Lockup help..Bruce??

[Razor]

Well I've run into a problem that makes no sense whatsoever and thought someone on the board may know.

Ive been running the car and over the last two months it has lost 3-4 mph in the 1/4.The 1/8 mile has gone up though from an 86-87 to a 90 in the 1/8..but trap speed have come down.

Last teusday ran the car 9 nine times all at 106-107 mph irreguardless of boost settings from 19-24 lbs and played with fp with no mph gain.Like it was stuck there.

My last run I forgot to lock the converter(switch) and the mph went to 109.90.Exact opposite of what was happening.

Mods to tranny are art carr shift improver and a stage rite brake.

Ive run into a little issue after the shift kit that it kinda holds the 3-4 shift at 50-60 mph unless I let off the pedal a bit,and drives a little strange in third gear.But in OD position works great.The 3/4 shift hasnt been a big prob though I thought I'd mention it.

All shifts are firm.Ive adjusted the tv cable twice.No change.

Any input appreciated.Thanks guys.

12.23 at 107.1 arg....

 

[WE4]

hrmmm..

Well I can't explain the mph loss, but I can help you with the 3-4 thing. If you used the tight green TV spring in Carrs kit, go back in and take it out and return it to stock. I'll bet problem goes away.
Especially if the 1-2 is just a tad, tad late too.

I have seen this before.

The mph loss locked tho is odd, unless locked the motor is down a little on power which I dont get either. Hrmmm, would have to look at other things associated with the problem. Unless converter clutch was slipping , but again, odd.
Bruce
WE4
www.PTSnctb.com

 

[WE4]

Thinking more about this..

When do you lock converter on the run? It sounds like you may be locking in second. Are you? I have seen on occasion that until high gear with cylinder pressures way up, they dont all like it. .
I would try several different "methods" and see how and what the car or combo likes. Then rematch some numbers. Also if the air got colder towards end of day or evening, car could take off.
We once got 4 tenths and 3 mph out of a 20 degree lower intake charge.
You would be surprised.

Bruce
WE4
www.PTSnctb.com

 

[Razor]

Bruce,thank you immensely for the reply.I'll swap the spring and see if there is a change.

I lock the converter when I stage the car.It was running very consistent 110 for mph..then I did two changes the tranny(shift kit/brake) and fuel pump.MPH went down.On the return road if the car is left in 3rd and converter switch disabled it appears to drive funny.Like if it was holding in gear and Ive had a couple of instances where at low speeds 30 mph it has felt like it was locked up.And this occured after running the car with the tranny hot.Under cold conditions..never has happened.

Could a bad lockup valve cuase these abnormalities?In other words if it activates and doesnt open/close completely cuase these issues?

The stagerite brake replaces the valve in the valve body..could maybe it be a bad/mismachined valve cuasing these problems too?

Lemme know if you think of anything.Really appreciate your time/input

Julio

 

[WE4]

I think...

If you change that spring back you will be ok. I bet you can trace it ( most of your concerns) back to that spring. As for the brake, I dont think you have a problem there. As far as the hot feels like it is locked.... Maybe TCC solenoid is starting to hang. Simple enough, change it when you change tv spring as you have to remove it then anyway. And you can change tv spring without removing VB. And.. Lock up valves do not "go bad" so no , I do not think that is an issue. Change spring , reset tv, change TCC and see

Good Luck and let us know...

Bruce
WE4
www.PTSnctb.com

 

[Razor]

Thanks Bruce,will let ya know next friday.

 

[Razor]

Arggggg

Well after a nice atf bathing ....swapped the spring to the stocker and replaced the lockup selenoid...no better.Kinda worse.

I'm getting a delayed shift under full throttle.Lite throttle is fine...but under half throttle or above it hangs instead of thumping into gear.Driving car around town in regular driving feels normal and shifts are soft.

Direct scan confirms my feelings...like 2 second in between shifts and rpms dont climb.

Looks like a pressure problem somewhere.Tranny drives fine in regular driving..but get on it and it hangs....Which probably explains the delayed 3-4 shift and the sluggish full throttle shifts.

I dunno if there may be an incompatability issue with the art carr shift kit and the stage rite brake??????The stage rite says leave d3 check ball in else harsh 4-3 manual downshift.Low/overrun check ball also removed for brake.Along with removal of D3 checkball.

