New member with some propane ???'s

[Hybridize]

I'm planning on assembling a nitrous/propane injection package for my car. My fuel system is already pretty close to maxed out, and after reading about propane's high octane AND low price, I'm thinking it's the way to go for a secondary fuel source for the nitrous. However, all my research on propane's application in a gasoline vehicle along with nitrous has netted no solid answers, and has basically landed me here at your doostep like a wet puppy. I hope you can oblige.

I think to keep this consice and easy to read I'll list my plans, instead of asking a string of questions, and let you guys point at any problems I might have with implementing them.

Basically what I have planned is a propane vapor injection system that is hooked up idependantly from the nitrous system. They will both activate at the same time, but will have seperate delivery locations and nozzles. The nitrous side will be pretty much standard with the nozzle located at the end of the intake spraying towards the TB. For the propane side I plan to use a 5lb DOT approved cylinder with a welding propane/mapp gas regulator with both bottle pressure and line pressure gauges. From there I will plumb a line forward and through the firewall to a standard fuel solenoid used in nitrous kits. This is one point that concerns me. Can a fuel solenoid designed for gasoline be used with propane safely? From the soleniod I would then run a line to a custom made circular spray bar placed mid intake, downwind of the nitrous. I'm unsure on whether I'll need several spray bars to flow enough propane vapor, but I'm hoping that if I can get close enough with the spray bars that all my tuning can be done at the regulator with PSI rather then jet sizes.

In my mind it seems like this crazy plan just might work, but since I'm unsure about even some of the basic things, I'm a bit weary at attempting to implement the idea without seeking expert council first. I'd really appreciate it if some of you that have experience with this could shed some light on this for me.

Thanks,

 

[mycarsucks]

Tell us a bit about your car. Is it turbocharged? If so, why go thenitrous route? I know there are a few systems on the market that do things very similar to what you describe with nitrous and propane, so I'm sure it can work.

 

[Hybridize]

Well, I was hoping to avoid telling too much about the car, lol. I'm what you guys would probably call a rice-burner, and I didn't know whether it would be beneficial or not to disclose what kind of car I drive on a buick forum. Oh well, since you asked, here's the poop.

I drive a '90 Honda(don't click your back button just yet ) CRX si. The car is equiped with a japanese domestic market engine and transmission. The 160hp DOHC VTEC b16a, and a S1 trans with a 4.40 final gearing. At the moment the car is pretty much built for NA. Mods include pretty much ALL of the standard NA bolt-on's with integra type R cams, vavle springs/retainers, manifold, and throttle body, and currently and 10.4-1 compression ratio. I haven't tracked the car yet, but from seeing people with similiar setups run I estimate my 1/4 to be somewhere around the mid/low 14's.

The car is my daily driver and as such I'd like to keep it reliable, and easy to drive around town. I've looked at going turbo or supercharged but it's not really what I want, and the costs are a bit too high for my taste. Also, once I go forced induction I'm stuck with it where ever I go, which will not only suck more gas(I get 22mpg atm) it will also make the car harder to drive in traffic. Which is already somewhat of a chore with somewhere around 200 crank hp, a steeply geared trans, and a 1800lb weight.

Looking at what I want, I figure nitrous is the way to go. It's only "on" when I want it to be, and when it's off my fuel economy and power output will stay unchanged. Also, the kit would be easily removable for when I'm not at the track. I can leave the lines and wires hooked up, and put the bottles back in when I'm ready to go. Seems like a great setup for what I'm after.

I know it will be easier to go with a standard wet kit spraying gasoline, but propane seems better and most importanly SAFER for the engine, and not much more expensive to implement to boot; which is why I am here asking for info on propane.

I think once I know what kind of propane I'll be spraying I'll be set to start putting the kit together. I just have a few small issues mostly with the propane euipment that is holding me back.

I think I have the vapor system pretty much figured out. However if I'm unable to flow enough vapor I'll have to switch to liquid propane injection which leaves me with a few issues on how to get liquid propane to the solenoid. I'm unsure as to if there are special bottles and regulators that will supply liquid rather then vapor safely. For the bottle I figured a nitrous bottle with siphon tube left intact would suffice, but I'm unsure of the DOT legality of that. Also, even if the bottle was OK, how would I regulate pressure? Do they even make liquid propane regulators? Or would all my adjustments have to be made by jet size? As you can tell I'm pretty much in the dark when it comes to liquid propane injection so I'm hoping that you all that have been there and done that could give me some pointers to get me on the right track...

Thanks,

 

[1badTTA]

If I were you, I would look at the OGS propain kit, it has all the components you mentioned except for how it is injected. Just use a wet NOS nozzle and run the propane through that with appropriate jetting which you will have to figure out what size it should be. Either that or run 1 dry nozzle and the supplied OGS propane nozzle.

There is merit for wanting to run propane and nitrous and I think you are just overengineering the spraybar idea as thew are both vapors and therefore will atomize automatically negating the need for perfect distrobution. Just inject them at the same point and they will be evenly distributed.

 

[Razor]

welll... the mis information is as follows. A turbo car allows even better gas mileage, better drivability, unlimited HP potential, excellent street manners, is easier of the rods/pistons/block/crank due to how it "hits" the motor vs nitrous... its an all around better setup than having a high compression NA motor.

the Viper guys use NOS with propane to really pound some power. You may want to search in that direction if your stuck on the NOS/propane route. Just remember once you shoot NOS into the motor, it will want to detonate more.. not less. The reason for the propane is to control the detonation when the NOS "hits" the motor. How much of both.. good luck.

HTH

PS.. I dont mind carrying my turbo around town and getting 25 MPG.

 

[smokinHawk]

i think your cheapest way to attack what you want would be a direct port nitrous system with a seperate fuel cell containing race gas.

the BTR viper/vettes do sell a nitrous propane system which would work better for what your trying to do and cheaper then getting the OGS propain kit and a seperate nitrous kit plus the other stuff to link them together.

i have heard of people taking a standard NOS wet kit and using the fuel side, siliniods and all with propane, jetting them accordingly.

 

[36IndexGN]

Dont worry about asking questions about spraying a 4 cyl import here. I heard of some lunatic planning on propane for his Saab.

 

[Army MP]

A 90 CRX huh?
Well, lets see,......................................................................
I would put a 500 hp fogger kit from NOS on it, oh yeah, a 50 gallon tank of propane, a 90 mm throttle body, 2 of the biggest honkin turbos known to man and maybe even one of those big-ass 5"pipes on the back and oh yeah a huge aluminum wing.

 

[36IndexGN]