I no longer use Paypal, here's why

[413turbo]

I've sold alot of buick parts to many people here and there, i've also bought alot of them.

I do this for some profit to support my car build. sometimes i would break even, other times i would actually make a few dollars.

So here's the story:
i had a block for sale, i needed the money or i would have kept it. no one on the board wanted it, so it went to ebay. it got sold to a man in texas (we'll call him mr.crook for now).

so, i list this block on ebay. i state just what it is. it is a 3.8 (109) block with billit mains that has all the machine work done. that it also has a starter bolt pad that had been re-paired. i also posted 3 or 4 pictures of the block.

now mr.crook comes and bids on it. a week goes by and he never asks any questions. so i pack it and send it to mr.crook. well mr.crook calls me and says that everything checked out good, but that he is concerned with the starter pad repair and could i pay to have it re-done or give him a refund. i tell mr.crook that i don't like to do refunds, that it has left me, i would have to have it checked back out. and that i stated in the listing that it had been repaired. mr.crook says he needs the internals, so i share some good info with him, tell him about 4.1's and educate him on how to get a whole motor cheap for his internals. i guess i gave him wayyyy to much good info, this is going to bite me back.

so the next day mr.crook emails me and tells me that he will go thru paypal to get his money back. that it is not as described. so i go thru the paypal chanels, and low and behold they say to give him a refund. even though it is exactly as described and had pictures also.

so mr.crook sends the block back to the wrong address. i track it down.
mr.crook has done grinded on this block
mr.crook has welded on this block
mr.crook has ran a dingleberry thru a perfect hone
mr.crook has replaced all the brass plugs with metal ones
mr.crook didn't clean the inside before putting plugs in it
mr.crook took a good block and made it useless

so of couarse i call paypal and the police. the police come make a report and verify that it is not what is listed or pictured on the ebay listing. i send it to paypal, paypal says it is not in the right format. that the officer didn't dot this "i" and cross this "t". i tell them that this is what i got from him, and that it is what i can swear to in court. so they say to give him a refund, which i appeal. paypal, now wants more info. so i get three quotes to repair just the grinding and welding. paypal then claims that those aren't good enough, and request that it be done in a way which would be immpossible to provide.

So, now my credit will be damaged, I'll be stuck with something that would have made a super-nice street motor, but is now useless. all because mr.crook didn't know his ass from a hole in the ground and thought it would be cool to get some engine building experience at my expense.


But mr.crook needs call me and try to work something out. this isn't over yet.

 

[Rubicon 327]

That Blows!!

I hope you can get some sort of satisfaction out of that mess.:frown:

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

That sux...maybe Joe 1320 can help you out with the problem

 

[413turbo]

i just got to find another way to accept payments. as it cools down, i want to start going to the yards again. it's kind of like a hobby for me. plus its cool to make those rare good finds and be able to get people the stuff they need for their cars. we would load up and try to hit every yard in a state in a weeks time last year.

and then, maybe i need to call it quits. last motor i bought for alot of money, it was said to be running, but found out it was sleeved, rebuilt poorly and a total loss.

plus with my health and age, going to a yard really takes a toll on me now. it took me a whole week to recover from the last yard day.

all i wanted was to take a finished car to the nationals for show and race, yeah, the dream and goal was to take first in both, but just placing -i'd have been estatic. now that my car is rear-ended, i'm just depressed.
i have more time to do other stuff, but i just don't feel like it. i can't even walk into the garage, it's too depressing. 2 solid years of work, every dime i didn't have, everything i put into that car, all gone. just sitting there with no positive outlook. his insurance company has left me suffering in my own little hell. a not so special place.

i got a rotator cuff that is torn, it hurts, i wonder if i'll ever be able to use my arm again. i might take another pain pill, i've magaged to go all day so far without one. they help the pain some, but it still comes thru real sharp like be stbbed at times. but the pills leave me knawing at my gums, sweating, makes me swallow alot, upsets my stomach, and just makes me feel out there. it's a whole another kind of hell.

i think i might really go think about crying now.

