Question about the pressure switch for the DIY kit
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The new 57's do not require any ECM modifications-
you might want to order a EGT kit also, that's a huge tool in tuning with alky.
BW
you might want to order a EGT kit also, that's a huge tool in tuning with alky.
BW
What does it do? who sells it?- Joined
- Nov 24, 2001
- Messages
- 11,267
smc sells a EGT kit EGT= EXHAUST GAS TEMPERATURE
what you do is drill a hole for the probe to go in near the 02 sensor and it measures how hot the exhaust temp is
as in how hot/ LEAN OR RICH the temp is
you mount the digital meter inside the car and measure the top end temp at the end of the 1/4mile-
the meter has a peak hold feature so you can write it down after the pass...
for a good state of tune 1550° - 1600° or a lil more will get the car dialed in right-
the leaner it is the hotter the engine is, and the higher the number goes up...
friday we were at 1620° at the end of the 1/4mile
use the search feature, there are a few cheaper ones than the SMC kit, heck, maybe RAZOR sells them too????
also look for a DIY = do it yourself EGT kit, buying the probe from SMC and buying the meter at www.omega.com
search feature should get you the info on the meter...
if you have any more Q's email me if you need
wanner@kc.rr.com
BRYAN
what you do is drill a hole for the probe to go in near the 02 sensor and it measures how hot the exhaust temp is
as in how hot/ LEAN OR RICH the temp is
you mount the digital meter inside the car and measure the top end temp at the end of the 1/4mile-
the meter has a peak hold feature so you can write it down after the pass...
for a good state of tune 1550° - 1600° or a lil more will get the car dialed in right-
the leaner it is the hotter the engine is, and the higher the number goes up...
friday we were at 1620° at the end of the 1/4mile
use the search feature, there are a few cheaper ones than the SMC kit, heck, maybe RAZOR sells them too????
also look for a DIY = do it yourself EGT kit, buying the probe from SMC and buying the meter at www.omega.com
search feature should get you the info on the meter...
if you have any more Q's email me if you need
wanner@kc.rr.com
BRYAN
Eric Stage I
TurboTweak Guy
- Joined
- May 25, 2001
- Messages
- 2,671
Normally, I don't put knock ignore in there. On Rob's car, we talked about removing the knock ignore (because I didn't originally intend to put it in there), but he felt comfortable that it was false knock. Knock ignore can be a dangerous thing, and I'll only do it if the owner feels ok with it. In fact, I think I only have 2 chips out there with that particular code (ignores knock under 30-40mph). One is Joe Reif's and the other is Rob Reese's. Both of them are TTA's and both seem to have monster false knock (with any chip), especially in 1st gear.
All of my alcohol chips however, have my delayed high timing code that keeps timing low during spool and the initial boost peak, then bumps it up later. That seems to really help the transitional knock (doesn't always eliminate it though).
I really like using alcohol and have experimented with it for a few years now. I even built a multistage controller box at one point to control different nozzles, but it became too complicated. I learned how to massage the chip better to get what I wanted out of a single nozzle system (still learning).
Right now, I use no pressure switches, and I am controlling the alcohol through the boost solenoid wiring, hooked to a 30amp relay. Its all controlled in the chip. The turn on point is controlled by airflow, and variable depending on how far you mash the pedal to the floor (TPS%). The more TPS, the earlier it comes on. Still experimenting with that one, as I don't know the long term effects on the ecm, but I can't image the relay would cause that much more load than the solenoid did. I dunno...
I might be able to pw modulate it, but I haven't tried yet. Anyone know if you can buzz a relay at 50% dc reliably?
I'm up to 124mph on 92 octane and alcohol, and the car felt great. I really think it will go faster.
Regards,
Eric
All of my alcohol chips however, have my delayed high timing code that keeps timing low during spool and the initial boost peak, then bumps it up later. That seems to really help the transitional knock (doesn't always eliminate it though).
I really like using alcohol and have experimented with it for a few years now. I even built a multistage controller box at one point to control different nozzles, but it became too complicated. I learned how to massage the chip better to get what I wanted out of a single nozzle system (still learning).
Right now, I use no pressure switches, and I am controlling the alcohol through the boost solenoid wiring, hooked to a 30amp relay. Its all controlled in the chip. The turn on point is controlled by airflow, and variable depending on how far you mash the pedal to the floor (TPS%). The more TPS, the earlier it comes on. Still experimenting with that one, as I don't know the long term effects on the ecm, but I can't image the relay would cause that much more load than the solenoid did. I dunno...
