well about time i say hi

[lightningdan]

hey gang, let me introduce myself, my name is danny. i have owned a few boosted vehicles, and when i say boosted i mean forced induction! lol, i collect an drag race ford lightning, i have a turbo'd 94 ford lightning, and a 2000 supercharged lightning. i also collect vintage mustangs, well my dad owns most of them...we are real ford die hards...

i have always had a soft spot for GN's, a few years back i helped a buddy of mine start restoring his 86 GN ttop car. it was fun, i sunk many free hours into the car and then he turned around with out offering it to me and sold it from underneath me lol. he claims he never offered because i always wanted a hard top and his had the ttops... but anyway

the past couple of weeks i have been digging threw old threads, reading reading and doing more reading. first off let me say vortexbuick's site is awesome, i have read everything link on there, it really answered allot of my questions!

i have finished a few things up in my life and now got this crazy idea of hunting down a nice 87 GN, well at first... now after reading i really would like to find a clean we4... i want to get the car into the high tens, just for glory and bragging rights, i know the local track and i cant get away with breaking 10's without a cage an following NHRA safety rules, but i dont want to put a cage and stuff, i want a 100% street car that runs low 11's and when put on kill mode can break 10's, while being able to make a 6hour trip to atco nj, to hang out with my friends, is this possible?

i have been reading many peoples combos on here and it all seems they have the same reliable setups, one of my major questions though is should i stay mass air? or go over to speed density? what gets better gas mileage and performance? just from reading i guess im going to be needing forged internals, gridle bottom end, te60 turbo, 60lb injectors, alky kit, hotwire, scan master, protuner, ported heads, what cam is good for 10.90s? is 208/208 too small? roller rockers, 70mm throttle body, maybe front mount intercooler? though i do like the big after market ones that fit in the stock location, and of course all the traction mods... is a 2800 stall too small for the te60? with a 3000 stall doesnt that act like a dog driving on the street? and kill gas mileage>? these are my main questions now lol

i am hoping to find a we4 hooked up already, i think a few weeks ago there was on local to me on craigslist, but it was all out race, no heater box or anything like that...

i have been keeping my eyes out in the classfieds here, and man there are some serious cars going for really good prices, up here theres 86 BONE stock gn with 77k on the odometer, and salvage tile for 15,900! and its not in great shape..

is there anything to really look out for or watch out for when hunting turbo buicks? any advice is greatly appreciated, thanks for the time guys, i love the iphone app!!!

danny

 

[longball]

Hello Dan, and Welcome to Turbobuick.com!!!

i want a 100% street car that runs low 11's and when put on kill mode can break 10's, while being able to make a 6hour trip to atco nj, to hang out with my friends, is this possible? absolutely not a problem.

 

[lightningdan]

Hello Dan, and Welcome to Turbobuick.com!!!

i want a 100% street car that runs low 11's and when put on kill mode can break 10's, while being able to make a 6hour trip to atco nj, to hang out with my friends, is this possible? absolutely not a problem.

Hey thanks for the reply!! This place is great I have learned allot so far, still got millions of questions but enjoy learning something new! Will 60lb injectors get into the 10s? Should I stay mass air or go speed density? Is there anywhere on the site comparing mass air to speed density?

I know in the lightning world it's a huge war between staying with the stock speed density system and upgrading to mass air...

Any advice is greatly appreciated

Danny

 

[longball]

Hi Dan, there have been discussions on mass air vs. speed density so I would think a search might
turn something up. Opinion seems to be split. You might find something in the 'performance ecm'
or 'computer chip' sections. Wait to you see what you buy and see how it runs. Great site for information!

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

Danny[/quote]

Hey thanks for the reply!! This place is great I have learned allot so far, still got millions of questions but enjoy learning something new! Will 60lb injectors get into the 10s? Should I stay mass air or go speed density? Is there anywhere on the site comparing mass air to speed density?

I know in the lightning world it's a huge war between staying with the stock speed density system and upgrading to mass air...

Any advice is greatly appreciated

Danny

60lb injectors can take you to tens with alky injection, however I would probably go larger since the injectors cost about the same and leave yourself some wiggle room. As far as going ten reliable I'll say what's bound to be said - It's all in the tune. Also the cheap, fast, and reliable - pick 2

 

[lightningdan]

Danny

60lb injectors can take you to tens with alky injection, however I would probably go larger since the injectors cost about the same and leave yourself some wiggle room. As far as going ten reliable I'll say what's bound to be said - It's all in the tune. Also the cheap, fast, and reliable - pick 2[/QUOTE]

Can this be done with the stock computer? Or will I have to upgrade to fast? I do have a complete accel gen7 dfi system sitting on my self, was going to use it on the race truck but upgraded to big stuff 3. I see people using fast, but don't see anything about gen7 anywhere... Heck I don't see it being used anymore

My plans are hoping to find a car already "hooked up" but if I find a clean one at the rigt price I'll have to setup some combos on paper

Can u explain to me what a stageII motor is? Is it a dart block? I know it has a cam drive distributor gear setup but that's all I can tell in the pictures, lol basically I need to be schooled on the stageII motor lol

Thanks for all the advice

 

[longball]

Original Stage II is a discontinued Buick Motorsports racing block. Odds are you won't be getting one.
They can be had. Can you say 'expensive'?

