adjustable waste gate ecm swap scamaster ??

[billygeg]

Hey guys!

Just have three quick questions!

1st question is how do I modify the waste gate actuator arm? I know it involves cutting it but is my goal to extend it or shorten it? How much do I have to extend it or shorten it? I cut the arm tonight and threaded it with a 5/16" die but the threads seem very shallow. The 1/4" die wont fit. Is there a size between that I should use?

Next question is how do I know if my turbo is working? Is there a way to tell without driving it...Its away for the winter in my garage while I do my upgrades for summer.

Last but not least, Can I swap the 85 ecm with the 87 ecm without changing the entire harness to a 87? I know Ive been talking about doing this but the time has come and I am ready. I know I have to change the MAF, get a turbo tweak chip and preferably a scanmaster but tonight I was on the phone with someone who said, " You cant change the ecm to a 87 unless you change the harness as well. As far as I understood you could but after he told me that I wanted to ask you guys again just to make sure.

Sorry! One more question! Which scanmaster would be the best for me to get. As of this point my car is stock as far as I can tell. The only mods done or will be done by the summer are dual exhaust, adjustable wastegate, electric fan, 87 ecm, 87 maf, turbo tweak chip.

Sorry for all the ??? guys...Just want to get the ball rolling but want to make sure its rolling in the right direction!


Thanks! Bill

 

[fmster]

Check this out.http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/images/Adj_wastegate.JPG

 

[billygeg]

adjustable wastegate

While my car is off the wastegate actuator is in the position as seen in the pic below. It appears its all the way out. Is it? Or does it come out more then that? If its all the way out and the wastegate is almost completely closed then what? I took the quarter inch off the rod and it bairly makes it to the wastegate arm that it clips too.

 

[1 in 2000]

I used the 1/4-20 thread, it's a deep cut but it worked, had to bevel the end of the rod with a grinder to get the dye started. I started with mine about 1/8" short and had to pull on the rod to make the connection to the wastegate.


"If its all the way out and the wastegate is almost completely closed then what?"

Replace it, it's bad. I believe GBODYPARTS had some used ones not too long ago.

 

[BRAD_PADGETT]

Hey guys!

Just have three quick questions!

Next question is how do I know if my turbo is working? Is there a way to tell without driving it...Its away for the winter in my garage while I do my upgrades for summer.

Last but not least, Can I swap the 85 ecm with the 87 ecm without changing the entire harness to a 87? I know Ive been talking about doing this but the time has come and I am ready. I know I have to change the MAF, get a turbo tweak chip and preferably a scanmaster but tonight I was on the phone with someone who said, " You cant change the ecm to a 87 unless you change the harness as well. As far as I understood you could but after he told me that I wanted to ask you guys again just to make sure.

Sorry! One more question! Which scanmaster would be the best for me to get. As of this point my car is stock as far as I can tell. The only mods done or will be done by the summer are dual exhaust, adjustable wastegate, electric fan, 87 ecm, 87 maf, turbo tweak chip.

Sorry for all the ??? guys...Just want to get the ball rolling but want to make sure its rolling in the right direction!


Thanks! Bill

One test of the turbo is the ability to create boost in drive with your foot on the brake. Bring up the RPM and check the boost gauge. Don't put the car through the wall. If you can get several pounds of boost this is a good sign without driving the car.

The individual who told you that you can't upgrade the ECM to the 87 without upgrading the wiring harness is clearly clueless. All that is needed is your small 85 calpak chip and a new TT Chip programmed to eliminate the MAT sensor.

The 87 MAF issue is best solved with a translator and a used LT1 MAF from the boneyard. This avoids the high cost of original 87 MAF and the reman MAF problem. The electric fan is easily solved as well. Post when you are ready for this issue. Many ways to do this.

The Scanmaster is very good as a starter scan tool. The powerlogger is better and gives you more options but is not as easy to use(laptop). I actually still use my Scanmaster. Good luck- Brad

 

[billygeg]

Yeah thats what I ended up doing today. I beveled the end to start it. Got that done but if its bad its just a waste now. Does the actuator push out to open the waste gate and suck in to close it? If so the rod seems to short...The picture above is the unit. I dont know much but it appears to be all the way out to me, Unless it pushed out more. That would be the only logical explaination. Because in the position its in the wastegate is almost completely closed. If the actuator sucks in anymore it wont do anything because the gate is already closed. Is there a test with the unit off the car that I can do too make sure its working?
Thanks!

