best turbo for 11's (opinions appreciated)

[Intercooler]

I got an 11.61 and 11.52 on the same night running out of fuel @118 MPH on 20 PSI and pump gas. I know it would have went 11.20's with the Max-Effort fairly easily. I was using a 63 at the time but stepped down to a 61. I think even a 61 will take more than 23 PSI to go mid 11's down so probably not the choice for you. My opinion only since I had a 63 and that is with the goals you have just opt for the TE-45A and you are done! The price difference is well worth the couple of extra pennies!

 

[JToups386]

Jason:
The first thing that struck me funny was, you (IronEagle119) said you only have a 2000 stall. Is this correct? An original stock D5 stalls to 2400. I'm assuming there was a typo there. If not, you won't be running 12's, much less 11's.
It is amazing how many turbo options have been suggested, and the variances in ET's thereof. I personally think you have to evaluate the entire setup, and how it will be effected by a particular turbo. What do your heads flow, and at what rpm? What spec is your cam, and where does it run out? How heavy is your car? What do you mean by street trim, ie tires, fuel, etc?
There are so many factors involved here, that merely suggesting a turbo based on "what worked for someone else", is not a true analysis. Heck, I went 11.90's with my 70,000+ mile stock turbo @ 17-18psi, but that was because I ripped a 1.58 60'. You don't have to have the biggest turbo to go "X" ET, if other things are setup right. I would love to see what I might have run with the stocker, had I been able to run 20psi.
My point is, write down all the factors that are real to your particular application, and then call one of the accredited turbo outfits for advice, based on what your goals are. And yes, I've heard good things about John Craig, but I can also say good things about Harry Hruska at PTE too. Give it some thought...

 

[IronEagle119]

So it seems I was a little vague and confusing

Like I said early on I'm not thinking this is gonna happen overnight, but more like the next couple years(school definatly has to come first). Lets just scratch the whole 'Street Trim' term and here's what I'm looking for.

I want to take my full weight GN 3700+ into the 11's. I'll adjust my goal from there once I'm there but ultimatly I'm looking to be close to bottoming out the 11's when it's all said and done. For the rubber on the rear Drag radials or ET streets are definatly in the picture. I will have the intake and head's gone over throughly, bigger cam, a 3000-3200 stall convertor(art carr or ???), power plate, BstC, bigger injectors, suspension mods (UCA/LCA's, larger sway bar), alot of tuning and whatever else it takes in time. But I only want to buy the turbo once, I'll deal with turbo lag till i get a new convertor. Sorry for the confusion I'll try to be more specific next time

 

[Intercooler]

Originally posted by JToups386
Jason:
The first thing that struck me funny was, you (IronEagle119) said you only have a 2000 stall. Is this correct? An original stock D5 stalls to 2400. I'm assuming there was a typo there. If not, you won't be running 12's, much less 11's.

I saw a T with a stock D-5 go 11.1-11.2 with a LT-70. He had a little lag off the line but when it started hitting she really moved! I think I posted it in The Lounge a month ago.

 

[JToups386]

Originally posted by Intercooler
I saw a T with a stock D-5 go 11.1-11.2 with a PT-70. He had a little lag off the line but when it started hitting she really moved! I think I posted it in The Lounge a month ago.

I'm not doubting being able to run well with the D5, however, his earlier post said he only had a 2000 stall, to which I mentioned that a stock D5 will stall 2400 from the factory. Maybe my wording was confusing...?

 

[Intercooler]

I dug it up. It is some pretty decent reading: http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43096

 

[IronEagle119]

that wasn't a typo, same jackass that works with my father(at the local GM parts warehouse) does alot of work on cars, but nothing on TR's, and he had my father convinced that a 2004r tranny from the boneyard and a convertor from ??? place and the place told him that their convertor was exact replacement for the D5 which I didn't know at the time, but i knew it wasn't as soon as i got in it and drove it the first time. I used that tranny to go to my friends house where his friend rebuilt my tranny and installed it for me and did an absolutly awesome job the tranny shifts very firm and is running great. But to make my long story short I took one in the @$$ and blew alot of money and last summer on my dads friend.

 

[JToups386]

Originally posted by IronEagle119
So it seems I was a little vague and confusing

Like I said early on I'm not thinking this is gonna happen overnight, but more like the next couple years(school definatly has to come first). Lets just scratch the whole 'Street Trim' term and here's what I'm looking for.

