70 Mach 1 close race

[bishir]

I was at the local cruise-in tonight and one of my favorite cars of all time parks by me. It was a gorgeous red 70 Mach 1 w/ a 351 shaker. I talked about Mustangs for a long time with the owner to find out the car is stoked to about a 393 and it produced about 330 HP at the rear wheels through a horsepower robbing c-6.

Well it was time to head home and he was going my way so we decided to see what the cars could do against each other. Unfortunately, we couldn't hit a light or if we did it was in traffic. Well, we were able to get an open stretch of road before my exit.

I pulled along side of him and brake boosted to about 10lbs at 40mph. As soon as I heard him nail it I let off the brake. I jumped ahead about 1 1/2 car lengths immediately and he started to gain. He got to my rear bumper at about 90 mph and I hit the brakes for my exit. That cleveland can rev and I'm sure he would have had me if we would have continued, but I was impressed with my GN's performance.

Our cars are running comparable times in the 1/8th so it was what I expected. Big thumbs up all around as I exited for home. I'm seriously considering buying a 69 or 70 Mach 1 after I sell my convertible.

James

 

[Raymond Bunch]

Good Run

bishir

Darn good run. Although, if you would had been running some 110-116 octane and up the boost a weeee bit. I don't think he would have stood a chance against the ole GN.

 

[GNracer2000]

Nice race. I have a green 70 Mach 1 all stock restoration. You said his was stroked and only making about 330 hp though because mine stock has about 320 with the 351 ram air shaker. Just kinda weird to me thats all but good race.

 

[bishir]

That 330 was at the rear wheels. Not sure if yours was too.

 

[matt87]

pretty stout car to have 330 rwhp on a n\a motor. with your mods you probally have about 260 rwhp. couple of small mods and hes done.

 

[GNracer2000]

330 hp at the wheels sounds much better than my 320 or so at the flywheel. It's a pretty sweet ride but not as quick as my GN.

 

[stroked347]

330 RWHP sounds kinda low for a 393. Did he say it was a Clevland motor?

 

[bishir]

Yes, it was a 71 Cleveland motor. I think the C-6 had a lot to do with the HP drain...

 

[blackbuick87]

All right I have wondered this for a while, whats the difference between the Cleveland and the Windsor? The Windsor it the truck block, right?

 

[momau3]

Both share a common bore and stroke dimension, most other specifications were different.

The Windsor uses a different camshaft, so the firing order of Windsor and Cleveland engines are different.

The cylinder head bolt patterns are the same, but the cylinder head castings are different.

The 351W was designed for low-speed torque, while the 351C owes its lineage to the Boss 302.

The 351C is considered to be the first of the 335 series engine family.

The Cleveland has a heavier and stronger block designed for larger cylinder heads (even though their heads are interchangeable).

The easiest method to destinguish the two is the Cleveland has smaller {14 mm spark plugs} than the Windsor {17 mm.}

 

[bishir]

What the previous poster said The names come from where the engines were originally produced. Cleveland, Ohio and Windsor, Ontario. I know in Mustangs, 1969 was the last year for the Windsor and 1970 was when they started with the Clevelands. Windsor = work horse low end touque!

Cleveland = horsepower and high RPMs..

 

[68 stang]

May I some infomation about the Cleveland? The Cleveland uses a different block than the Windsor. The Windsor came out in 1969 and the Cleveland in 1970. The Cleveland was produced from 1970-1974. There were two different versions of the Cleveland.
Then was the 2 barrel, the heads were different, the intake was 2.05 and the exhaust was 1.60+. The four barrel had 2.19 intake and 1.70+ exhaust. The cooling passages were different on the Windsor and the Cleveland. Also no there were no water passages in the intake of the Cleveland. Another way to tell the difference between the Windsor and the Cleveland is to look at how many valve cover bolts are on them. Also the Clevelands also usually had a 2 or 4 cast into them into the upper corners of the head.

Bishir, I believe that you are mistaken. You could get a Cleveland or a Windsor in 1970. However the problem is that the engine code is the same, therefore hard to tell the difference.

 

[bishir]

Yes, you could get a windsor in a 1970 car, but it all depends on the production date of that Mustang. Early production cars had Windsors.

You said, "The Windsor came out in 1969" Nope, came out before that, but I'm sure you just made a typo. Just didn't want to confuse the person who asked the question..

James

 

[68 stang]

I am sorry I meant that the 351 Windsor came out in 1969. The Windsor engine series, I believe was started in 1962. At first it was a 221, then a 260, 289 in 1964 I believe. Next a 302 in 1968. Sorry for the confusion.

 

[70Firebird/TTA]

What were the "stock" performance of both Windsor and Cleavland motors? I am guessing that stock would be around low 14s. Boss 351 was good for around 13.7. Either way...the car is a classic piece of history...much like what the GNs will be considered in future...if not considered already.

 

[68 stang]

14's sound about right, but I do not have the 50 Fastest Fords list in front of me. I wish Ford had put the Boss 351 in a 68 Mustang. It would of shaved off a few hundred pounds. But, oh well.

 

[kjhansen]

I thought the Windsor was the small block derived from the 260-289 family. The Cleveland was a completely different engine.
Keith

 

[68 stang]

It is, the Cleveland is a different beast altogether. It even shares the distrib. off of the 460.