 

[turbonut85]

One test of the turbo is the ability to create boost in drive with your foot on the brake. Bring up the RPM and check the boost gauge. Don't put the car through the wall. If you can get several pounds of boost this is a good sign without driving the car.

The individual who told you that you can't upgrade the ECM to the 87 without upgrading the wiring harness is clearly clueless. All that is needed is your small 85 calpak chip and a new TT Chip programmed to eliminate the MAT sensor.

The 87 MAF issue is best solved with a translator and a used LT1 MAF from the boneyard. This avoids the high cost of original 87 MAF and the reman MAF problem. The electric fan is easily solved as well. Post when you are ready for this issue. Many ways to do this.

The Scanmaster is very good as a starter scan tool. The powerlogger is better and gives you more options but is not as easy to use(laptop). I actually still use my Scanmaster. Good luck- Brad

Good advise here. You can do the 87 ECM upgrade with the original harness. In your situation, I'd go with the LT1 MAF and Translator as well. As far as the wastegate is concerned, you would want to be able to maintain the current length with the option to shorten the arm...shortening increases boost. When I made mine adjustable, i used the end off another adjustable wastegate actuator. The threads were 1/4-28. Finer than the 1/4-20 threads. HTH ---Keith

 

[billygeg]

One test of the turbo is the ability to create boost in drive with your foot on the brake. Bring up the RPM and check the boost gauge. Don't put the car through the wall. If you can get several pounds of boost this is a good sign without driving the car.

The individual who told you that you can't upgrade the ECM to the 87 without upgrading the wiring harness is clearly clueless. All that is needed is your small 85 calpak chip and a new TT Chip programmed to eliminate the MAT sensor.

The 87 MAF issue is best solved with a translator and a used LT1 MAF from the boneyard. This avoids the high cost of original 87 MAF and the reman MAF problem. The electric fan is easily solved as well. Post when you are ready for this issue. Many ways to do this.

The Scanmaster is very good as a starter scan tool. The powerlogger is better and gives you more options but is not as easy to use(laptop). I actually still use my Scanmaster. Good luck- Brad

Thanks Brad!
I thought I was good with the ecm and maf with thr turbo tweak but doesnt hurt to ask again. As for the turbo, I have the ****ty digital dash and the turbo is just a stupid light that doesnt even work. Any other ways to tell?

Thanks! Bill

 

[turbonut85]

Yeah thats what I ended up doing today. I beveled the end to start it. Got that done but if its bad its just a waste now. Does the actuator push out to open the waste gate and suck in to close it? If so the rod seems to short...The picture above is the unit. I dont know much but it appears to be all the way out to me, Unless it pushed out more. That would be the only logical explaination. Because in the position its in the wastegate is almost completely closed. If the actuator sucks in anymore it wont do anything because the gate is already closed. Is there a test with the unit off the car that I can do too make sure its working?
Thanks!

You are thinking opposite here... the actuator rod moves out to open the wastegate puck, thus limiting boost. you want the rod to pull the puck closed at idle or when the car is not running. When you reach your desired boost level, the rod moves out, (toward the passenger side of car) opening the wastegate puck and stopping the boost from building. You should have to pull the rod out of the actuator at least 1/8" just to get it on the puck.

 

[billygeg]

Is there a problem using the 87 MAF? I am already sort of in the process of buying one used pretty cheap...What is the translator? I was under the assumption that I just needed the 87 ecm, 87 MAf, turbo tweak chip, scanmaster, and I'd be set to go...If the LT1 maf is a better setup I will go with that, What cars could I find them on?
Thanks! Bill

 

[turbonut85]

Is there a problem using the 87 MAF? I am already sort of in the process of buying one used pretty cheap...What is the translator? I was under the assumption that I just needed the 87 ecm, 87 MAf, turbo tweak chip, scanmaster, and I'd be set to go...If the LT1 maf is a better setup I will go with that, What cars could I find them on?
Thanks! Bill

Using a stock 87 MAF is no problem at all. The only reason we (Brad and I) are suggesting the translator and the LT1 MAF is they are more readily available than a GOOD 87 stock MAF. The remaned ones are a crap-shoot at best. LT1 MAF's were on most GM small to medium bodied cars (grand am, camaros etc.) and are a dime a dozen in the junkyards. The translator is what you would need to invest in to use the LT1 MAF on your Buick...It "translates" the signal from the LT1 MAF so the 87 ECM can read it. This setup is more up-front cost, but will save you in the long run for sure. (I think the LT1 MAF has better throttle response off the line, too. JMO.) ---Keith

 

[billygeg]

Ok gotcha, So I wouldnt need the translator if I go with the 87 MAF then. I will see what happens...How much is a translator about?

