Cracked Head?

[1QUICK85]

Ok, not sure if all you guys have seen my early posts or not. But, I have been struggling to find boost, since last fall!! I then found out I blew both my head gaskets. I was burning antifreeze through the exhaust. So, I got the heads off and took them to a shop and the guys said that if the heads had cracks they would be on the outside of the heads since the antifreeze was burning through the exhaust. So they didnt magna flux 'em and I didnt know the difference, I mean these guys are the pros' I now know I should have gotten them magna fluxed, NO MATTER WHAT!!!
I now got my car back together with new headgaskets and non-magna-fluxed heads and I have the same damn problem......no exhaust leaks, puck sealing fine....wastegate rod as short as it goes.......and only 10# of boost. And a very small trace of white smoke. Reminds me of my car a few weeks before it started to just pour white smoke like a chimney. So, I am leaning towards cracked head?? The car also stubbles and jolts, so to say, when I step on it and any speed. And from a stop it hesatates and then goes......like it wants to die.
I havent had time yet to do any pressure checks on it........as I am in the middle of changing heads on another vehicle Would a crack in the head cause this lost of boost........were would the boost go into the coolant?? Can I do a pressure test on the cyclinders when they are cold.........as the passenger side is a pain to get to......spark plugs.
Thanks for any advice, as I am so sick of this........I am almost 100% sure it is a bad head? Thanks, Nick

 

[49-blues]

If you got antifreeze in the oil-better also check the bearings, got extra sets of good low mileage stock heads if you need them.

 

[1QUICK85]

No antifreeze in the oil and no oil in the anitfreeze, forgot to mention that. It just sucks to think that I just had the heads off and at the shop. I even asked the shop what all needs to be done to these before I throw them back on.......and he told me that there is no need to magnaflux them and he will just shave the surfaces. And now I have had guys tell me that no matter what magnaflux them. So I think I must have a crack somewhere inside the heads, cause my low boost problem. I also now have that small trace of white smoke out the exhaust. Thanks, I am venting a little....., Nick
*EDIT* I think I may have confused ya with where does the boost go? Into the coolant?? I am just wondering if there is a crack in the head causeing the low boost then were does the boost go that I lose so much power?? But, there is no oil in the coolant or vice versa.

 

[Lee Thompson]

?

If you have a cracked head, it will leak coolant to the outside or into the (combustion chamber only when the eng. is shut off after being run as there will be pressure in the cooling system and none in the combustion chamber)or into the valve cover. I assume you feel it is a crack in the combustion chamber. If so there WILL BE BUBBLES coming into the collant recovery tank every time the piston comes up to make power (fire). If you think you should have more boost than 10 lbs. and the excess is going into the cooling system, you would be blowing water out the coolant tank. Been there, done that. As far as white smoke that appears to be buring water. Do you lose coolant? With a 15 lb. rad. cap and the eng. warm and idling do you have bubbles in the coolant tank? If so, one way to pinpoint which cyl. it is ---make up another plug wire with an old plug in it, remove one spark plug at a time and also remove that plug wire from the coil pack install the old plug wire and route it to the fender and wrap with a towel to prevent fire from jumping every where. Whichever hole is bad --there will be no bubbles when that plug is out.

 

[1QUICK85]

I will check for bubbles in the overfill tank. Also how do you tell if you turbo is going bad? Just by the play in the shaft? I have no shaft play what so ever? But, I did notice the inside of my exhaust elbow where the downpipe hooks up to has a very black coating on it......might be from when I was running very rich becasue of the blown headgaskets?? The white smoke I have now is my concern that I have a cracked head and the low boost of course. I will have to go tinker with it.
Oh ya, I am not pushing coolant out of the overfill tank at all. I know what that looks like...... as my moms blazer just cracked a head and I am changing that for her. Looked like a pot of boiling water.....my GN doesnt do that.
Thanks, Nick

 

[49-blues]

Might possibly be a turbo seal also which could cause white smoke out the exhaust and boost lose.

 

[1QUICK85]

How do I check for a bad turbo seal? I dont feel any shaft play in the turbo at all?? I figure my bucking at full throttle blast is probably just to much fuel.
Thanks, Nick

 

[BuickTV6]

Nick, also consider the possibility that u may not be able to get more than 10 psi boost cause of a leak. The TM kits were prone for vacuum leaks where the doghouse was welded onto the intake on the passanger side. I have spoken to a few other people who experienced this exact same problem. You hit boost and she all leaks out. Recenelt for no reason, my car started running like crap. running choppy, and i can't hit more than 9-10 psi boost. I thought maybe a headgasket, but theres no antifreeze i the oil, or vice versa, no overheating, so bubbles in the rad or the recovery tank. In fact the pressure is great. at idle im only getting about 8 on the vac side of the boost guage, and the guage moves from 8-10, so im assuming theres a leak somewhere, and I thinkt hat might be it. Turnowrenchhead had the same problem with his TM intake, and had to have it re-welded. Also make sure your wastegate solenoid is hooked up correctly, and the map sensor. I never rehooked the map sensor after i did the tm conversion. I was getting error codes for the map sensor, wastegate solenoid, and egr valve. Since i eliminated the egr with the tm kit, I will have to get a chip burnt for it to delete the egr circuit. Respond back and I will try to help ya, as i need help with my ride too!

