Anyone injecting NITROMethane?

[Syclone0044]

Seems that Methanol is the second best fuel you can burn, second only to Nitromethane. According to http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question642.htm, "compared to gasoline, you can pump about 8 times more nitromethane into a cylinder of a given volume and still get complete combustion. Since nitromethane is not as dense as gasoline in terms of energy, so you do not get an 8-time improvement in terms of power. It is more like a 2.5-time improvement Still, you can double or triple your engine's horsepower simply by changing the fuel. That's a huge improvement!"

It just occurred to me where an easy source of Nitro could be located. I found a site http://rcclub.8m.com/index.4.htm, and it seems like Radio Control gas-engine Nitro glow fuel sounds very suitable at least in theory!! "10% Nitro" glow fuel is composed of 65% methanol (which we already know works and is safe), 25% castor oil (lubrication?) and 10% Nitromethane. I can easily go to my local hobby store and buy gallons of Nitro fuel in various Nitromethane percentages. Anyone tried this? It seems Nitromethane contains oxygen in it as part of the molecular structure and therefore acts almost like nitrous oxide in that it releases oxygen in the combustion process. NHRA Top Fuel dragsters operate on Nitromethane (and methanol) so clearly big power can be made with it. What are the drawbacks? Would a small percent be safe to try out on a stock GM gasoline motor? I've had fantastic success injecting many many gallons of 100% methanol so far up to the 530HP range on a stock 262CID longblock.

Josh Straub
1991 GMC Syclone
11.79 @ 114.18, stock longblock w/chip, PT-51 turbo, SMC alcohol.

 

[denn454]

i don't think that would work, at least not in the same way alochol would. alochol allows you to be able to run more boost by lowering the air temp. nitro would probably just be similar to nitrous.

as for the hobby fuel go for it! i'd start out with a quart of the 10% and turn your pump speed down low and see how it does. if it semes to work really good they make 20% nitro mix too. i think they go up to 65% for boats, but i'm not sure about that.

it probably wouldn't hurt to try it.

 

[Razor]

Sure its wonderful..

You first

Sorry I'd love to try it, but.. my pump cant handle oils..ohh well

 

[1badTTA]

Originally posted by Razor
Sure its wonderful..

You first

Sorry I'd love to try it, but.. my pump cant handle oils..ohh well

Actually, Castor oil isn't a petroleum product so you should be just fine.

I have seen it used in an NA car with about a 3% mix adn it worked wonders. It costs around $35-$40 for a gallon of 100% NitroMethane so just use a little mixed with the Methanol untill you figure out the perfect mixture.

I would try it but I don't have a pump and if I took the top off of my "reseviour" I don't think it would hold the propane for long

Sorry Razor, my excuse is better.

 

[Razor]

How bout this mix, 25 percent Nitro, 25 percent acetone, and 50 percent Methanol?

..

1BadTTA.. castor oil tastes funny

 

[1badTTA]

Originally posted by Razor
1BadTTA.. castor oil tastes funny

Yea but it is a welcome relief when you have Skydrol in your eyes

BTW, Skydrol is an aviation hydrolic fluid that burns like a SOB.

Why Acetone, is that to remove the nail polish from the valves?

How about 50% Hydrogen Peroxide (36% pure) and 25% Nitromethane and 25% Methanol with some dry ice added to make sure it is nice and cold.

 

[denn454]

what is this, a high school chemistry lab

 

[1badTTA]

Originally posted by denn454
what is this, a high school chemistry lab

The difference between this and a high school chemistry lab it that in school, you are trying to blow things up.

Your really close though.

 

[cjudd]

not sure on nitromethane but it probably contain "methane" which is CH4
and alcohols do contain oxygen,
methanol is nearly the same as methane only with a hydroxide bonded to the center carbon giving a C-O-H as well as three more Hydrogens bonded on the other sides. Not sure if anyone cares but there it is

and I have been lurking here for a while, just decided to register. This is an awesome site between this site and turbo mustangs, (which I found by accident and eventually found this place) I have learned a ton of info, and hope to try a JYTT this summer. It would probably be a Chevy powered, something but definetley not classy, just fast.