Anyone know when using a stagerite and an art carr kit which check balls must be ommitted and left in??


I dont know what to do at this point cept take out brake..return to stock config and see.

Please if you know where the problem may be..hollar

If you think I need to hookup a pressure guage to it..what kind of guage and where??

Could the accumulator cuase these types of probs??

And is the turbo TA tranny same as a grand national one?I would believe so...but gotta ask.

Thanks...sorry for the fifty questions..just trying to cover all bases.These ATF baths are not very wife friendly

 

[WE4]

No, TTA and gn are a touch different.

They are a slight bit different. I need to ask you some questions with you looking at it. Gimme call at shop and we will set up a time to do this or when you call we will. I dont want to do this on here cause I need to know things right then and there to direct you correctly. I do not want to tell you something not correct.
let me know when......

 

[national]

Razor>>> My GN does the same thing...wont shift 3-4 till like 55mph no matter how light you are on the throttle..ive just learned to live with it..I dont think its right but like I said I live with it....my car was flaring on the 1-2 shift & i sent the valve body to bruce...he fixed the problem & modified my servo..now it shifts firm ..really way to firm but I dont want to go back into it..im glad its not flaring anymore..I also lost mph & ET when locking my converter..i run 8th mile & my chip locks it at 78 I think but when i lock it off the line it goes slower..havent even gotten into that yet.... I also removed the green spring that was in my TV..maybe a lil help but like you said under normal driving it wont do the 3-4 shift ever unless you hit like 55 mph..ive drove forever at 45-50 & it never shifted then hit 50-55 bam goes right in...so if you find out your problem please let me know...I bet we have the same small problem somewhere. My TV cable has been re-adjusted also numerous times.
Brian

 

[Razor]

Bingo.......

Took the stage rite out today and all shifts at full throttle bang

No more hang ups and no more slipping...only thing is that Ive found some black soot in the pan(clutch material) from when it was slipping...So as far as performance..dunno..but I bet it picks up MPH now.

National...my 3-4 still hangs...and a couple of buddies that have the art carr kit have the same prob.Where you have to lift of the throttle at 55 for it to shift into 4th.So it has to do with the kit.

They have learned to live with it.

Why...dunno yet...but will...I'm leaving my tranny alone for a little while.Let it settle.Sure glad it still works.

Bruce, there is a valve in the valve body for the low overun that is not clear how its suppossed to be installed.The factory one has a spring and the stage rite kit one replaces the factory one.Problem is that its machined down on one end and can go in two ways????May this had been the problem.Gaskets looked good..no tears..I replaced them anyways.

Thanks for the help..

Julio

 

[WE4]

Originally posted by Razor
Bingo.......



No more hang ups and no more slipping...only thing is that Ive found some black soot in the pan(clutch material) from when it was slipping...So as far as performance..dunno..but I bet it picks up MPH now.

National...my 3-4 still hangs...and a couple of buddies that have the art carr kit have the same prob.Where you have to lift of the throttle at 55 for it to shift into 4th.So it has to do with the kit.They have learned to live with it.

Why live with it? Take that green spring out of TV

Originally posted by Razor

Why...dunno yet...but will...I'm leaving my tranny alone for a little while.Let it settle.Sure glad it still works.

Bruce, there is a valve in the valve body for the low overun that is not clear how its suppossed to be installed.The factory one has a spring and the stage rite kit one replaces the factory one.Problem is that its machined down on one end and can go in two ways????May this had been the problem.Gaskets looked good..no tears..I replaced them anyways.

Thanks for the help..

Julio

Valve goes in spring first with the big land closest to the back of the trans. The original should be a blue spring.

good luck and hope this helps.

 

[Razor]

Your rite Bruce...its the lazy in me that wants to leave it alone.Next time I do the oil I'll drop the pan and swap it out.

And yes..dont have to unbolt the VB to do it either.Just pull out the little retainer and whalla.

I hate tranny fluid

Good thing is my fluid is now very clean and have it measured to 5.5 quarts for the pan drop.

 

[WE4]

Razor

Gimme a call when you can. Want to run something by you...

 

[Razor]

Hollar at ya tommorrow