1981 Regal 231 V6

[cooper]

Glad I found this site!

Ok, here goes. I've got a 81 Regal with a 3.8. It's got a 2bbl Rochester feedback carb. I'd like to put a 4bbl on it. My question is about the distributor. I have no experience with the HEI, so I'm in the dark. I believe the advance is controlled by the computer, so can I just get a vaccuum advance aftermarket HEI? How about one from a donor car that didn't have an ECM?

Someone at work told me that with an HEI all you need is 12v to it since the coil is part of it. Is that true? I am familiar with Mopar electronic ignition so I'm not a total rock when it comes to how everything works. I just want to be able to get the 4bbl on there with no problems from the computer.(I don't want to use it).

I am familiar with emission laws, however this car won't be on the public roads, so no worry there.

Thanks for any advice or help.

 

[Ttype83]

Check out this site(B4Black's), he has been adding N/A V6 mods to it including 4bbl swaps.
The HEI will work good for you for,IMHO
Check out the Links page, about half way down he list some very good reading under Literature

Welcome aboard

 

[Freddie's Buick]

Hey Cooper,

I got one too! ('81 N/A, and I love it!). O.K. first off, does it run well? Because if it does'nt then why not rip it all out?

You can dismantle the ECM, but I would only do that if I were building a racer. If it runs good then leave it alone.The reason why is because there are plenty of mods that can make this thing go faster and better just by keeping the ECM.

And as far as the EST/HEI, I've written here before that I tried that mod you mentioned with the older HEI w/vacuum advance.

It's o.k., but the 1981 EST/HEI is better! Besides, you probably have a THM-350C transmission with the TCC, (computer controlled). This mod would have you buying a by-pass for the trainy, (which is pretty neat), or you can replace the trainy with an older one. Also, you would have to get a differant carburator, (non-CCC).

Bottom line is, if you get this far you might as well get rid of the ECM system all together, to include more work and spend BIG $$$$.

The cheaper and more efficient way to go is to keep the EST/ECM. There's lot's of cool H/P parts for it anyway that are not too expensive and easy to get.

One word of caution, if you decide to keep the ECM.....school yourself completly on it and have faith in it. Always disconnect the battery before any electronic work is to be done to it. Welding, radio upgrades, gauges and alternator replacement are just some of the few standard things one must heed this warning for.

If damaged, they are now getting harder to find in junkyards. (If they work at all), and re-manufactored ones don't always work either. (Get a decent warranty before you buy).

Read my posts.....my '81 Regal project will have mostly stock upgrades. Stock modifications...and when I'm finished...she's gonna kick butt....And do read B4-Black's N/A upgrades....they're right on the money!

 

[cooper]

Thanks for the replies.

The carb I'm thinking of using is a Holley 390( A 4160, definitely not a CCC carb). A friend has one he'll give me. He thinks the power valve is blown. I've worked on Holley carbs before, so it seems like a good deal to me.

I do have the computer controlled tranny. I guess taking the ECM out is more involved than I thought. The original carb is a Rochester Dual-Jet E2ME. The car runs rather poorly. There are 2 vaccuum ports on the carb that broke off and it looks like someone tried to JB Weld them back on. The casting itself is cracked, too, so a regular rebuild is out of the question. ( A rebuilt one at NAPA is up around $450). I was thinking of an Edelbrock dual plane intake to go with the 390 and doing away with the whole feedback system, but... if I need the ECM for the tranny, I guess I need to re-think everything. What's that by-pass for the tranny you mentioned? I have a Q-Jet off a Dodge 360, but I think it's way too many CFMs for a 231. Also, it's not a feedback carb, either. So scratch that.

Ok, that's enough for now. Thanks for reading. Also, thanks for the heads-up on Before Black website. I'm learning a lot from it.

 

[87regal]

Have u thought of this?....

Why not just swap to a 4.1 intake and carb? its a factory alum. intake and a 4bbl Q-jet, should bolt right on and give you some more ummph...plus the Q-jet is a great carb (the best imo) when tuned right. Im sure you can find this setup in a local junkyard if you searc around, and I have seen a few ppl buy them on the board here, a few buick used parts guys usually have them laying around.

Just a thought, it would be much more simpler than getting rid of the ECM

 

[RCI2990]

cooper,i was originally going to go the route that you were gonna go,but its not really worth it.i put the 4.1 intake and rebuilt the 4-brl carb and fine tuned it and with the other mods i've done and switched rear ends and put a shift kit in i can catch rubber going from 1st to 2nd and feel the 3rd shift at 70 mph.gotta love it.

 

[cooper]

Yea, I agree with you guys. I saw the list of cars that have the 4.1 in them, so I think I'll call around and go that route. Thank you for saving me time and money!!!

Will the entire 4.1 fit in? I need to repace my mounts, and since I have to lift the engine a little bit...

Will anyone give me advice on how to convince my wife that it's a good idea to replace the 3.8 w/a 4.1

I appreciate the help and I'll keep you posted on my progress.

 

[87regal]

Tell her the 4.1 has 49 more cu. inches.....more Tq and HP and a rolled fillet crank.

If that doesnt do it, I dont know what will


And yes it will fit, basically the same engine with a few differences from the factory, that info can by found on Rich's "before black" site I believe.

 

[RCI2990]

cooper,the only difference between the 3.8 and the 4.1 is the bore size.other than that their identical.even the buick 350 is just a 3.8 with two extra cylinders.i went with the 3.8 because it was the original motor in my car and i had already started rebuilding the motor.

 

[Freddie's Buick]

Hey Cooper...

Do a compression test on the engine before swapping on a 4.1. Unless you're putting in a rebuilt, or a low miles 4.1 why change? The 3.8 is a damn good V-6, (so is the 4.1. if you have one in there already ).

At the very least consider doing the 4.1 intake & carb swap! I did, (kicks butt).

All the sensors on the Q-jet CCC are the same as on the Duel-Jet. If you decide to go this route, once you get into it you got all the help you could possibly need on this forum.

Oh yeah....here's the by-pass for the tranny should you decide to get rid of the ECM system. It's a 'standard type' of torque converter power-switch kit. #80217 for all '81-89 THM-350C's, (C- means computer controlled). Goes for about $50.00 and it's made by B & M. On the Summit catalog it's part #BMM-80217. $47.39 and $6.95 for shipping.

Good Luck!!

 

[RCI2990]

hey freddie what happened to your post count?did you have to reregister.

 

[cooper]

I am going to stick with 3.8. Before I bought the car I did a compression check to see if was worth buying. The only thing wrong is related to the old Dual Jet. Everytime I try to fix something that's not broke, I get in trouble.

I went to a local yard yesterday evening and they're going to check their inventory for a 4.1 intake and Q-Jet. If they don't have one, I think they can probably locate one for me. It's definitely going to be cheaper this way.

Now that I have a plan, I may sell my 99 pickup when my Regal is going. I'd love to loose the payment.

I'm sure I'll have more questions as I do things, so thanks in advance. I wish I could be of help to others, but my experience is with Dodge 4x4s. Live and Learn.

 

[Freddie's Buick]

Originally posted by RCI2990
hey freddie what happened to your post count?did you have to reregister.

Yep! Something screwed up when the forum went down and now I'm one of the most un-senior member. OH WELL!!!

Anyway it's nice to start up again. It's kinda like ripping my engine apart a few times during the summer.....been there done dat.