 

[413turbo]

That sux...maybe Joe 1320 can help you out with the problem

hmm, i need an attourney in texas. i've called the courts, i would have to go there, it'll be a hundred bucks to file.

i'm not a complete *******, i understand after i talked to mr.crook that he had no idea what he was getting into or even doing. it's like the addage" don't take your buick to a chevy builder".. and with that said and that being how i see it, i don't mind taking some of the loss.
but to stick it all to me. here's what i invested:
i bought the motor
i had a shop check it out good
i stored it properly
thought about building it, had another shop check it out
didn't have the money to do it
stored it
decided to try a budget build 4.1 (of which i only have a clean block so far)
needed to sell it

you add all that up and 200 to ship it, it's a chunk plus, this was a true standard bore block.

what gets me is that he called wanting me to fix it to his liking or give a refund, my silent partner said no; but i was inclined to give him something back. and i told him i would have to think about it, he didn't call at a conveinent time at all, i had a trailer flat on the side of the interstate at the time. but he didn't call me back, just went straight to paypal, ofcouarse he may have known that he or his shop had really screwed it up beyond use by then also.

 

[smoke20]

A member on here did the same thing to me, he got a refund and the ass still has my parts, i sent everything that paypal wanted and i get ****ed

 

[413turbo]

A member on here did the same thing to me, he got a refund and the ass still has my parts, i sent everything that paypal wanted and i get ****ed

yeah, that was what really blowed, i tell them how by their contract that 13.4 (i think) that it was NOT *not as described.
they then tell me to read 13.6 (i think) which says they are paypal, they can do what they want, and I have to go along with it.

i tell them that i did everything i was supposed to. that i have often sold stuff that had some defect, that i would list and picture it.
to read my feedback, most people would leave feedback saying that it exceeded their expectations. i didn't want anybody to be surprised or mislead.

they (paypal) told me that was the cost of doing business, and that it happens and i couldn't please everybody

even their collections dept. told me it was a credit card chargeback, and no matter what i did, that he would be given a refund.

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

Make sure you do your rehab for that rotator cuff and it'll get better. My dad ripped his good and was back to shooting his shot gun in like 2 months...he did his rehab hardcore though, he gets nutty when he can't shoot his gun. And just remember it can't rain every day...things will get better for ya...just hang in there

 

[WeAreVenom]

This is why I've always stayed away from ebay and paypal. Sure, it's convenient and there are tons of deals to be had, but at what price? It really sucks that this happened to you.

Good luck.

 

[413turbo]

Make sure you do your rehab for that rotator cuff and it'll get better. My dad ripped his good and was back to shooting his shot gun in like 2 months...he did his rehab hardcore though, he gets nutty when he can't shoot his gun. And just remember it can't rain every day...things will get better for ya...just hang in there

thanks. the doc says it will get better, but it just keeps hurting more and more.


here's a short history on my car, what i have so far:


My dad, bought the Grand National new Back in 1986. He had went to the dealership looking for a corvette, but thanks to a sharp salesman that insisted on a test drive, my dad's mind was changed and he became one of the 3 people in the Birmingham area to own the new intercooled Grand National.
I can still remember those days. As kids, my sister and I would beg him to "hit the turbo boost". It would put us back in the seat and we would try to lean forward to no avail. My dad allways kept the car in the garage, and he would wash and wax it with amour all every weekend. The car allways had a shine, and was never dirty.
Once I turned turned about 13 years old, I started builing up stock to drive the car. I would clean it inside and out every weekend, all in the hopes that he would let me drive it once i was a little older. And all that hard work paid off, somewhat. Once I got my learners permit, He would let my drive allmost anytime we went somewhere. And I remember those days too. I would sometimes get a little too happy with the turbo boost, and he would look at me at say,"get out of it". One time he said, "If you don't quit getting into it too much, i'm going to quit letting you drive"; from then on, I would still get on it, but in moderation. And after I got my license, he let me take it out a few times without him in it. I knew he would kill me if anything happened to his baby, so I was allways extra careful.

Then Tragedy Struck, Hard....
It was late in 1997, he called one night while I was out. He said that someone had stole the car, and that if I saw it; to call the police. I never saw my dad cry much, but he cried over the loss of his car; I cried, also. The whole family and friends all spilt-up and we drove every day and night for a week and a half looking for the Grand National. We never really gave up looking, but faced the reality that it was probably gone forever.
Dad and I looked for another Grand National, but none of them were like his. They had all been wrecked, not cared for, raced, etc... We couldn't find one that was like his, so he decided to buy a used Cadilac and keep looking.