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

Can this be done with the stock computer? Or will I have to upgrade to fast? I do have a complete accel gen7 dfi system sitting on my self, was going to use it on the race truck but upgraded to big stuff 3. I see people using fast, but don't see anything about gen7 anywhere... Heck I don't see it being used anymore

My plans are hoping to find a car already "hooked up" but if I find a clean one at the rigt price I'll have to setup some combos on paper

Can u explain to me what a stageII motor is? Is it a dart block? I know it has a cam drive distributor gear setup but that's all I can tell in the pictures, lol basically I need to be schooled on the stageII motor lol

Thanks for all the advice

Yes you can get into the tens with the stock computer. Info on blocks can be found here http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/pictureguides/blocks/blockguide.html - I don't think I would really put money into a stage II these days as there are $500 junkyard motors that hold up to the same HP. 3800 engines have gone mid 8's with a stock bottom end, and the 4.8's, 5.3's, and 6.0's take all kinds of abuse. If you blow it up you aren't out 15k, you just go back to the junkyard with 500 bucks.

 

[lightningdan]

Thanks guys, geesh I can't believe the blocks can handle that kind of abuse that's amazing! I am still doing some heavy research on here and looking on where I can find threads on home port jobs, but don't have any luck. Does any vendors do porting ?

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

Thanks guys, geesh I can't believe the blocks can handle that kind of abuse that's amazing! I am still doing some heavy research on here and looking on where I can find threads on home port jobs, but don't have any luck. Does any vendors do porting ?

Champion should

 

[lightningdan]

Champion should

Thanks! I just checked out ur signature, with those mods what does ur car run? Also do u think it's worth, since I'm spending the money for cnc'ed heads, to send my lower intake to them to be ported and gasket matched?

Thanks

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

Thanks! I just checked out ur signature, with those mods what does ur car run? Also do u think it's worth, since I'm spending the money for cnc'ed heads, to send my lower intake to them to be ported and gasket matched?

Thanks

You really have to be cruising to require an intake port - like low tens or nines. Then again some might say the same thing about the heads. The truth is you don't need either to hit tens. If you pop your head gaskets then you should think about porting. That's just my opinion though and I am no guru. I don't know what my car runs, but I plan to hit the strip this summer. I'm hoping 12's 1st time out, 11's second time out and low 11's 3rd time out. I know people have gone faster with less, but again I am no guru, or anything close for that matter. I just read a lot and try to relay what I've read to newer guys. That's why I changed my thing that said senior member to not so senior member .

 

[lightningdan]

You really have to be cruising to require an intake port - like low tens or nines. Then again some might say the same thing about the heads. The truth is you don't need either to hit tens. If you pop your head gaskets then you should think about porting. That's just my opinion though and I am no guru. I don't know what my car runs, but I plan to hit the strip this summer. I'm hoping 12's 1st time out, 11's second time out and low 11's 3rd time out. I know people have gone faster with less, but again I am no guru, or anything close for that matter. I just read a lot and try to relay what I've read to newer guys. That's why I changed my thing that said senior member to not so senior member .

Lol thanks buddy, you seem to have a very nice setup! Well ur a guru to me! I don't have a freck'n clue about this stuff, this is the only vehicle besides my delorean that's not ford powered! Lol u have a great idea on you first time out at the track, my buddy's go out there with high goals, first few runs dont reach the goals and next thing their doing is fiddling with tunes, or adjusting timing and they go worse! Get out there make a bunch of runs see how the car handles, dial it in that way and the start fiddling with the engine.. But what do I know! Lol

Seems like only these business's that deal with the Buick motors are the only shops people send their short blocks too, do u have any idea why these blocks are so finiky?

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

It's something about the tolerances being different than most cars. Also if you want to girdle or put billet caps on it it's going to require machining and you really need someone who knows their chit to do that type of stuff.

 

[lightningdan]

It's something about the tolerances being different than most cars. Also if you want to girdle or put billet caps on it it's going to require machining and you really need someone who knows their chit to do that type of stuff.

No sa! I know if I were to do main caps it would need machining, I didn't know even with the girdle it needs it too! Wow... The short block is looking better and better... Is it safe to just use he caps? Or do they use the caps with he girdle?

Are u still using the stock computer? Are you mass air or speed density? Geesh I had a question to ask u thinking today but now can think of it...

 

[lightningdan]

My converter works fine on the street. It's real smooth. I don't know what size or brand it is though. I am not real sure what the stall is either. The engine builder put it in, and by the time I started asking questions he closed shop. It is a non-lock converter though. I know that much lol.

I figured I'd move his here, don't want to upset cooper I really al-Qaeda'ed his thread

What is Better off in these cars non lockup's? I know with the lightnings when beefing up and using the stock tranny we all ways use lockup's... Don't really see them discussing non lockup's, do u happen to know the pros and cons to them?

