Wastegate Rod Super Tight

[carryon525]

So I wanted to lower my boost to see if the knock issue had to do with "to much boost" and I took the rod loose and pulled it off the puck nipple and the rod immediately pulled itself far from the nipple. I had to pull extremely hard to get it back over the nipple and almost gave up trying. My question is does this mean someone was trying to turn the boost way high and would that affect the gate opening? I watched the video to learn how to properly "preload" and did it exactly how the guy explain AND I do have a Lorenz Boost controller now that I will use to adjust boost. Does it sound like I've done this correctly?

 

[turbobitt]

Could mean a lot of things. Could also be trying to compensate for a bad puck seal. Do you know what your boost was ?
AG.

 

[carryon525]

Could mean a lot of things. Could also be trying to compensate for a bad puck seal. Do you know what your boost was ?
AG.

only 17-18 Only running 93 octane. I have the alkycontrol kit but not installed yet so I figured 18psi is pushing it with 93

 

[fastblackracing]

There are 2 different wastegates that are commonly used....1011 673 is standard low pressure
and 1011 144 is the high pressure version. If you have a 144 and it is set with a lot of pre-load on it
you will find out how strong your hand is lol.....

The size of the hole in your turbine housing will make a big difference in the amount of
preload that you need to run on the gate....if the hole is bigger than it needs to be the
turbine pressure will really push on that gate and you will have to offset it with extra pre-load.

The last one I did when I opened the hole up .050" from .950"-1.00" the boost dropped
6 pounds with no other adjustments.....and if hole is too small you will not be able to control the boost
especially in 3rd gear and it will creep up during the pass as the system is out of regulation at this point.

So the hole size, the choice of hi or standard pressure actuator and the amount of preload
along with your adjustable check ball setting need to thought of as a system in order to
get good boost control with fast boost ramp up and good system regulation.

If one of these components is out of whack you cannot overcome it with excessive adjustment
of one of the other components.


I like to start with about a 1/4" -3/8" of preload on the rod and then set the boost controller to get it where I want.
With the controller set to the lowest setting and the rod at 1/4" would give you the lowest boost and then adjust the controller progressively higher.
I am not familiar with the controller you have but I believe it is patterned after the Perrin controller
which I found to work amazingly well along with a 144 wastgate for 30# rock steady boost control.

When you want to run up over 23-24 pounds I like to switch to the higher tension 144 gate so you can ease
off on the preload some.

How much knock are you seeing with 17 pounds boost?

 

[carryon525]

There are 2 different wastegates that are commonly used....1011 673 is standard low pressure
and 1011 144 is the high pressure version. If you have a 144 and it is set with a lot of pre-load on it
you will find out how strong your hand is lol.....

The size of the hole in your turbine housing will make a big difference in the amount of
preload that you need to run on the gate....if the hole is bigger than it needs to be the
turbine pressure will really push on that gate and you will have to offset it with extra pre-load.

The last one I did when I opened the hole up .050" from .950"-1.00" the boost dropped
6 pounds with no other adjustments.....and if hole is too small you will not be able to control the boost
especially in 3rd gear and it will creep up during the pass as the system is out of regulation at this point.

So the hole size, the choice of hi or standard pressure actuator and the amount of preload
along with your adjustable check ball setting need to thought of as a system in order to
get good boost control with fast boost ramp up and good system regulation.

If one of these components is out of whack you cannot overcome it with excessive adjustment
of one of the other components.


I like to start with about a 1/4" -3/8" of preload on the rod and then set the boost controller to get it where I want.
With the controller set to the lowest setting and the rod at 1/4" would give you the lowest boost and then adjust the controller progressively higher.
I am not familiar with the controller you have but I believe it is patterned after the Perrin controller
which I found to work amazingly well along with a 144 wastgate for 30# rock steady boost control.

When you want to run up over 23-24 pounds I like to switch to the higher tension 144 gate so you can ease
off on the preload some.

How much knock are you seeing with 17 pounds boost?

