Car is falling on it's face.

K

kenny

No turbo, no care.
Joined
Apr 13, 2002
This is a weird problem and hard to describe. It seems like spark is getting blown out.

Under load (normally 10psi or more) the car just falls on its face. It makes no power and goes nowhere. Boost gauge reads 20psi at WOT, scanmaster shows 780-830 o2's, 0 knock (every one and awhile 1 or 2 degrees).

I changed the coil pack, wires and checked the gap on the plugs (AC CR42TS - .035) - nothing worked.

I'm going to try a smaller gap, somewhere in between .028 and .030 (just to see if it truly is blowing spark out).

The coil pack I bought wasn't a Delco. I bought a GP/Sorensen coil pack as it was $60 cheaper than the Delco. From everything I've ever seen/heard aftermarket coil packs work just as well as the Delco's, which is why I bought it. Is this ture, or should I have bought the Delco?

Could this be a bad ignition module? :confused:
 
$60 cheaper then GM???...where did you check for GM coil packs
..Kirban has them for $49...JMO but I would get a GM coil pack which may or may not cure your problem...I'm sure many have run with aftermarket ones with no problems...not me...I try to stick with GM stuff as much as possible...if you don't go that route at least use Caspers coil pack/module tester to check things out
 
What exhaust systems are y'all using?

Something new or was it always like that?

Valve springs?
 
I bought the coil pack at Advance Auto. Their price for the GM coil pack was like $100, the one I bought (GP/Sorensen) was $40.

I try to stay all GM as well, but I wanted to get the car ready to take it to the track and figured the coil pack would work well enough to get it out there. That didn't happen.

Exhaust: THDP, dual 3 inch ATR w/ pitbulls.

The problem just started within the last week or two. It doesn't always do it, which is strange.

Sometimes it feels like the transmission is slipping, but I highly doubt that as the tranny was rebuilt by Vince Janis less than 500 miles ago.

Don't think it would be valve springs as the motor is a 14k mile GM crate.

I'm still leaning towards something with the ignition... opinions?
 
My car did the same thing. It turned out to be fuel related.

Replace fuel filter and verify 1 psi fuel pressure for every pound of boost pressure. At 20 PSI boost, you should have around 60 psi fuel pressure.

If your fuel pressure falls off at higher boost levels, it's time for a new pump.

Good luck!
 
I agree it sounds like an ignition problem. Does this only happen a WOT or cruising as well? If it's at WOT then see if you can borrow someone elses ignition module and then retest. If you do end up buying one deffinetly make sure you get the AC delco brand TypeII igition module.
 
Originally posted by Tow Man
My car did the same thing. It turned out to be fuel related.

Replace fuel filter and verify 1 psi fuel pressure for every pound of boost pressure. At 20 PSI boost, you should have around 60 psi fuel pressure.

If your fuel pressure falls off at higher boost levels, it's time for a new pump.

Good luck!
Click to expand...

Fuel pressure seems normal. O2's would read lean if it where not getting fuel and I would be seeing knock. It really shouldn't be a fuel pump (it's an ATR double pumper, about a year old).

Originally posted by boostedmaxPSI
I agree it sounds like an ignition problem. Does this only happen a WOT or cruising as well? If it's at WOT then see if you can borrow someone elses ignition module and then retest. If you do end up buying one deffinetly make sure you get the AC delco brand TypeII igition module.
Click to expand...

So the ignition module could cause weak spark? It's about the only thing I haven't changed, but not sure if I should buy a new one or not. I think I have one laying around here somewhere... so I'll start digging tomorrow. Finally have time to work on it and see if this small gap changed anything.

It's both, WOT and cruising. It doesn't always do it though, some times it will actually pull like it should. :confused:
 
Before buying try to borrow a KNOWN good one from a freind. Should be less than a 10 minute swap.

Did you recently wash under the hood of the car? This is a common problem that can surface from it.

When you remove the coil from the coil pack make check the gell on this ignition module to see if the wires have left a reddish tint mark. This would indicate an overheating problem and may be traced to a poot ground.

Good luck!
 