I want to take my full weight GN 3700+ into the 11's. I'll adjust my goal from there once I'm there but ultimatly I'm looking to be close to bottoming out the 11's when it's all said and done. For the rubber on the rear Drag radials or ET streets are definatly in the picture. I will have the intake and head's gone over throughly, bigger cam, a 3000-3200 stall convertor(art carr or ???), power plate, BstC, bigger injectors, suspension mods (UCA/LCA's, larger sway bar), alot of tuning and whatever else it takes in time. But I only want to buy the turbo once, I'll deal with turbo lag till i get a new convertor. Sorry for the confusion I'll try to be more specific next time

I guess now my thoughts would lean towards; why would you worry about spending the money on a turbo upgrade right now, when you could clearly make much higher gains in other areas while still using your stock turbo? As I mentioned, my stock turbo took me to consistent 11.90's, but it was the other upgrades that helped it do that. IMO, I would spend money on higher stall converter, tires, heads, cam, intercooler first, before I even thought about upgrading the turbo. (in that particular order too).

You will regret putting a bigger turbo on the car, and having it feel like a pig until it's well into the run, if you go that route. I put a larger turbo on one of mine, with the big .82 exhaust housing, and I absolutely hated the car with it, because it felt like a slug until I was nearly done with a pass. I went back to the stocker, and got better results with much more enjoyment, until the other complimentary mods were added. Everything should be done in the proper order, if you want to feel the benefits right off. Therefore, if you've got money to spend right now, you might want to consider the methodology I listed above. Hope that helps ya'...

 

[IronEagle119]

hmm, so I should wait till I get all of that done then, well thx for stopping me from making a mistake. Something I'm a lil unclear on is why would I need the higher stall convertor first, my stocker actually has no spool up problems at all it spools almost instantly to 15 PSI.

 

[JToups386]

Originally posted by IronEagle119
hmm, so I should wait till I get all of that done then, well thx for stopping me from making a mistake. Something I'm a lil unclear on is why would I need the higher stall convertor first, my stocker actually has no spool up problems at all it spools almost instantly to 15 PSI.

Well, you mentioned that your stall was only a 2000, which sounds like a stock F-body/Vette stall of the 2004R era (actually they were more like 1600-1800 in those apps.). If that's the case, then you've definitely got room to grow in the stall category, and with substantial gains to be had. With soft tires, a good stall converter will benefit you greater than the other things mentioned. Remember, torque is what gets the car moving, and HP is what carries it down the track afterwards. If you buy a good Precision Vigilante, or Yank converter, with the high torque multiplication factors they have, you'll gain alot in ET, and it will give you that spine shaking launch that makes these cars so much fun! I only had a TCI 3000 in my T, which yielded a 1.58 60' and an 11.90 with a stock turbo. I always refer to that because it shows that there are ways to run well without a gigantic turbo. However, my new setup will have a large one, but I'll have all the other components to compliment and use it. Another converter example would be, I went 12.97 with my '99 stock LS1 Z28, but after adding the Precision Vigilante 0-pump 2800 stall to it, I went 12.50, numerous times. It was all due to the converter, as no other changes were made. That's quite a gain for the investment, don't ya' think? I'm certainly hoping to upgrade to the Precision 3500 stall in my Buick, once finances allow it too.

As I said before, you've got the means to go quicker, and still make it fun to drive, and wait until the other things are in place before upgrading the turbo.

Anyway, I think you can see my point now. Feel free to email me if you want more input or detail, so I don't take up too much room on this same post. However, I'll answer your questions, per my data either way... Enjoy.

 

[REDS HOT AIR]

Originally posted by NEARING
Red will you be ready for Richmond Saturday?
I'am not going to VMP friday to race, just to buy some gas!

nope computer wont be back till first of week and chips are ordered but will be first of week on them too.

i plan on going to richmond next friday not this one when they have test n tune.

oh yea its gonna be fun if we both get kicked off the track..

try and see if you can come up next friday

 

[rkreigh]

I'll throw my two cents in. spend once. if you have the $$$ get a 63 or a TE45 (pretty much the same turbo). that turbo will flow really well, and not heat the air as much allowing better "quality" air at the 25 PSI boost level.

however, don't bother with a big turbo like this unless you step up to a nice convertor to go with it.

matching the turbo to the convertor is very important.

also, but AT LEAST the 55s with a big turbo, or you will likely max out the MSD 50s.

my experience is that as soon as you really ARE going mid 11s the 10s will be so tempting you want to go 10s.

buy the parts to take you 10s, and they "back down" the tune to go 11s and the car will last longer than pushing a small turbo to the limits to reach the 11s.

hope this helps.

 

[lrover2]

I'll throw my two cents in. spend once.

Now that was well said. I totally agree with rkreigh!

 

[Two Lane]

Ball-bearing Turbo

Save up for a BB-turbo...much quicker spool-up, so less converter is required on street.

HTH