 

[1QUICK85]

Thanks BuickTV6, do you think it is possible to hook the boost gauge up to the turbo port........like splice it in with the wastegate and the fuel pressure regulator?? This way the boost gauge is reading boost from their instead of off the intake?? And maybe I would get a different reading, like 15#, and that would show a leak somewhere.....beyond the turbo?? I have eliminated the egr too, with my custom chip. I have seen vacumm leak testers at Sears.......would these tell me if their is a intake leak? The only reason I am leaning towards a cracked head is the little ass trace of white smoke here and there.......but that could just be me jumping the gun like usual. It does hold a idle real nice.....just problems when I get into boost.
I am going to try and get working on this by the end of next week I hope lots of personal stuff going on and working on another vehicle too. I hate not being able to drive my car.
Thanks, Nick

 

[1QUICK85]

I finally got to tinker with her some more today.......I havent been able to work on her for a couple weeks or so.......sucks......I really miss driving it...... anyways ->

So, I put a radiator cap pressure tester on it and this is what I got:

1.Engine cold/not ran for weeks........held pressure just fine.
2.Ran engine with pressure testor and no sudden jump in pressure.....I actually built the pressure up with the pressure tester to the desired pressure and then went back to look at it a couple minutes later and the pressure jumped up a couple of pounds.
3.Turn warm engine off and did a pressure test and the needle slowly went down after I quit pumping it up to the pressure level??Cracked head or head gaskets??

I have seen cars with cracked heads.........that just pour anitfreeze out the overfill tank because of bubbles.....my car doesnt do this at all. It does blow white smoke like a bitch. No oil in antifreeze and no antifreee in oil.
What do you guys think..........I am thinking about just ripping the F'ing heads back off and looking at the gaskets.......and try some nice used heads............I hate to magnaflux my heads......and find, "ya one of the heads is cracked" or both.......then have to shell out more money for used heads What is a good price for used heads that are ready to just throw on the car.

Thanks for alll you guys help!!!!!Nick

 

[49-blues]

turbo seals- try changng out the turbo before going into all the work of removing the heads- it worked for me and then you can confirm to some of the other members on this board that white smoke doesnt only come from coolant leaks.

 

[1QUICK85]

Do you think the turbo would cause my bucking when stepping on the throttle........but when I lower fuel pressure the damn bucking goes away...........cause the fuel is adjust to the amount of boost I run.........kinda answered my own question.

I dont have a spare turbo sitting around..........have to look into that.............my turbo has no shaft play can the seals still be out and the shaft play seem fine??

TIA, Nick

 

[GNR85]

I'm by no means a expert on these cars, I also have a 85 GN, 105k on it. Well my car didn"t feel like it should perform the way it was meant to, so I decided on a rebuild after doing some diagnostics. The car ran fine, idled fine, just didn't feel like it had the power and boost it should. Pulled the engine apart to build it, had them check the heads, etc, same with the block. Well unknown to me my car had a crack in the block in the lifter valley, higher up by where the head bolts on. I did look the block over before I took it to the machine shop and did not notice it, they didn't either till they cleaned/manufluxed it. Don't know if this helps, maybe something else to look at?

 

[1QUICK85]

GNR85.........I hope my block isnt cracked......would you get oil in the antifreeze or antifreeze in the oil with that??
I read in another post that a bad turbo oil drain tube.........blockage or oil just building up in the drain tube can cause oil to blow by the turbo seals???? My drain tube is a home made piece of ****, easier to install.......but I know in one spot it is narrower then the stock drain tube. So, that could possibly cause my white smoke??but I not sure if that would cause my car to run the way it does.

Do you guys use the stock drain tube or a 86/87 drain tube.........got any tips as to how to get the damn thing in the intake manifold and get the turbo mounted. I have a 86/87 style one sitting around I was unable to get the damn thing to fit right. Are there any other options for a drain tube?

TIA, Nick

 

[GNR85]

I was getting a little antifreeze in the oil (I didn't even notice it on the dipstick, only after I did a oil change). It would drip down the valley through the holes in the valley for the camshaft. But thier wasn't alot in my oil, I mainly baby the car and hardly ever get on it. So I think under normal circumstances the antifreeze wasn't coming out, only under hard boost. I never noticed my coolant getting low or the car getting hot. Don't know about the 86/87 turbo, I just decided to get the upgrade to a TA33C on the factory 85 turbo.

 

[alec296]

white smoke

if it was pumping oil into exhaust it would be bluish smoke not white. do you have full exhaust?if so let it idle hot in the same spot for a while 5-10 min if your burning antifreeze it can leave small puddles by the tailpipes or any seep holes in muffs
also pull your plugs out in order and see if any are cleaner than the rest.if its sucking antifreeze into the cyl it will basicly steam clean the piston top and spark plugs of most carbon. which im guessing you might alittle as you say the dwnpipe has blackness
check your pvc valve and hose. mine has a surge like thing going on with low boost but i yankd one of the vac lines from the wastegat and now wicked high boost.it will defintly blow my headgaskets but i can feel the power
good luck hope its not to much$$$
andy

 

[49-blues]

Alec296-Wrong-seen it firsthand -turboseals and white smoke, have you personally had bad seals in one of your turbos,cause if you havent you dont know what you re talking about..

 

[alec296]

turbo

manage a fleet of international diesels usually covers back of bus and tailpipe with oil. may be diffesent with gas motors with cat convertors thuo.
andy