Razor, how to measure crankshaft end play?

[Jan Larsson]

Julio,

What do you recommend using to measure the end play when prying the flywheel back and forth ?

My digital gauge thing is broke so can't use that one, any recommendations and or what do you typicly use?

 

[Jan Larsson]

Did you use a dial meter like described on this page? http://members.rennlist.com/v1uhoh/cranksha.htm

 

[Razor]

Jan,
none of that is needed. Your not building an engine.. If the thrust is bad.. it is really easy to see.. a simple prying back and forth.. if it doesnt seem tomove back and forth.. its ok. If it has travel..then you have issues. Remember .010 is 10 sheets of paper thick.. if it moves a lot more than that.. then you have concern.

But the belt has to be off the front. If not you wont get that forward/reverse motion.

HTH

 

[Jan Larsson]

Julio,

Belt off and using a prybar it sure looked like it moved so I used a vernier caliper to measure from the same reference point and I get repetily 0.5 mm which is 0.02" roughly. It moves very easily back and forth so not much force using the pry bar to move it in and then out again.

Verdict? Engine out?

 

[Razor]

If your getting .020... time to take pan off and drop thrust bearing and have a look. At the same time look at the thrust surface on the crank to see if there is any wear. If there is.. then its time to pull it out.

The crank should move back and forth freely.. spec is .003-.011 per the engine assembly book. If you have .020 .. think you found your knock.

Sometimes in rare cases the thrust wears and no damage to crank, whereby you can install a new thrust on the block.. but typically when the thrust wears... it takes out the crank.

Next is to see why it happened, typically its the TQ converter ballooned, or issue with TQ converter and tranny.

Post back.

 

[Jan Larsson]

Thanks Julio,

Can I just lift the engine and pull the pan, like when you replace the rear main seal, to get to the thrust bearing?

If the crank looks good and is within spec I can just install a new bearing then correct?

When you say TQ converter balooned, how do I determine if that is the case or should I just get a new one and bolt in place to be on the safe side once I sorted the engine out? What else in the transmission could have affected this to happen?

 

[Razor]

Yes.. take crossover pipe off, lift engine.. pull pan. The thrust is the second main bearing.. once you take it off.. you then can see the the cranks surface,and bearing surface.. at that time make the decisions.

As to the tranny... first see if the thrust went bad.. then make decisions .. but I already said that

Was this a new motor or new converter? Or is it the OEM motor and D5 converter?

 

[Jan Larsson]

Thanks Julio, see if I can get started today or tomorrow and pull the pan.

The engine been rebuilt at about 50k miles by previous owner (now got 110k on it), this is the info I have on the engine:

- Forged Pistons
- Polished rods
- ARP rod bolts
- ARP head bolts
- Porting / Polishing of the heads
- Hydraulic Lifters (4/04/94)
- Cam 211/20/-109 (4/04/94)
- Valve Springs (4/06/94)

Then in 1999 (around 80k on the engine) the previous owner changed the following:
- High Performance Cam (comp cams 206)
- Lifters
- Valve Springs
- Double Roller Timing Chain Set
- High Volume Oil Pump

For the transmission all I know that in 1993 the transmission wasbuilt up with heavy duty parts and an 2500 stall converter, after that I had the bands sorted about 4 years ago as it started to slip but nothing else was done.

 

[Razor]

Thrust failure can happen from improper assembly or TQ converter issue.

I had the same thing, it was an aftermarket TQ converter..

And sometimes.. **** happens.

Take the pan off.. not too bad of a job.. take it from there.

 

[Lunkan]

Of 3 engines rebuilt, all three was too tight assembled with more or less worn bearings (mostly rod). The 4th engine that I just took apart looked like this
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13997
The engine ran good, but had severe knock above 15PSI.

What I wanted to say, check the rod bearings too when You have the pan off. Looks like a couple of engine builders don´t check the clearance when they put it together
http://www.turbolunkan.com/jakobs_rebuild/img/dsc01574.jpg

 

[Jan Larsson]

Thanks Lunkan, that is exactly what I'm afraid of ... starting to take stuff off today so I can get the pan off and see what the bearings looks like and what the crank looks like ... cross your fingers it all looks good ...