I might be able to pw modulate it, but I haven't tried yet. Anyone know if you can buzz a relay at 50% dc reliably?I'm up to 124mph on 92 octane and alcohol, and the car felt great. I really think it will go faster.
Regards,
Eric
Yep, I have false knock with any chip in 1st gear. Stock all the way to now, it was always there. Got worse with the THDP. Pull the plugs and no signs of anything on them. With that enabled, I get 0.0 KR the whole run. The counts go up which is to be expected with my car but no retard. When its off, no retard the whole run.
Still tuning in the chip but it looks like a keeper
Still tuning in the chip but it looks like a keeper
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2001
- Messages
- 11,267
ERIC-
thanks for posting and clearing up a few things for us to view-
i cant believe we didnt get a atty boy or a congrats for hittin 120 on ZAK's car
just wondering if you had a chance to send out his new chip so we can try it at the track this friday? hope to go 96 in the 1/8th if we get it-
ps, he would lightly haze the tires all the way to the 1/8th
till the last few passes
wish you were still here, things are finally on the up and up
Stevemon-
thanks for the part number, i needed it for a few guys here in town.... too bad that westach doesnt have a search by part number, how much was the probe with clamp?
BW
thanks for posting and clearing up a few things for us to view-
i cant believe we didnt get a atty boy or a congrats for hittin 120 on ZAK's car
just wondering if you had a chance to send out his new chip so we can try it at the track this friday? hope to go 96 in the 1/8th if we get it-
ps, he would lightly haze the tires all the way to the 1/8th
till the last few passes wish you were still here, things are finally on the up and up
Stevemon-
thanks for the part number, i needed it for a few guys here in town.... too bad that westach doesnt have a search by part number, how much was the probe with clamp?
BW
Wow this post has turned into a party..heres the pooper
We have three cars all TTA's that run the same motors and same ET"s. Joe's, Rob's, and mine. All had the SMC kit's and all had the first gear butt load of transitional knock syndrome. Heres the kicker, while killing the knock sensor is an approach to keep the knock sensor from flaring.. I chose the other route and addressed the issue by making a progressive alcohol controller. Without any changes to the chip... My car is knock free in first gear. using the same lame thrasher 93 chip for 50's..to keep the experiment scientific. Changing the chip to a higher timing chip dropped my 1/8 mile track times .2 tenths +2 MPH(7.55 at 94 1.80 60 foot BFG's) vs the next run with the thrasher 93 7.75 with 1.80 at 91.7
The relay can be buzzed but not at a very high frequency due to the weight of the internal actuator. Also I have never heard of anyone doing so since the arc on the contacts plays a role. It is a little different than the selenoid, since the WG selenoid is designed for another purpose. I buz a relay of another type to get the same effect.. next mod is to track of INJ PW.. thats next year... and dunno if there will be a difference in performance.
Experimenting is cool..glad your finding real estate space within the chip to do what your doing..keep up the good work.
One issue in alcohol is track, the other is the street.. If you have controlled conditions, the car will respond way different than on the street. See setting a turnon point to 15 LBS at the track, may not be an issue based on spool, traction, timing, etc... on the street..fugedaboutit..unless the spool is so slow...
I didnt get here from not subjecting my own car to abuse above and beyond the norm. Next test the PT54 vs PT51.. the 54 just went on.. whistle just got louder
Stevemon..good link.
Y-hate.. i'm just a casual chip molester..do enough to get by and fend for myself.. I havent played with 57's yet..so I dunno... 50's yes.. tons..57's nope..
We have three cars all TTA's that run the same motors and same ET"s. Joe's, Rob's, and mine. All had the SMC kit's and all had the first gear butt load of transitional knock syndrome. Heres the kicker, while killing the knock sensor is an approach to keep the knock sensor from flaring.. I chose the other route and addressed the issue by making a progressive alcohol controller. Without any changes to the chip... My car is knock free in first gear. using the same lame thrasher 93 chip for 50's..to keep the experiment scientific. Changing the chip to a higher timing chip dropped my 1/8 mile track times .2 tenths +2 MPH(7.55 at 94 1.80 60 foot BFG's) vs the next run with the thrasher 93 7.75 with 1.80 at 91.7
The relay can be buzzed but not at a very high frequency due to the weight of the internal actuator. Also I have never heard of anyone doing so since the arc on the contacts plays a role. It is a little different than the selenoid, since the WG selenoid is designed for another purpose. I buz a relay of another type to get the same effect.. next mod is to track of INJ PW.. thats next year... and dunno if there will be a difference in performance.