My question was ( and I already asked u) was about u and the stock computer I noticed u are using 120lbers for the e85, I'm dying to get e85 here... I was curious if u were using the 120's with the stock computer or do u need injector drivers to change them over so the stock computer can read them

I'm just Debating mass air vs speed density, from my browsing it seems allot of guys with the stock computer still use mass air...

I got some more home work to do I guess !! Lol

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

It's a huge debate between girdle and billet caps. Some like one some like the other, and some like both. Most agree though that one or the other help to keep the engine together.

As far as the computer I use a stock computer modified for low independence injectors. I forget who does the mod to the ecm, but if you post up that you're looking for one someone will have one.

As far as lock ups and non-lockups there is also a huge debate. I think what it boils down to is that the old non-lockups were only good for track use, as they caused a lot of heat and used a lot more fuel out on the street. The modern day ones are more advanced though and give you the best of both worlds. After reading through some debates I sided with the people I trust more who say non-lockup is the way to go. I am sure there are plenty of people who are happy with their lock-ups though.

Lastly I use speed density on my car. Again there is a lot of debate over which to use and they both have their pros and cons. Here's a pretty solid read on the two - http://www.pcmforless.com/index.php...-mass-air-flow-maf-&catid=34:tuning&Itemid=56

 

[lightningdan]

It's a huge debate between girdle and billet caps. Some like one some like the other, and some like both. Most agree though that one or the other help to keep the engine together.

As far as the computer I use a stock computer modified for low independence injectors. I forget who does the mod to the ecm, but if you post up that you're looking for one someone will have one.

As far as lock ups and non-lockups there is also a huge debate. I think what it boils down to is that the old non-lockups were only good for track use, as they caused a lot of heat and used a lot more fuel out on the street. The modern day ones are more advanced though and give you the best of both worlds. After reading through some debates I sided with the people I trust more who say non-lockup is the way to go. I am sure there are plenty of people who are happy with their lock-ups though.

Lastly I use speed density on my car. Again there is a lot of debate over which to use and they both have their pros and cons. Here's a pretty solid read on the two - http://www.pcmforless.com/index.php...-mass-air-flow-maf-&catid=34:tuning&Itemid=56

That is a good read, the first gen lightnings came SD and for years there's been the debate on switching to mass air, and the pros and cons, I was just curious

Thanks for explaining the converter if I am going to do this I'm going to put and 600mm series tiurbo on the car so like in ur sig I'm probably going to need a 3k stall

Have u done any weight deduction? I read years ago about crash bar removal, how hard/ serious is that? They say u can save 40lbs, I'm a fanatic about weight loss, it's basically free horsepower, I have found fiberglass bumpers and fillers, I was wondering if they have stock appearing fiberglass hoods and truck lids?

Another thing I want to do is the gnx dash! That looks sick compared to stock, do they still make the kit to swap over to the gnx dash?

Thanks again buddy, I'm leaving now for Maine to spend the weekend with the In-laws, so of u don't hear from me this weekend don't think I'm being rude, have a good one!!

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

I wouldn't say removing weight is free. There are some nice fiberglass hoods and trunk lids out there, but you're going to drop some coin. I haven't shed any pounds yet because I think you get more bang for your buck in other places. If I were to start shedding pounds i would start with aluminum drums and bumper supports. I know a one vendor that makes the GNX dash, but I have heard horror stories with dealing with that company. If and when I do my dash I will make my own. There was a member that was selling dash blanks that you could drill your own holes in to set it up the way you want it with the gauges you want. This can be very costly though - 1500 bucks or so. Again, not where I want to spend my money at this point. Have fun with the in-laws!

 

[lightningdan]

I wouldn't say removing weight is free. There are some nice fiberglass hoods and trunk lids out there, but you're going to drop some coin. I haven't shed any pounds yet because I think you get more bang for your buck in other places. If I were to start shedding pounds i would start with aluminum drums and bumper supports. I know a one vendor that makes the GNX dash, but I have heard horror stories with dealing with that company. If and when I do my dash I will make my own. There was a member that was selling dash blanks that you could drill your own holes in to set it up the way you want it with the gauges you want. This can be very costly though - 1500 bucks or so. Again, not where I want to spend my money at this point. Have fun with the in-laws!

I saw a few threads about having a hard time with the company they makes the conversion kits for the tnx dash, I know they also had a plug and play wiring harness that goes with it, how are guys swapping dashes now? That's one of the first things I would want to do... I like the layout so much more

Do u happen to know a place to get hoods and deck lids?

As for the drums call me lazy but I hate them on anything lol, does anyway swap them over to disc by using factory parts? Like our lightnings came with rear drums, well the 94 ford explorer came with the same rearend except it had disc brakes, so we hunt the junk yard for explorers and rob them of they disc brake brackets and calipers, do any other gbody cars come with the same rearend as the GN with disc brakes? I saw after market setups by they seem to go for 1500 bucks, which isn't bad when doing a disc swap, I w just curious