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When does your alky come on?

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1dollardog

Are we there yet?
Joined
Jan 5, 2007
Messages
1,307
Well things are really coming together with my set up. Eric did a new alky chip for me and I've started tuning. At what psi does your alky kick in? I have a diy alky set up with tunable manual valve increasing or decreasing the amount of alky sprayed with a single nozzle. It is supplied from a tank pumped by a stock gn fuel pump with a valved bypass. My kit is controlled via a hobbs non adjustable switch coming on at 8psi. It "feels" too late for me. But......when it comes on it takes off like a rocket. When do you guys have your's set to come on.
Thanks
 
I have an alky control kit, and mine is still set at 10psi for turn on, I've been thinking to turn it back to 8, Idk, jury is still out on that one, cause the only place I'm gettting knock is on the shift points and thats running 14/15 lbs of boost on a stock turbo. So until I figure out whats causing that I'm gonna leave it at 10psi. Maybe a rebuild on the tranny and new converter is the answer......haven't figured it out yet.
 
My theory on this is that you only need alky to suppress knock so I have mine set up to turn on about 4-5psi below where I first see knock occur. For me that is about 12psi so my turn on point is 8psi. Why 4-5lbs sooner? Because if you wait until the point you see knock it will be too late. If your turn on point is too early it will bog which is probably the problem that you're having. It's a dog because your car has to burn up all that extra fuel that it doesn't need first then it starts making power. Find out when you first see knock and adjust accordingly. If it still bogs your nozzle may be too large.
 
Was at 6psi......not sure what I'll set it at when car is done............
 
My theory on this is that you only need alky to suppress knock so I have mine set up to turn on about 4-5psi below where I first see knock occur. For me that is about 12psi so my turn on point is 8psi. Why 4-5lbs sooner? Because if you wait until the point you see knock it will be too late. If your turn on point is too early it will bog which is probably the problem that you're having. It's a dog because your car has to burn up all that extra fuel that it doesn't need first then it starts making power. Find out when you first see knock and adjust accordingly. If it still bogs your nozzle may be too large.
I'm not so sure that "bog" is my issue. I haven't seen knock. My set up is much different than most and according to the scanmaster I have no knock up to 20psi (that is as much psi as i have pushed it to so far) and I have never ran it with out alky to see just where KR starts. Once my alky light comes on I seem to start building the most power so I think (with my set up anyway) it seems to make sence that I need alky earlier (4-5 psi). Does this make any sence to anyone or am I way off track?
 
I'm not so sure that "bog" is my issue. I haven't seen knock. My set up is much different than most and according to the scanmaster I have no knock up to 20psi (that is as much psi as i have pushed it to so far) and I have never ran it with out alky to see just where KR starts. Once my alky light comes on I seem to start building the most power so I think (with my set up anyway) it seems to make sence that I need alky earlier (4-5 psi). Does this make any sence to anyone or am I way off track?

So if you have never ran it without alky then how do you know where your knock begins? Thus how do you know what your turn on point should be? Some may have a turn on point from the start of any boost but that can be done if you have a progressive system and have it dialed in correctly. But if you only have a all on system then that means you're getting a full blast of alky at no matter what boost level you set it therefore you could have your turn on point set too low and that would create bog or excessively rich mixture which still inturn creates UHMMM bog!!! Or sluggish accelleration or slow starts whatever you want to call it. Still the same thing. Try turning the boost down see where you have knock without alky then set your turn on point from there.
 
That is a good point about tuning for knock. Since I haven't seen knock I am tuning for the cooling properties of the alky and the added properties of cooler air as the result. And again my performance increases when the alky turns on. It doesn't decrease when the alky turns on so I know it isn't an over fueling issue. If I had bog in the early stages of the alky kicking in, then I would know that it was getting the alky too soon... or either the fuel (gas) would need to be decreased. Correct? I am just looking for that "ummmph" that the alky adds, just a little earlier.
 
That is a good point about tuning for knock. Since I haven't seen knock I am tuning for the cooling properties of the alky and the added properties of cooler air as the result. And again my performance increases when the alky turns on. It doesn't decrease when the alky turns on so I know it isn't an over fueling issue. If I had bog in the early stages of the alky kicking in, then I would know that it was getting the alky too soon... or either the fuel (gas) would need to be decreased. Correct? I am just looking for that "ummmph" that the alky adds, just a little earlier.