Experimenting is cool..glad your finding real estate space within the chip to do what your doing..keep up the good work.
One issue in alcohol is track, the other is the street.. If you have controlled conditions, the car will respond way different than on the street. See setting a turnon point to 15 LBS at the track, may not be an issue based on spool, traction, timing, etc... on the street..fugedaboutit..unless the spool is so slow...
I didnt get here from not subjecting my own car to abuse above and beyond the norm. Next test the PT54 vs PT51.. the 54 just went on.. whistle just got louder
Stevemon..good link.
Y-hate.. i'm just a casual chip molester..do enough to get by
and fend for myself.. I havent played with 57's yet..so I dunno... 50's yes.. tons..57's nope..Eric is the man. Hope your doing well in Indiana buddy. Dads car is running well.......still addressing some initial spool-up knock issues in it, but you cant really hear it under the hood, no hesitation, etc. I think its the THDP hitting. 
T-type is doing okay, my tranny is going though. I usually get a few degrees on initial spool-up, which verifies that my chip does not ignore knock down low in 1st. My knock usually occurs around 12-20mph and goes away. BTW, my turn-on point for the alky is 13-14psi, anything less and it bogs bad. HTH
T-type is doing okay, my tranny is going though. I usually get a few degrees on initial spool-up, which verifies that my chip does not ignore knock down low in 1st. My knock usually occurs around 12-20mph and goes away. BTW, my turn-on point for the alky is 13-14psi, anything less and it bogs bad. HTHOriginally posted by 8UWITH6
Eric is the man. Hope your doing well in Indiana buddy. Dads car is running well.......still addressing some initial spool-up knock issues in it, but you cant really hear it under the hood, no hesitation, etc. I think its the THDP hitting.
thats becuase you have too much pump pressure. drop the pressure and drop the turnon point and see if the problem goes away.
To drop pressure counterclockwise on the allen screw on top of the pump..or get a smaller nozzle.
This is becuase no alky in the motor...when it starts to detonate..
If you keep rattling it..only a matter of time before the bearings..you know what.
Ok if at the track building boost..and prime the system..some of the time..
I like all the time protection.
Razor, I dont think my pump is adjustable. And, Im running a .024 jet. (I have 24, 26, 28, and 30). I have tried turning on the alky at 10psi, and it just bogs. I dont think its a lack of alky, I think it may be lean on spool-up causing this knock. Cause it does it everytime the boost comes up, whether Im doing 10mph, or 60mph. Another thought might be the MAF.......who knows, the car has 143K. I havent had much time to play with it, plus the trans is flaring bad on the 2-3, so whats the point of beating on the car. Daily driver, gotta keep it in one piece!
Okay..this is what you do..put the car in second gear, roll into the throttle not mash it so the boost comes up, when it gets to your activation point the car should not surge,buck, blow black smoke. If it does then its getting too much alky.
high turnon points generate knock till the alky catches up.
You need either to reduce your pumps output pressure or get a smaller nozzle...... and turn it on earlier to reduce knock from the motor being at 20 PSI and no alky in the cylinders.
I think know you see why kits like the SMC are so popular, and why I make controllers for those that go a different route.
Every car is different, and the amount of injection needed is different.
HTH
high turnon points generate knock till the alky catches up.
You need either to reduce your pumps output pressure or get a smaller nozzle...... and turn it on earlier to reduce knock from the motor being at 20 PSI and no alky in the cylinders.
I think know you see why kits like the SMC are so popular, and why I make controllers for those that go a different route.
Every car is different, and the amount of injection needed is different.
HTH
Speaking of EGT..
stevemon - I see on the Westach site they say not to cut the probe leads, and 4' probably won't get into the cab. You mentioned splicing the cable or getting the extension - just wondering where to get the extension, or if you have had no problems splicing?
Also, westach does have a price list. It looks like that EGT probe is listed as $47.20. Anyone find one of these cheaper?
stevemon - I see on the Westach site they say not to cut the probe leads, and 4' probably won't get into the cab. You mentioned splicing the cable or getting the extension - just wondering where to get the extension, or if you have had no problems splicing?
Also, westach does have a price list. It looks like that EGT probe is listed as $47.20. Anyone find one of these cheaper?