Originally posted by boostedmaxPSI
Before buying try to borrow a KNOWN good one from a freind. Should be less than a 10 minute swap.

Did you recently wash under the hood of the car? This is a common problem that can surface from it.

When you remove the coil from the coil pack make check the gell on this ignition module to see if the wires have left a reddish tint mark. This would indicate an overheating problem and may be traced to a poot ground.

Good luck!
Click to expand...

I wish I could get a KNOWN good one. I don't really hang out with any local turbo Buick people.

I haven't washed under the hood.

I'll make sure to look.

What are your opinions of aftermarket coil packs?
 
I've replaced a few and have tried to pair up a good coil with a weak ignition module only to kill my IM again. What i've learned from this is get them both new at the same time atleast I've had better luck this time around.

Also do yourself a favor and just spring for a new AC delco unit the IM should be around $150 and coilpack should be anywhere from $45 to $90. Depends on who you go thru.
 
How do you like your TE-60? is it streetable ie lag? What type/kind of stall do you have? I'm ready to upgrade.
 
I love the TE60. Lag is minimal. From a 40 roll it will spin the tires (BFG Drag Radials - 275/50's). Converter is an Art Carr 9inch non-lockup. I mainly drive the car on the street, so I'd say it's very streetable. A lockup might be a better choice though.

I'll try to get a hold of some people tomorrow and see if I can't dig up an ignition module. $150 isn't too bad, but I would hate to spend that if I don't have to.
 
Not sure what that means...

Quote: "and may be traced to a poot ground."
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Poot ground? What da...

How did the Litter Box get under the hood in the first place?

Hehehehe...hehehehe...hehehe...my sides hurt!


:)
 
Originally posted by boostedmaxPSI
I've replaced a few and have tried to pair up a good coil with a weak ignition module only to kill my IM again. What i've learned from this is get them both new at the same time atleast I've had better luck this time around.

Also do yourself a favor and just spring for a new AC delco unit the IM should be around $150 and coilpack should be anywhere from $45 to $90. Depends on who you go thru.
Click to expand...

Not here. I just replaced both and its $200+ for a good quality module and almost $100 for a decent coil pack. I ended up getting an $85 module from Advance Auto because I was broke. We'll see how long it lasts, but it works good right now
 
Coil paks??

I'd recommend another purchase first. A CASPER'S coil pak tester!
If you test w/ 1 and find the coil bad, like the 1-4 coil, U swap the wires on the module to another coil and retest.If it now shows the second coil bad, the problem is the module, not the coilpak..
The ohm test is, IMO, useless.. U just more or less proved it.. The OHM meter places no load on the system, your car runs OK if the cylinder pressure is down, [low load] Boost goes up, cyl press. goes up, fire goes out??
As for replacement of the entire system..?? I have what I think is the ORIGINAL 87 module on my car and it works great!! New coilpak.. found it w/ my CASPERS tester!;)
He also makes a neat plug wire test kit.. Plugs in between 2 wires and is used w/ the coil pak tester...

My story and I'm stickin to it!:D :D :D
 
I've tried the CASPERS on two different occations and both times the ignition module looked good giving a nice spark however, the problem still existed and still turned out to still be the ignition module.

Here's a quick test for you Kenny. Take an ohm meter and measure the coil pack from front to back where you would plug the sparkplug wire's and you should measure between 11- 13k ohm. This is with the coil still on the ignition module during your test.


and TWO LANE

Get off that crack and get some help!! What the heck are you talking about. Just playing of course.:)
 
Originally posted by boostedmaxPSI
I've tried the CASPERS on two different occations and both times the ignition module looked good giving a nice spark however, the problem still existed and still turned out to still be the ignition module.

Here's a quick test for you Kenny. Take an ohm meter and measure the coil pack from front to back where you would plug the sparkplug wire's and you should measure between 11- 13k ohm. This is with the coil still on the ignition module during your test.


and TWO LANE

Get off that crack and get some help!! What the heck are you talking about. Just playing of course.:)
Click to expand...

What do you hook the test wires to.
 
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