Prisoner abuse being blown out of proportion

[Captain Mark]

I really don't want to hear how this guy getting beheaded is the fault of the U.S.

Mark my words, that message will be coming soon from the left. It will be turned into a political hot potato, and it will make me even sicker than I feel right now.

 

[DCEPTCN]

Many songs come to mind......mostly Soulfly's 'Eye For An Eye', which hasn't left my head since 9/11. Also, a line from Slipknot's 'My Plague':

'You f*cking touch me, I will rip you apart....I'll reach in and take a bite out of that $h!t you call a heart!'

 

[We4ster]

You still dont get it! This is a political war now! bushbaby wants to get re-elected and he isnt going to do a damn thing about it.
He will come out and say how horrible it is and then do nothing.....
Watch and learn!

"We are a civilized nation and will behave as such".

Scream and yell all you want, it wont change a thing. Nam made this look like a Disney Movie..

 

[Captain Mark]

Originally posted by We4ster
You still dont get it! This is a political war now! bushbaby wants to get re-elected and he isnt going to do a damn thing about it.
He will come out and say how horrible it is and then do nothing.....
Watch and learn!

"We are a civilized nation and will behave as such".

Scream and yell all you want, it wont change a thing. Nam made this look like a Disney Movie..

I believe you are right with your statements.

It is a political war, what war isn't?

Yes, Bush wants to get re-elected. And Kerry will do/say anythig to get Bush out.

As for 'Nam, I don't doubt it a bit. I am thankful I had a high lottery number.

 

[Pronto]

POWs then and now

During WWII, my father, a MP officer was assigned to the first POW camp for Japaness prisoners. It was in New Calidonia. The commanding officer hated the prisoners so much he refused to look at them. He wanted nothing to do with the whole camp. My father basicly took over running the camp. He demanded his soldiers to treat the prisoners with respect. Over time the prisoners became so gratefull to my father for not mistreating them that their highest ranking officer gave my father his dagger. When my father was re-asigned to the Manhattan Project, the prisoners were very upset. They were afraid the next in charge would go back to mistreating them. He told me some of the prisoners cried when he told them he had to leave. He has letters written by the Japaness officers praising him for humanly treating the prisoners. My dad was a devout Catholic, extremely honest and honorable and awarded the Bronze Star.

My point is that whether someone is a prisoner of war or a citizen in a war zone they deserve to be treated humanely. If my father could do it in the middle of WWII to prisoners of the country that bombed Pearl Harbor, we can do it to the prisoners in Iraq. Simple as that.

Now it is my feeling that most of the incidents were ok'd, directed or otherwise co-erced by higher ranking officers, non-military ie CIA security. I think many of those low ranking soldiers were just following orders and are patsies for the un-named CIA. There is no way that my father would have not known if his prisoners were mistreated by the guards.

Now if you want to flame my father that was a retired Major for the MPs, served in the Pacific, worked on the Manhattan project in Montana, was at Los Alamos for the A bomb testing (read highest security clearance), Carried the detonator for the H bomb used on the Bikini Islands in a satchal handcuffed to his wrist, was the last person on Anawetaug (sp) before it was blown up, served in Korea, and was a Provost Marshall in Baunholder Germany for being "liberal" or some other put down for believing in treating prisoners humanely then you will have to meet him in heaven because that's where he is.

 

[Race Jace]

On this topic, it seems that humiliation is of more importance than human life.


Not many of us will ever remember any of this in a couple of years when China owns us. There is already huge problems with the raw steel supply because of china and the USs willingness to make the quick buck. Next time your in Wal-Mart look at where 95% of the products are made.

 

[Captain Mark]

Re: POWs then and now

Originally posted by Pronto


Now if you want to flame my father that was a retired Major for the MPs, served in the Pacific, worked on the Manhattan project in Montana, was at Los Alamos for the A bomb testing (read highest security clearance), Carried the detonator for the H bomb used on the Bikini Islands in a satchal handcuffed to his wrist, was the last person on Anawetaug (sp) before it was blown up, served in Korea, and was a Provost Marshall in Baunholder Germany for being "liberal" or some other put down for believing in treating prisoners humanely then you will have to meet him in heaven because that's where he is.

