Please help!Won't start!!!

[B.B.]

I had a thread here a while back but still havn't fixed it.

It all started when one day the fuel pumps quite priming and of course it wouldn't start.So I traced the pump wires(Intank & inline) to a couple relays on the passenger side fender.Of course they were spliced in with power coming from the back of alt.It is getting power from them.We hotwired the relays from the fuse box so when I turned the switch on the pumps would run but the stupid thing still won't start.

We pulled a plug wire off and listened for the spark to jump and we could hear it arching.But I wire the relays up like they are supposed to be and the pumps don't run.I have checked all the fuses I can think of, but no luck.

ANY IDEAS????

 

[87 WE2]

FUEL PUMP

ARE YOU SURE ITS NOT THE FUEL PUMP ITSELF?

DROP THE TANK AND REMOVE THE PUMP, WIRE THE PUMP TO A GOOD BATTERY TO SEE IF IT IS WORKING....

IF IT IS, BUY A NEW HOTWIRE KIT AND INSTALL IT STRAIGHT THROUGH TO YOUR TANK, AND GET RID OF WHATEVER WIREING YOU ALREADY HAVE. THERE IS NO SENSE IN BEETING YOUR HEAD AGINST THE WALL, NEW HOTWIRE KITS ARE CHEEP $54 ON SALE THROUGH RACETRONICS..........HOPE THIS HELPS

 

[buickboy]

Fuel pump fuse in fuse panel?
Mitch

 

[B.B.]

I can get them to run by hotwiring the relays but even with the pumps running and fuel pressure it doesn't start.

Could the injectors not be firing?I have spark!

 

[machinegun]

first check pressure on the rail with a fuel pressure gauge. Once verified that this is correct, then get e noid light to test the injectors. Let us know what have after this.

 

[OneLethal87GN]

The crank sensor can be a butthole sometimes. Mine went bad twice after something caused my car to die. It would turn over fine, but wouldn't start. Just a thought.

 

[B.B.]

It's got psi @ the fuel rail.

What could cause the relays not to work?They were tested good.
They have power to them!

 

[6=8]

Troubleshooting Steps

If you completely lose the crank sensor, you will not see spark. You might smell fuel, but it will not start. When I lost mine, before I even looked under the car, I attached a timing light an cranked it over while pulling the trigger... No Flashy...

But, if you turn the key on, the pump runs for a second or 2 and shuts off. That sounds normal to me.

Since you have fuel pressure at the rail, the injectors sound like they are not receiving a pulse. I would begin to suspect the ignition module and/or the camshaft sensor.

Someone posted this and I cut it out of the thread an pasted it into my Palm Pilot: It is very brief, but you should get it figured out. I now wish I knew who to give the credit too! Great Stuff!

No start- no spark, has inj pulse = Ign Module

No start- w/spark, no inj pulse = ECM / Cam sesnsor <--Sounds like you are here!

No start- no spark, no inj pulse = Crank sensor or Ign module

Troubleshooting Steps:

1. Note CHECK ENGINE light. If it is not on, check all power items fuse, fuseable links, wires/connectors

2. Listen to how it cranks for possible dead cyl/compression problems

3. Shoot 3-4 seconds of carb cleaner in the intake (thru a vac port). If it starts, kicks, trys to start, then a lack of fuel may be at fault. Check pump (pressure,relay, fuse, low volts). Check filter, line restrictions,bad regulator. Could be stuck in 'Clear Flood' mode too.

4. If no change w/carb spray, check for spark. Pull a plug or use a timing light. If no spark, check ign module, crank sensor & related wires.

NOTE: If an ign module goes bad, always replace coil pack(s).

 

[EightSecV6]

Cam Sensor (again!)

 

[turbo87limited]

Mine did this one time and it was the orange wire from the battery to the ecm had a break in it. Did exactly what you were describing running when I parked it, but would not crank the nest day. Actually it was not the wire, it was the pin on the ecm had broken off. I almost never found that.

 

[B.B.]

The pumps won't run when I have the relays wired correctly , I have to hotwire them to run anytime the switch is on.Why won't they work, we tested them and the relays are good.

 

[salvageV6]

What and where are you getting the trigger wire from that runs the hot wire relay?

Could be the output of the existing fuel pump relay isn't working.

 

[Steve Wood]

The pump should run for 1-2 seconds when the key is first turned on. You might try bumping the engine over once to see if this triggers the pumps for a brief moment. Get someone to put a voltmeter on the leads to the pump and see if you have momentary voltage. If the car does not start with the relays jumped, then you obviously have another problem. This assumes that you have the proper pressure at the rail rather than 20 psi or such.

6=8, that is Jimmy Testa's trouble shooting guide.

It really sounds like you have a cam sensor problem as suggested by others.

 

[Steve Wood]

BTW, you did check the fuel pump fuse in the fuse block, didn't you? Most hotwire kits still use the feed from the original circuit to switch the relay on and off.

 

[6=8]

Thanks Steve! Give credit where credit is due! Thank you Mr. Jim!

I also like turbo87limited's idea. I'm adding that specific note to the Testa "No Start Guide"

It must have been really difficult to figure out a broken pin on the ECM!

I bet there are a few pins that could break on the ESC/ign module as well that could cause a no start and not give much warning.

I have delt with corrosion on a SINGLE pin on the ign module that forced me to wiggle the connector to get my car to start. After about 20 no-starts, I eventually had it down to wiggling a single wire! I was amazed... The corrosion was very light, but it was the problem.