShort]

I'm not cutting it down, never said that. Just relaying my experience with it on a set up the majority will be using it on. Like I said it's a really nice turbo. flat out

 

[c&cgn]

Problem here is, alot of you guys keep talking about different turbo's. You have everyone confused as to which is which.

6131 = TE60 + GT61 compressor wheel

6152 = PT52 (or TE52 or PTE52) + GT61 compressor wheel

PTE54 = TE61 = old style 60-1 compressor wheel and T04B 69 trim exhaust wheel


IMHO, the 6131 will not be going 10's any time soon, unless you have a really well built motor and very high flowing heads.

The GT61 compressor wheel is considered a lower pressure wheel, but makes more power than the old 60-1 compressor it replaces at lower boost levels. Each motor will be slightly different but it has been discussed multiple times in the past that the GT61 compressor wheel will be done in the 24 -26psi range on most Buick motors. Crank the boost higher than that and you won't make any more power.

If you intend on running on the street then a turbo with the GT61 may be a better choice as you will make more power and spool quicker at the lower boost levels.

If you have a car that you want to keep pushing, and run at the track often, then something you can keep turning the boost up on and will keep making more power is a PTE54/TE61. This is a proven turbo and guys have run it into the 30+ psi range and still made more power. Try that with a GT61 compressor and it will be dead @ 24 - 26 psi.

No hype, no BS, just the way it is....

Hope that clears things up for a few guys.

 

[TURBOV6]

6131e

Well I would have to say this turbo pulls pretty hard on the top end.

I could not get some solid times because have some launching issues. I did manage to pull a 12.10@116.83 and my 1/8 MPH was over 95

 

[John Wilde]

Problem here is, alot of you guys keep talking about different turbo's. You have everyone confused as to which is which.

No hype, no BS, just the way it is....

Hope that clears things up for a few guys.

Great post Clayton.
I am still waiting for someone to post the total CFM and Maps.
I have the feeling we will never see this issue in black and white.

 

[chevyII]

the old pt54 will go 10.50-.70 all day.

 

[d0n_3d]

the old pt54 will go 10.50-.70 all day.

yeah on a 3000 lb car!

 

[John Wilde]

yeah on a 3000 lb car!

Damn, Don is fiesty tonight!!!

 

[d0n_3d]

VERY WELL SAID THANK YOU but the 61 compressor CAN make more power past 26 psi it's just the Buick 3.8 is not BIG boost friendly and isn't very efficient like a 4-valve DOHC 2.0L 4G63 motor would be (where guys have made almost 700 to the tires at around 35-37 psi of boost). And whoever said the 3-bolt Buick housing doesn't flow well??? Why do you think we run this housing all the way up to a PT88? No they can't flow the best on those big of turbos BUT they are absolutely fine on the smaller turbos. You can't outflow that housing at least up to a 70.

Problem here is, alot of you guys keep talking about different turbo's. You have everyone confused as to which is which.

6131 = TE60 + GT61 compressor wheel

6152 = PT52 (or TE52 or PTE52) + GT61 compressor wheel

PTE54 = TE61 = old style 60-1 compressor wheel and T04B 69 trim exhaust wheel


IMHO, the 6131 will not be going 10's any time soon, unless you have a really well built motor and very high flowing heads.

The GT61 compressor wheel is considered a lower pressure wheel, but makes more power than the old 60-1 compressor it replaces at lower boost levels. Each motor will be slightly different but it has been discussed multiple times in the past that the GT61 compressor wheel will be done in the 24 -26psi range on most Buick motors. Crank the boost higher than that and you won't make any more power.

If you intend on running on the street then a turbo with the GT61 may be a better choice as you will make more power and spool quicker at the lower boost levels.

If you have a car that you want to keep pushing, and run at the track often, then something you can keep turning the boost up on and will keep making more power is a PTE54/TE61. This is a proven turbo and guys have run it into the 30+ psi range and still made more power. Try that with a GT61 compressor and it will be dead @ 24 - 26 psi.

No hype, no BS, just the way it is....

Hope that clears things up for a few guys.