The only people I want to flame right now are those cowards that cut that poor dudes head off. Your Dad sounds like an American hero to me.

 

[Red Regal T]

Re: POWs then and now

Originally posted by Pronto
During WWII, my father, a MP officer was assigned to the first POW camp for Japaness prisoners. It was in New Calidonia. The commanding officer hated the prisoners so much he refused to look at them. He wanted nothing to do with the whole camp. My father basicly took over running the camp. He demanded his soldiers to treat the prisoners with respect. Over time the prisoners became so gratefull to my father for not mistreating them that their highest ranking officer gave my father his dagger. When my father was re-asigned to the Manhattan Project, the prisoners were very upset. They were afraid the next in charge would go back to mistreating them. He told me some of the prisoners cried when he told them he had to leave. He has letters written by the Japaness officers praising him for humanly treating the prisoners. My dad was a devout Catholic, extremely honest and honorable and awarded the Bronze Star.

My point is that whether someone is a prisoner of war or a citizen in a war zone they deserve to be treated humanely. If my father could do it in the middle of WWII to prisoners of the country that bombed Pearl Harbor, we can do it to the prisoners in Iraq. Simple as that.

Now it is my feeling that most of the incidents were ok'd, directed or otherwise co-erced by higher ranking officers, non-military ie CIA security. I think many of those low ranking soldiers were just following orders and are patsies for the un-named CIA. There is no way that my father would have not known if his prisoners were mistreated by the guards.

Now if you want to flame my father that was a retired Major for the MPs, served in the Pacific, worked on the Manhattan project in Montana, was at Los Alamos for the A bomb testing (read highest security clearance), Carried the detonator for the H bomb used on the Bikini Islands in a satchal handcuffed to his wrist, was the last person on Anawetaug (sp) before it was blown up, served in Korea, and was a Provost Marshall in Baunholder Germany for being "liberal" or some other put down for believing in treating prisoners humanely then you will have to meet him in heaven because that's where he is.

Sounds like your father was a great guy. Very intelligent, compassionate, and fair minded. Nobody could argue with you about that. I don't think anyone agrees with what those soldiers did in the prison abuse scandal. Seems kind of stupid. Maybe it yielded information that saved American lives. We don't know. It certainly wasn't what I would call torture. However, compared to what has happened to our soldiers and civilian workers in Iraq, and in other conflicts, it doesn't compare. US POWs have been abused, murdered, and tortured, in every conflict I can remember.

 

[Pronto]

Re: Re: POWs then and now

Originally posted by Red Regal T
It certainly wasn't what I would call torture.

I think being sodimized by a broomstick qualifies as torture. Listening to the testamony today I heard there are over 1000 pics and vids of the prisoners. They have just scratched the surface of this. At this point only a few dozen pics have been made public. Don't forget there are 3 prisons too. One for women and one for youths. A New York Times reporter said that there are pics of all of them being abused, even kids too. Apparently someone is trying to sell a package of them to a British rag.

Yes my dad was a super guy. I love and miss him dearly.

 

[AlanJ]

Originally posted by We4ster
You still dont get it! This is a political war now! bushbaby wants to get re-elected and he isnt going to do a damn thing about it.
He will come out and say how horrible it is and then do nothing.....
Watch and learn!

"We are a civilized nation and will behave as such".

Scream and yell all you want, it wont change a thing. Nam made this look like a Disney Movie..

Hey We4 - Lay off the redneck s*** it makes you sound ignorant. Just tell me one thing. How is any other person who is President going to do any better than Bush? You talk about how bad he is - but if you research and read a little - you will find Clinton was even worse to the military. Hitlary hates the military and if Kerry wins she could be your Vice President. Tell me what you want to happen with Irag and who will make it happen. If you can't do this then go away and let others discuss this topic.

 

[sixgun86gn]

This isn't the first time they have beheaded a hostage over there.Remember the journalist they took hostage after we went into Afghanistan?They beheaded him and sent the video to us.We should have wiped them out fast and hard but we just keep on *****footing around.