It really varies I think the gas may be a bad batch. But I saw as low at .5 all the way to 10!! Now that I'm reset at the rod I'm at 13 psi and I do not hear knock and only see .5 on my scan master. I'm about to add alky control so o hope my know issues will disappear and I'll be able to run around 21-22 total. I just can't seem to get the knock to leave! I can actually hear it sometimes and I instantly get off the pedal. I've checked everything could my coil be going bad??

 

[mikes86ttop]

Check, and double check, then triple check for any rattling, and or contact of anything that the knock sensor can or will possibly pick up, also check motor mounts for excessive slop..it'll only help eliminate any possibilities of false knock...Mike

 

[fastblackracing]

It really varies I think the gas may be a bad batch. But I saw as low at .5 all the way to 10!! Now that I'm reset at the rod I'm at 13 psi and I do not hear knock and only see .5 on my scan master. I'm about to add alky control so o hope my know issues will disappear and I'll be able to run around 21-22 total. I just can't seem to get the knock to leave! I can actually hear it sometimes and I instantly get off the pedal. I've checked everything could my coil be going bad??

On builds similar to yours I have seen the boost be knock limited on 93 to as low as 15# and as high as 19#.
There are many things that can drive the knock limit how much timing does the chip have, engine temp, individual cylinder temp due to water flow issues,The temp of the air going into the turbo.....warm underhood air or cooler air source behind the bumper.....Maybe one injector has flow issues.....excessive carbon build up from oil seepage into one cylinder and the list goes.

I have never seen a coil cause knock tho....and since you can hear it you need to do all that you can
to eliminate it...audible knock is fairly substantial.

 

[carryon525]

Also how do I know if I have any bad knock sensor?

 

[carryon525]

On builds similar to yours I have seen the boost be knock limited on 93 to as low as 15# and as high as 19#.
There are many things that can drive the knock limit how much timing does the chip have, engine temp, individual cylinder temp due to water flow issues,The temp of the air going into the turbo.....warm underhood air or cooler air source behind the bumper.....Maybe one injector has flow issues.....excessive carbon build up from oil seepage into one cylinder and the list goes.

I have never seen a coil cause knock tho....and since you can hear it you need to do all that you can
to eliminate it...audible knock is fairly substantial.

So alky should help right? I did change plugs to ur5 recently gapped at .32. Timing is 20/18 I believe . It's whatever TT had in his 93 street chip on his website. I did notice that when I added wot fuel in the chip the knock seems to be worse?

 

[dynoman]

Try doing a 3rd gear wot pull but don't let it down shift , kind of like a moving dyno pull and see if you still get knock . There are LOTS of things to rattle during the 1-2 , 2-3 shifts , any metal to metal contact could do it . Check torque converter bolts also . Knock sensor should be torqued to 14 ft/lbs , no more . Sam

 

[carryon525]

Try doing a 3rd gear wot pull but don't let it down shift , kind of like a moving dyno pull and see if you still get knock . There are LOTS of things to rattle during the 1-2 , 2-3 shifts , any metal to metal contact could do it . Check torque converter bolts also . Knock sensor should be torqued to 14 ft/lbs , no more . Sam

Check knock sensor last week. Have not checked converter bolts but a buddy of mine mentioned that I need a much higher stall like 3000-3200.

 

[earlbrown]

3000 is not ''much higher''. And your buddy can't accuratly say such a thing if your car isn't running right.

Alky will make it worse. Putting that on a flakey engine will run you around in circles trying to troubleshoot until you finally lower the boost, turn off the alky and start again.


The problem with pulling a wastegate rod banjo tight is that you use up all the travel. Basically that means you might only have 1/8" of throw left before it bottoms out. That can lead to overboosting and blown head gaskets if the wastegate can't open enough to fully dump the exhaust.

When using an external boost controller you usually preload the actuator about 1/8" or so. That way the arm has plenty of available travel and can deal with the demands put to it.

A quick and easy was to test the knock sensor is to get a long extension on rebar. With the car running watch the knock reading and 'ding' the block. If the knock sensor is working it'll show on the scan tool as a knock incident.