 

[denn454]

welcome cjudd, do you know the molecular make up of nitro? how about that of methanol? if you could get thoes two i'd imagine someone with a lot more chemistry experence than me should be able to look at the two and see what alochol works and if nitro could work.

now i want to go blow stuff up only not my stuff.

 

[Topjimmy]

Snow Performance is touting a "NitroBooster" additive to be used with their water/alky kits...opinions?
NitroBooster

 

[Razor]

Sounds like a terrific idea.. boost pressure set at 30 PSI..spray some nitro.. see what happens.. YAY..

You first

Sorry, I have no toes left from stepping on land mines.. I'm on the bleachers cheering anyone who wants to be first...

My Nitro crystal ball is broken..so its of no use as well..

 

[Syclone0044]

I will experiment in Spring.

 

[denn454]

i'm really wondering how it would work out, after reading that thing on the bottle of nitro booster. They say it donates o2 and acts as a chemical supercharger. sound familliar, hum... maybe nitrous? if injected like alochol it might add power, line no2, or allow more bost like alky. what if it could do both? I know if you pour nitro on your hands its really cold, like methanol is, and if you have any cuts on your hands have fun (ouch) . This is just a thought, but if you mixed it 50-50 with alochol you might be able to get bth benefits out of it. The next problem would be buying the stuff. I know it was used to make the bomb in the oklohoma city thing with timmothy mcvey (i can't spell..) Maybe its easier to get now, but you might still have some hoops to jump through if you want straight nitro. most hoby stores only sell 10, 20, and sometimes 30% nitro mix. check for a hoby store that does a lot of boats, they can run higher %'s. good luck hope nothing blows up, and have fun!

 

[AnArKey]

You are looking for a liquid oxidizer. Liquid nitrous basically.

I have done lots of study into this. What I came up with is Nitro is a BAD idea. It's a very knock happy compound. VERY. Even a little in the cylinder has the potential to pre-detonate badly, and when it does, that will in turn ignite the gas, methanol and whatever cocktail of fuels are in there. In other words, BOOM.

Now, Hydrogen Peroxide on the other hand, seems to be perfect. I did all the math on it and what I came up with is that it will behave like nitrous. H2O2 is pretty stable, but it breaks down faster and faster with temperature. My calculations indicated that it would decompose at a snails pace up until ignition, then it would decompose almost instantly. Same process as N20. Keep the O2 together in the molecule until you want it there, during combustion, at which point it breaks free. The leftover water will counteract the knock inducing characteristics of the extra oxygen, so unlike N2O where you need to reduce timing and/or increase octane, you shouldn't need to with H2O2. The decomposition process of H2O2 actually releases a little energy of it's own (although about 5% of gasoline by weight), it adds some extra power that way.

You can even blend up a solution with the right amount of H2O2, and methanol (or ethanol), that will be AFR neutral. The extra oxygen and the extra fuel balance out. Just inject more and you get more power without a change in the final AFR. I think it was if you use a ~30% H202 solution (common mix, found it for $7/gal), and mix that 50/50 with methanol, it's balanced.

I haven't tried it yet, as my car has been down on a project for a long time. But if someone here is willing to try, start with a low concentration (5% H2O2), and work your way up. You should be able to get as much as a extra 100RWHP with a higher concentration and flow rate.

Oh yeah, and it's about a 1/3 of the usage cost of nitrous, HP/min/$.

 

[denn454]

is that 100% nitro that goes boom? model car engines have a ton of compression, making them prone to detonation, but they have no spark plug so its really not a big deal if it does detonate, it will just reverse dierction of stop if theres a one way bearing. the 80 something % might be able to wrk aginst its detonation tendencies.

peroxide does sound pertty good though.

 

[denn454]

is that 100% nitro that goes boom? model car engines have a ton of compression, making them prone to detonation, but they have no spark plug so its really not a big deal if it does detonate, it will just reverse dierction of stop if theres a one way bearing. the 80 something % might be able to wrk aginst its detonation tendencies.

peroxide does sound pertty good though.