WE4STER,I agree that the politics is getting in the way of our sucess and that the militaty's hands are tied.They would be both feared and respected if cut loose just for a few days.

Look at all the strongest nations in history and how they were in war and you will see that giving your enemies quarter is just asking for it.Look at the Roman empire,even the French were bad a**es under the rule of Napoleon.

Your enemies cannot respect you if they do not fear you as well.What killed the strongest armies in history was politics not lack of strength.This is a dog eat dog world and the meanest dog always gets to eat first.You can be strongest or smartest or even both,but if you are not the meanest you will lose.We seem to have forgotten that to win war you don't fight to win...you fight to LIVE.Whether its right or not we have to become animals to fight animals.

 

[NEARING]

Originally posted by Vendor Defendor
I sure don't, That man came down to my college about a month ago to do a thing to rally people up to vote for him, he didn't make any sense while he was there, and the amount of security they had for him was rediculous, the man wasn't even president. I have been meaning to make a thread about my observations about this guy, maybe I will do that when I get back from the gym.

I said ALMOST.

Then I could sit back and complain about how s*@ty this country is and everything that Lurch does

 

[Foolis]

Tell me what you want to happen with Irag and who will make it happen. If you can't do this then go away and let others discuss this topic.

If I may interject, there is no one that can un-do the FUBARed situation in Iraq, but ANYONE would be better the GWB, who keeps screwing thing up worse with every passing day.

Getting the Phuk out would be a good start.

BT

 

[suprbuick7]

Again those on this board from some place in FLA think GWB is running this war effectively This War is just the start of the NEOCON NEW WORLD ORDER. Don't some of the dipsh!ts on this board see that we will be no safer from the Al Queda's of the world after Iraq is "Liberated" we have just swatted at the hornets nest, Crissake a majority of the combatants aren't even Iraqi. Covert ops and some kind of systematic infiltration of these terrorists groups through $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ would yield better results and a safer America. Again, the NEOCON chickenhawks: Cheyney, Rove, Wolfowitz, Perle, Libby are paying a"RISK" with the lives of our troops.. WAKE THE F#CK UP PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[NEARING]

That would be the easy thing to do. But It would only reinforce the rest of the worlds opinion that the US is a paper tiger and has no stomach to finish what we start.

Put up a good fight and we will run away with our tail between our legs.

I feel the time to have gotten out was right we got Saddam and then let them rebuild thier own country. Too late to cut and run now. It would appear they forced us out.

They are not Japan or Germany. That area of the world views kindness as WEAKNESS, I had a couple of Saudi's tell me that first
hand.

 

[2quiktocare]

Or maybe it is that you haven't understood that we have set a front for the major portion of the war on terror in one location? It is much better to fight it away than on our soil. I can agree, I haven't been happy with some of what has happened recently in Iraq. You can't fight a war with civility like many in this country want to conduct.
The thought of the alternative being in control of this is even more scary.
It is time to say buzz off to the world completely and do the right thing.
Cut these guys loose and let them jump into the middle of this crap and settle it and move on to the next fron of this war.

 

[NEARING]

I guess after 911 we should have done nothing and just hope it didn't happen again?

Oh I forgot that was OUR fault

 

[NEARING]

Originally posted by 2quiktocare
Or maybe it is that you haven't understood that we have set a front for the major portion of the war on terror in one location? It is much better to fight it away than on our soil. I can agree, I haven't been happy with some of what has happened recently in Iraq. You can't fight a war with civility like many in this country want to conduct.
The thought of the alternative being in control of this is even more scary.
It is time to say buzz off to the world completely and do the right thing.
Cut these guys loose and let them jump into the middle of this crap and settle it and move on to the next fron of this war.

You just basically wrote what I deleated!

 

[NEARING]

Things on the home front are not as quiet as as most people beleive. Our CO back in 2002 told us some stuff he proably shouldn't have .

 

[We4ster]

"Cut these guys loose and let them jump into the middle of this crap and settle it and move on to the next fron of this war."

Reality Check....it isnt going to happen!
So whats your solution now...................Try and be realistic!