Thanks again guys!

 

[BRAD_PADGETT]

Ok gotcha, So I wouldnt need the translator if I go with the 87 MAF then. I will see what happens...How much is a translator about?

Thanks again guys!

Translator new-$180. Used on this board? Take care. Brad

 

[billygeg]

I gotcha! I didnt realize the rod comes out more. I got it now!
Thanks!

 

[billygeg]

87 electric fan in 85

One test of the turbo is the ability to create boost in drive with your foot on the brake. Bring up the RPM and check the boost gauge. Don't put the car through the wall. If you can get several pounds of boost this is a good sign without driving the car.

The individual who told you that you can't upgrade the ECM to the 87 without upgrading the wiring harness is clearly clueless. All that is needed is your small 85 calpak chip and a new TT Chip programmed to eliminate the MAT sensor.

The 87 MAF issue is best solved with a translator and a used LT1 MAF from the boneyard. This avoids the high cost of original 87 MAF and the reman MAF problem. The electric fan is easily solved as well. Post when you are ready for this issue. Many ways to do this.

The Scanmaster is very good as a starter scan tool. The powerlogger is better and gives you more options but is not as easy to use(laptop). I actually still use my Scanmaster. Good luck- Brad

Got the fan today. It works which is a good start but there is a 3 wire connector on it which one wire is cut off...Do I need this wire? If so where does it connect to? It appears the wiring is wrong because when I connect 12 volts to the two remaining connector leads it shorts. I can solve that without a problem but need to know whether the + goes threw the resistor looking thing or the neutral. As for making it work on the 85 what do I have to do? I dont want to rig it with a switch...To me thats cheezy! I want it to come on, On its own... Also, Is the fan supposed to blow toward the rad or away? I think its away butwant to ake sure.
Thanks!

 

[billygeg]

fan pics sorry I forgot to post them in other reply

Here are the pics of the fan.

 

[bmackinnon]

The fan should blow towards the engine (pull air thru rad.). The 3 wire connector looks wired correctly. Ground (cut off), low speed (to the 'long' end of the ceramic resistor), high speed (to the end of the resistor closer to the fan motor (no resistance)). Resistor is in there to provide 2-speed fan operation. Some folks (alot) just jumper across the ceramic so the the fan always runs on high (when it's on)... you will need the fan relays and the associated 86/87 wiring to connect to the harness in order for the 86-87 ecm you are swapping to control the fan..

 

[BRAD_PADGETT]

The fan should blow towards the engine (pull air thru rad.). The 3 wire connector looks wired correctly. Ground (cut off), low speed (to the 'long' end of the ceramic resistor), high speed (to the end of the resistor closer to the fan motor (no resistance)). Resistor is in there to provide 2-speed fan operation. Some folks (alot) just jumper across the ceramic so the the fan always runs on high (when it's on)... you will need the fan relays and the associated 86/87 wiring to connect to the harness in order for the 86-87 ecm you are swapping to control the fan..

I used the Caspers 84/85 fan conversion kit which is the easy and more costly method. The good thing is that with this kit the TT chip automatically controls the fan. The bad thing about this kit is that it is set up for single fan only. I later added dual fans and kept blowing out the single relay included with the 84/85 fan conversion. I finally had to add the Caspers 86/87 dual relay fan conversion kit after the single relay. Take-care. Brad

 

[billygeg]

Hey Brad
Do you have a direct link to Caspers? I just searched the web and came up with casper the friggin ghost! lol!

Are there different kits? Is there one you recommend? I am doing the 87 ecm swap, MAF, TT chip, scanmaster and all that so I should be set to go with the kit you mentioned.

Thanks! Bill

 

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