Anyone bringing a fast car to Morocco?
- Thread starter Brad T
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I really do miss going to BG and seeing nothing but taillights as far as the eye could see when you were in line at the track, That was back in the early 90s. Last time I went I was very dissapointed. These last few years have really been getting to me. If it were the economy and all why the heck are there no vendors going to these events? Seriously, I used to go from vendor to vendor to find the best parts then go back and buy as much as I could. Now Im lucky if there is 1 vendor there and they dont always bring parts. I guess I just dont understand anymore. Maybe the internet has created more of a burden than a help in this situation. Just not like it used to be. Maybe Im just too old school. I like to hold onto a part rather than pay shipping and see what I get. Maybe Ill go to the local track this weekend or even Morrocco and that may get me out of the blues. Thanks for listening.
turbosam6 said:
I couldn't disagree more! I own my own performance shop and can tell you first hand, yes the LS1 is a great motor BUT, it is in NO WAY cheap to make go fast reliably. I have built and tuned the fastest 04 NA GTO in the country, built and tuned many LS1 camaro's and gto's. For the same money i could have a regal go faster and get better mileage.
As for financing, i was looking at an 01 LS1 camaro, 430 a month and 18% intrest, Got my 5th GN instead, 230 per month and 9% intrest
Having had the fastest 2000-2004 Impala and being in the w-body world, then the fastest cobaltSS in the country and hanging in that world, i'll take the good ol' Buick community ANYDAY!
My buick GN gets MORE looks and comments than ANY other car i have owned and or driven, PERIOD! :wink:
But this is america and we are entitled to our own opinions :smile:
raflyer said:I couldn't disagree more! I own my own performance shop and can tell you first hand, yes the LS1 is a great motor BUT, it is in NO WAY cheap to make go fast reliably. I have built and tuned the fastest 04 NA GTO in the country, built and tuned many LS1 camaro's and gto's. For the same money i could have a regal go faster and get better mileage.
As for financing, i was looking at an 01 LS1 camaro, 430 a month and 18% intrest, Got my 5th GN instead, 230 per month and 9% intrest
Having had the fastest 2000-2004 Impala and being in the w-body world, then the fastest cobaltSS in the country and hanging in that world, i'll take the good ol' Buick community ANYDAY!
My buick GN gets MORE looks and comments than ANY other car i have owned and or driven, PERIOD! :wink:
But this is america and we are entitled to our own opinions :smile:
Care to explain why the deal on financing was so bad on an f body? That makes zero sense. Newer cars get a lower interest rate, unless you're upside down in them.
I won't get into the debate again about which is easier to run fast in. Common sense tells you that any TR is going to need a small investment just to be able to mod it (things like the fuel pump, wiring, vacuum lines, etc), as its going to be with any older car. Parts are getting harder to get, and many are discontinued. You can buy an LS1 F body, install a nitrous kit, get some drag radials, and go 11's. $700. I challenge anyone here to go 11's in a stone stock TR for $700 in new parts. remember, $300 of that will be tires. So for $400, the price of a decent dry nitrous kit, how would you get a TR into the 11's? You'll be lucky to get it running properly for $400. You couldn't even replace the turbo for that much, and 11's on a stock turbo is extremely difficult. Not to mention injectors, chips, fuel pump/hotwire, exhaust, air inlet, etc.
I won't even get into durability. We'll just say the glass jaw'd 109 block with its sub par oiling system doesn't compare to an LS1.
turbosam6 said:
Can't explain the financing, thru me for a loop as well. As for the LS1, don't forget to add 2K for a good rear-end to hold all that dry shot nitrous
:biggrin: I make an average of 250 passes down the 1/4 a year, i see it all! Remember, i build and tune these things everyday! (LS1's)You are gravely mistaken in your commenst on how "easy" it is. I'll leave it at that :wink:
I will say though that the LS1 is my 2nd favorite engine next to the LC2 :biggrin:
If you're building them every day and can't get 11's easy then maybe you're doing something wrong? I've seen quite a few guys do it, my car was running 10's with about $3K in it, on the stock rear (time bomb). There are a few guys going 10's on the stock rear, but its not going to be reliable. I'd rather buy a good rear and not worry about it though. There are guys (albeit lightweights) going low 11's with no internal engine mods. Just bolt ons, gears, stall, etc. If I'm mistaken about LS1's then you better go over to LS1tech.com and tell those guys doing it they are all wrong.
And if the LC2 were superior, you'd see guys making my kind of power on pump gas. And I'm on a blower, you should see the turbo guys! I'm sorry but the LS1 is superior to the LC2 in every aspect. Its stronger, cheaper, has much better heads, and benefits from technology that isn't well over 20 years old. I love TR's, but they aren't practical IMO for a really high HP application. To make boosted Ls1 power you'd have a 109 on the ragged edge or a stage block with so much $$$ invested you'd sweat every time you turn the key. And forget about doing it on pump gas.
And if the LC2 were superior, you'd see guys making my kind of power on pump gas. And I'm on a blower, you should see the turbo guys! I'm sorry but the LS1 is superior to the LC2 in every aspect. Its stronger, cheaper, has much better heads, and benefits from technology that isn't well over 20 years old. I love TR's, but they aren't practical IMO for a really high HP application. To make boosted Ls1 power you'd have a 109 on the ragged edge or a stage block with so much $$$ invested you'd sweat every time you turn the key. And forget about doing it on pump gas.
turbosam6 said:
You would be lucky to make 1 pass on that stock rear end! Sam you sound very bitter that your GN never performed to your expectations, don't dump on the Buicks just because of that.