Look, how much plainer can I explain it to you? You can't have the best of both worlds. You are not running a progressive system soooo that means that when your alky comes on it is spraying at full capacity all the time. Now how can you tell me that your car requires the same amount of alcohol at 6 psi than it does at 20 psi? It does'nt most likely your car does not supply enough air to support that large does of alcohol at 6 to whatever psi you would normally see knock. So guess what? Your running rich on fuel and guess what else a rich fuel mixture does? It makes your car a dog out of the hole. Of coarse your performance increases when the alky turns on.....duh....you can run more boost. That has nothing to do with your sluggish performance down low. Remember leaner is meaner. Plus you have Hooker Headers they have large primiary tubes and require lots of exhaust volume to fill them up, so that will add to your slowness out the hole. They are great for making power at the top end but unless you have some serious motor work I dought you have enough horsepower to fill them up at the lower rpms. Which only adds to my point....leaner fuel mixture, hotter exhaust gases, faster exhaust molecules, faster spool times.........= happy camper.

I hope that spells it out for you if not someone else will have to take over.
 
The science is true but I believe the point is missed. No need to get angry. Thank you.
 
The science is true but I believe the point is missed. No need to get angry. Thank you.

Don't sweat it. Honestly I'm not angry, why would I be. It's just hard to explain it to you when you turn around and answer your own question. So I figured someone else might do better. I might be over-complicating the answer but it's the only way I know how to explain it. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
 
Do you want a car that will run a lot better than it is now ???? Take off the hooker headers !!!:cool:
 
Mine comes on at 22psi when I run 116 and 16psi on 93octane. Have a nice day
 
Do you want a car that will run a lot better than it is now ???? Take off the hooker headers !!!:cool:
What are my options for this set up? I could use a set of n/a manifolds. Who else has 3.8 n/a headers?
Thanks.
 
Look, how much plainer can I explain it to you? You can't have the best of both worlds. You are not running a progressive system soooo that means that when your alky comes on it is spraying at full capacity all the time. Now how can you tell me that your car requires the same amount of alcohol at 6 psi than it does at 20 psi? It does'nt most likely your car does not supply enough air to support that large does of alcohol at 6 to whatever psi you would normally see knock. So guess what? Your running rich on fuel and guess what else a rich fuel mixture does? It makes your car a dog out of the hole. Of coarse your performance increases when the alky turns on.....duh....you can run more boost. That has nothing to do with your sluggish performance down low. Remember leaner is meaner. Plus you have Hooker Headers they have large primiary tubes and require lots of exhaust volume to fill them up, so that will add to your slowness out the hole. They are great for making power at the top end but unless you have some serious motor work I dought you have enough horsepower to fill them up at the lower rpms. Which only adds to my point....leaner fuel mixture, hotter exhaust gases, faster exhaust molecules, faster spool times.........= happy camper.

I hope that spells it out for you if not someone else will have to take over.

This answer make alot of sense to me. My Razor kit comes on at 2 lbs boost on 93 octane. Methanol is cheap when compared the head gaskets. Yes my car will bog between 3-6 lbs boost but simply raise the boost and you have power up to the max at 20 lbs with zero knock on 93 octane. Time to get a progressive alky kit and lose the hooker headers. My 2 cents as there are many ways to get to your goals. Brad
 
What are my options for this set up? I could use a set of n/a manifolds. Who else has 3.8 n/a headers?
Thanks.

As a side note.......even Hookers are better than stockers. The only difference is where you will see the power. Hookers make power up top but kills bottom rpm power, stockers make power down low but will choke the motor down in upper rpm's when you need it most. Either hold out for some other aftermarket headers or get you a custom set made. All you would really need is a replacement passenger side header and use your stocker on the drivers side.
 
As a side note.......even Hookers are better than stockers. The only difference is where you will see the power. Hookers make power up top but kills bottom rpm power, stockers make power down low but will choke the motor down in upper rpm's when you need it most. Either hold out for some other aftermarket headers or get you a custom set made. All you would really need is a replacement passenger side header and use your stocker on the drivers side.
Ive yet to see a set of production headers make less power than anything else in a car slower than 10.50. The 3 bolt housing chokes more than the headsers
 
Then instead of chacing the power point of the headers, what would a small shot of nitrous (25) down low to make up the difference. Seems like there wouldn't have to be a trade off then. Nitrous would aid out of the hole and since the set up seems to be made for the top end, that part would take care of its self.
 
Ive yet to see a set of production headers make less power than anything else in a car slower than 10.50. The 3 bolt housing chokes more than the headsers

Bison you are correct on an Intercooled car but on a Hot Air I think the stock passenger side header is a huge restriction once you hit around the 12.0 mark.

Then instead of chacing the power point of the headers, what would a small shot of nitrous (25) down low to make up the difference. Seems like there wouldn't have to be a trade off then. Nitrous would aid out of the hole and since the set up seems to be made for the top end, that part would take care of its self.

That might be a winner. It's worth a try.
 
Bison you are correct on an Intercooled car but on a Hot Air I think the stock passenger side header is a huge restriction once you hit around the 12.0 mark.



That might be a winner. It's worth a try.
I agree on the 84-85. I've seen the headers altered to work more like the 86-87 setup
 
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