Hope Restored, somewhat.....
The police called about a month and a half later, they had found his car. We got dressed, and Dad, Mom, and I went to statewide towing to see what was left. There wasn't much left, at all.
It was horible; the beatiful Grand National was now a roof, 2 quater panels, and the powertrain sitting on some mix-matched tires and rims, with a concrete block for a seat. Dad took pictures, and we left for home. The car followed, it may have been destroyed, but it was back home.
When i asked dad what he was going to do with it, and if i could have it to fix back up, he replied, "no, that it was still his, he still missed it, and that i could help him fix it back up". but he said that he wasn't going to re-build it to original condition, that it would costs twice as much as it costs when new, to do that. He said that he would now just make it a fast sleeper, and do the things that he had always kept from doing - making modifications that would have hurt the value of it. He bought 2 other regals to use as donor cars, but he never did start re-building it. I don't know, but I think everytime he started to work on it, that it just hurt too much. So the cars and all the parts sat. But we did change the oil, and crank it up for a few minutes every once in awhile.

Passed on.....
Well, dad died in 2002 from a massive stroke. I had to keep the Grand National, it meant way too much to him, and me. So shortly after he died, I got all the donor parts installed, and had the car in a whole car state. This was by no means a restoration, but it would be easier to store 1 complete car, instead of 2 cars. I took it out, and drove it one day, but it just didn'e feel the same. So, I put it into a storage state, and let it stay there. It was not forgotten, I would think of it from time to time, and it would bring back the great memories of my dad, and all the fun we had when he had the car. The fishing trips, the car shows, the time my friend Chad and I got so dirty and muddy, that we had to ride home in the trunk- No kidding. we rode home, holding the trunk cracked, for 5 or 6 miles, but this was in the late 80's.

The Great Revival.....
I had received word that the car was in danger. People had taken a notice of it, and had been trying to buy it. It was only a matter of time before it would be stolen again. I decided that after 5 years of dad being gone, that it was time to bring his baby back home, and right back to the condition with the love he had always put into it. Money was no object, Pain not a factor, this was the one thing that dad Loved and we shared. And it going to be Born Again, come hell to high water and if it put me futher into the poor house. I made the faithful journey to the cars resting place, assesed it's condition, and started the plans for its return. Then a month later, it was on a trailer, making the slow ride home.

The Memories continue...
And what a beast it was, never had to be raced, sitting there all black with a mean stance and the dark windows. You knew just by looking, this was a machine that would be trouble, you didn't want to tangle with it. O' sure, people would talk thier smack, and dad would let them. There was never a doubt in my mind. And the offers, WOW. I watched a guy offer dad a brand new corvette for his car once, and he turned it down. I said,"dad, you always wanted a corvette- why didn't you take it", he would reply, "That was before I had my car, I don't want a Corvette now". People would notice the car, and make vein attempts to purchase it. This was something I was soon to be experiencing myself.

The Beast Breathes....
Within a week of it's noted return, The Great Grand National was alive. It was a little sick, but it was cranked and running. No one could believe it. A few little tune-ups, and it was back to normal. Purred like a kitten as it sat idleing, Roared like the King of the Jungled with a little gas. Knowing now, that it would be a running car again, was such a relief and a blessing.

Dealing with the State, a long ordeal....
Having the car running was a relief, but I still had to go thru the state title office. I can't put into words the ordeal that was. I'll just say it was long, tedious, and very time consuming. They wanted stuff that couldn't be provided, they requested the impossible, and their requirments made the re-build have to go backwards. Had they not been involved, the car would have been a true "frame off" restroration. But I complied, and did what had to be done to satisfy the state requirements. They bigest thing was they wanted everything put together and nothing painted, where I would have rather stripped everything and have it all painted before I put it together. But the inspector came out, and even he was shocked and made several compliments on the progress and how well everything had been done. but there were still problems, the milage got printed wrong, then became exempt, the model got printed wrong. Their was no getting this stuff corrected, but life goes on.

And the Real Re-Build Begins....
Now that the title is fixed and it is street legal, I start working on the details. There is no way i could ever be paid for the time it took. It was almost like having 2 full-time jobs. Between buying parts and getting everything back to showroom new condition. I met a guy with an original low milage car I could look at, I would use his car as an example to know just how every bolt in mine should be. When he first saw my car he said, " that is the most stock, un-molested engine that i think i've ever seen." I told him that dad never would do anything to hurt the value, but that he said it didn't matter now.