I was out of turbo Buicks for about 2.5 years, and seriously considered an LS1 F-body, but after driving a few, and hanging around on LS1tech.com for a few months, I chose the Buick. Sure there are plenty of guys running fast LS1's, but generally, I saw many, many sigs, and cars for sale, from guys with as much $$ in mods as they paid for the car, running 11.80's, and trapping 120+ mph. What's that all about? Plus, the comparison of the front end, to a catfish, just stuck in my head!
I see more aftermarket parts for the Buick now than when I had my WE4. Including: Maftpro, 60lb hi-z injectors, ME-R MaxEffort, BigStuff3, data loggers, cranks, Razors alchohol kit, TurboTweak chips, etc. Sure they are not everyones dream car, but I prefer it over the F-body.
My car had many sub 11 second passes on the stock rear, some members have literally hundreds of 11 second and faster passes on theirs. I personally think they are still junk, but the flipside is you can buy another one for $100 or so if you break yours. I don't consider $2500 for a 12 bolt a bad investment anyway. I'd rather spend that than deal with other motor related issues.
Yeah, there are alot of F bodies for sale. I also see quite a few TR's FS or trade over there too, so I'm not the only one. I'm not putting TR's down at all, they are awesome cars. I'd like to own another one someday, but it'll be very close to stock. Trying to go fast on a block designed forver ago to make like 120 HP is futile at best. Yeah, a few guys do it. And alot of them break in the process. Aside from the rear and (an issue on pretty much any performance car made in the last 20 years), the LS1 F body is very tough.
I'm glad you like your car, thats all that matters. Other peoples opinions are useless, you like what you like. I consider the TR an excellent stepping stone, I learned a ton about forced induction and cars in general from mine. At some point though, you want to go faster than a TR realisticly allows, and you might want to do it with streetablity and some durability. I've had quite a few members here contact me about LS1 stuff, they are getting ready to make the switch too. If you look at all the racing classes, like drag radial and stuff, you see F bodies and mustangs, and some G bodies. You see no turbo buick stuff. Ever wonder why? Its impractical. You'd need an all out stage motor to compete, and even then you'd be mid pack at best. Some of the fast stage 2 guys here know what I'm saying.
The appeal of the TR was that you could have a completely functional, streetable, loaded, practical 11 second car. 10+ years ago, that was enough. In some places it still is. But if you go to some of the serious spots in america, where street racing is still active, 11 seconds will get you left sitting broke. Technology has progressed, and continues to do so. With the introduction of the aftermarket LSX block and heads, we will see 2000 HP street cars.
Yeah, there are alot of F bodies for sale. I also see quite a few TR's FS or trade over there too, so I'm not the only one. I'm not putting TR's down at all, they are awesome cars. I'd like to own another one someday, but it'll be very close to stock. Trying to go fast on a block designed forver ago to make like 120 HP is futile at best. Yeah, a few guys do it. And alot of them break in the process. Aside from the rear and (an issue on pretty much any performance car made in the last 20 years), the LS1 F body is very tough.
I'm glad you like your car, thats all that matters. Other peoples opinions are useless, you like what you like. I consider the TR an excellent stepping stone, I learned a ton about forced induction and cars in general from mine. At some point though, you want to go faster than a TR realisticly allows, and you might want to do it with streetablity and some durability. I've had quite a few members here contact me about LS1 stuff, they are getting ready to make the switch too. If you look at all the racing classes, like drag radial and stuff, you see F bodies and mustangs, and some G bodies. You see no turbo buick stuff. Ever wonder why? Its impractical. You'd need an all out stage motor to compete, and even then you'd be mid pack at best. Some of the fast stage 2 guys here know what I'm saying.
The appeal of the TR was that you could have a completely functional, streetable, loaded, practical 11 second car. 10+ years ago, that was enough. In some places it still is. But if you go to some of the serious spots in america, where street racing is still active, 11 seconds will get you left sitting broke. Technology has progressed, and continues to do so. With the introduction of the aftermarket LSX block and heads, we will see 2000 HP street cars.
Sam- There is one major benefit G-bodies have over F-bodies that you kind of breezed over- COMFORT! If you really want to just go fast, get some stripped down light weight car like a 63 Chevelle (I think they made them that year) with a big honkin motor in it. But if 11's are fast enough, and you value good looks and a nice plush ride, you can't beat the TR's.
XXQUICK6XX
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The track canceled it. I drove back to Chicago and got another set of tires and wheels to race Sunday so I feel your pain plus it wasn't even looking threatening at all weatherwise.
Steve
Steve
GNRick said:
Come over and sit in my Camaro, its actually quite comfortable. It still has the full leather interior and the seating position feels much better than a TR, like you're actually sitting in a sports car. I could see the TR being more comfortable and easier to get in and out of if you had a bad back or something, the F body is kinda low.
And a 63 chevelle is a bad example, its heavier than my car and once it making this much power and gutted out it would basically be a race car.
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