And it continues.....
I took a week to go to the GS Nationals in Bowling Green, Kentucky. I took $4,000.00 in cash. And since I was told that this would be the place to buy parts, that was my goal. I stayed the whole week, and while everyone else was wacthing the racing, I was steady vendor to vendor to racer. Trying to make deals on all the parts that i needed, parts that may have been in better condition than what i had. And deals where made, I may have left broke, with barely enough gas to make it home. But there was hardly room for me in my truck. I had the inside, the bed, the whole truck filled with parts. And the re-build continued.

 

[TexasT]

Man, that is quite an ordeal. I can see why you would be upset. This is why I don't use paypal. I have pretty much quit ebay too as most sellers want to be paid through paypal. Never for me. This is what a money order is for. This is why I rarely sell anything. Too much hassle. Easier to just give it or throw it away.

I am glad you are putting your/your dad's GN back together.

 

[413turbo]

well iwas, it was finished except paint. then i was rear-ended. now i don't know what's going to happen.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

My take on it:
1. Tell PP to stick in thier gigi, and cancel your acct.
2. A refund, if ANY, would be minus the frt, and PP charges.
3. He doesn't like it?? Tell him you'll punch his "TS" card, next time you see him.
Sometimes, you have to play HARDBALL... this is 1 of those times.

 

[novaderrik]

everything i do is cash. i sell the occasional thing on Craigslist, and i always bring the part to whoever i'm selling it to- i generally meet them half way.
that way, they don't know where i live or what else i've got that they might think would look better in their garage than mine.

 

[TexasT]

everything i do is cash. i sell the occasional thing on Craigslist, and i always bring the part to whoever i'm selling it to- i generally meet them half way.
that way, they don't know where i live or what else i've got that they might think would look better in their garage than mine.

A men novaderrik. Seems as it is too easy to lose things when people know where to go get them.

If you don't mind me asking, who was this Texas person(PM if you want) I don't like those who try to 'put one over' on others and would like to know who not to deal with.

 

[Little6pack]

I feel your PAIN. It is too bad you did not hold out for a local sale & deal face to face.

I deal with the Trash Buyers on Ebay occationally.

I was selling a brand new curtian for a shower stall (My wife did not like the color) still wrapped up never opened.

The buyer with grand total of 4 feedbacks left a negative that stated it was BAD QUALATY product

I Flipped out. I wrote her back & said we did not manufacture the item & do not sell product for them. We just were moving them along instead of returning to the store because it was like a year later. No retailer is going to take stuff back after 1 year.

at least she did not pull the money back from PP.

That is what SUKS about PAYPAL The buyer gets the money back on any little whim. I actually WON as a seller & beat the buyer who tried to blame me for a typewriter that was damaged in shipping. I told the buyer to put a claim in with UPS for damage in shipping. She said they denied it. I said show me & paypal in writing. She could not produce it. I WON!

 

[charlief1]

I still have an account and still use it for some things, but not many now. I used to sell on evilbay as well as buy. It's become such a pain I pretty much stopped. There are some things that you can't get anywhere else so I visit from time to time. I use the account mostly for members here as well as other turbo sites because it's the fastest, easiest way to take care of business for both of us. It's not perfect but it does work for me.

 

[413turbo]

I still have an account and still use it for some things, but not many now. I used to sell on evilbay as well as buy. It's become such a pain I pretty much stopped. There are some things that you can't get anywhere else so I visit from time to time. I use the account mostly for members here as well as other turbo sites because it's the fastest, easiest way to take care of business for both of us. It's not perfect but it does work for me.

holy cow, how much did they pay you to say that????

jk, yeah that was what i always thought too, until i had my first problem, and i've had around 500 transactions through them. i was really starting to get a bad taste for the fees they charge.

 

[413turbo]

wow, i jacked my own thread. those pain pills are something else.
i don't drink or do any drugs, because #1 i grew up, #2 i don't like the way it makes me feel. i don't like the way these pills make me feel either, but the pain is unbearable at times.

and i'm not trying to have a pity party, it's just happening... there are other things i need to be doing, but the car was my relaxation. and i can't seem to get my mind on anything else.

i don't want to say too much. but it now needs alot, and low buck production shop would have a hard time fixxing it for what insurance wants to pay. that, and they left alot of things off the estimate that were pointed out and clearly visible.

but back to the paypal thing, we need a replacement. any ideas???

i had one guy shoot me a bank of america transfer, which is good for people using b.o.a. ; m.o.'s
what else is out there that is resonable?

 

[The Darkside]

Why don't you Post Mr. Crooks name & contact info for all of us to see....I'm sure he'd like everyone in the Turbo Buick world to know exactly who he is......


The Darkside