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Delmia on which GN to buy

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notacarlo said:
20 years from now you'll be sitting on the front porch talking to some car guru, listening to him talk about the mighty 87' Grand National. To which you will reply...."I had an 86.".


I'm trying to figure out the logic here. :confused:

The '86 cars are the ones of legend. The '87 cars were the "Me too" cars.

I still remember May 1986, when I met a guy with a 12.8 timeslip (NOS kit). That UNBELIEVABLY fast back then and if is wasn't for his glovebox full of timeslips, NOBODY would have believed him.

Always go with low mileage if condition is the same.

Don't be afraid of bolt on mods. A stock fuel pump will do more damage to a car than a TA49, anyday.

A modded car will usually have a fuelpump, hot wire, airbag, motormount etc. etc. that a "bone stock" car won't have. The kind of stuff you don't see that will add another $1000 to the modding cost.

"Bone Stock" in a T/R is way overrated. These cars run mid 14's "bone stock". Fuel pump, good flowing exhaust, driverside motor mount won't detract from the value of a "stock" car and will allow it to live up to the legend.
 
I would personally be more comfortable with the stock one, especially for a daily driver.
 
it's a no brainer...............it's christmas time and giving warms the heart so
buy both, and send one to me , merry christmas
 
brockblackz28 said:
the 86 is 7K and the 87 is 8K
I'm selling my 87 t-top gn w/8300 miles for $8,000. Bought it from original owner in stock form in '99 w/66000 miles. Received many new Kirban suspension parts and was modded by Cotton in '01 w/78,000 miles. Bought Kirbans test car #3 in '04 so this one is going. Let me know if interested.
 
deezdad said:
I'm selling my 87 t-top gn w/8300 miles for $8,000. Bought it from original owner in stock form in '99 w/66000 miles. Received many new Kirban suspension parts and was modded by Cotton in '01 w/78,000 miles. Bought Kirbans test car #3 in '04 so this one is going. Let me know if interested.

PM sent
 
Ya better look at that thing brock RI puts salt on thier roads durin winter and like everybody says 20 yr old car, nobody can't tell me there ain't rust on em unless they have garaged them the whole time thats where it gets expensive is fixin the body heck ya could dump a new motor in one for about 3 grand, paint job alone could cost that much but in my opinion it has lessened the value drastically if it isn't the original engine.Just my .02.
 
Update

I belive I am going with the 87. I drove it very nice. Interior is perfect! the only concern I had was when driving it and we would go over bumbs the windshield and a guess the dash would vibrate? Is this comman, It was like a rattle or sounded like the windshield was loose??
 
There's a hood support rubber toward the front of the cowl(back of the hood), in the middle. Put a little moly lube on that, and see if the noise doesn't go away. ;)
 
Stop by my house if ya get it i'd like to see it and i'm hoping i'll be done with mine 1st week of january.
 
Hoping to pick up a GN before the end of the year so if you guys get together give me a shout.
 
I was enticed by the mods list, and it really stung me in the ass. If one of these cars doesnt have the original paint, odds are it had bondo on it. Banging on the panel wont tell you if it has bondo. Given the torque these cars make, the whole body tends to twist, and 6 months down the road you'll have bondo cracking open all over the place like mine. Stand by each tailpipe, and look down the side of the car. If you see a bunch of ripples, it has bondo, and bad bondo work at that. Find yourself a really weak magnet. One that barely holds on in an area you know there is no bondo. Go all over the car with this magnet, and if the magnet refuses to hold in some places, there is bondo there. You'll have some on the rear pillars, but you cant do much about that. That said, look under the car and inspect all the bushings for cracks and look all over for rust. Open the doors and look underneath to see if the drain holes are still open, and once again, look for rust. Look at the weatherstripping underneath as well. If the guy will let you, pull back on both of the side covers in the trunk...the ones that cover the opposite side of the quarter panels. Look for holes drilled with bondo seeping through them. Look underneath the gas tank and make sure there are no dents or cracks, and look for repair work...they're sheets of tar paper they glue over holes. Push down on each corner of the car and get the car bouncing. Let go and see if the bouncing stops or if it keeps going. If it keeps going, the shocks are gone. Look to see how much of the brake pads are left in the front.
Make sure the shifter goes into ALL gears. Mine didnt go into first.
Make sure the speedo doesnt grind or bounce.
On the steering column, there is a big ring that would have the shifter arm attached if it were a column shift car. Check how much slop is in it by rotating it each direction. Move it in each direction and make sure the key will still rotate all the way and start the engine. Mine would turn to the on position, but wouldnt start the car. Thats from bad bushings, but you can do a quick adjust under the car that will fix that for the most part.
Check the weatherstripping and listen for wind noise in the doors when you drive.
With the hood up, turn the igition key to the on position. Start counting. Immediately get out of the car and listen to the sound of the brake motor (powermaster) running as it builds pressure. From the time you turn the key on, it should take no more than 7 seconds for it to cycle. if it takes longer, you likely have a bad accumulator.
Ask the guy if you can pull the up-pipe off. its the one that goes from the intercooler to the throttle body. Its held on by 2 hose clamps and should come off very quickly. Look to see if there is alot of oil in that pipe. If there is, you probably have a bad turbo seal.
Make sure the engine idles smoothly (assuming it doesnt have a cam.)
Make sure the tranny shifts properly, and for the love of God, MAKE SURE that the torque converter is locking up at 45mph or a little higher. It will be like a 5th shift and will bring the rpms down further. This will give you better mileage and will keep your tranny cooler. If this isnt working, it will be a pain to figure out the problem and can end up being very costly to repair.
Now this is a big one. make sure you have the 8.5" rear end in it. The bottom of the diff cover, on the diff housing itself in the 4 and 8 o'clock position, you should see some bumps that are part of the casting. The 8.5" rear will have bumps shaped like squares, and the 7.5" rear will have what looks like little hooks instead of a square shaped boss. If you have little hook shaped bosses, you'll have alot of fun finding the right GN rear for it, and it will be costly. That 7.5" rear is weak and should not be on a turbo regal. Mine had a 7.5" rear and it cost me 1300 bucks to get it switched over with new control arms and driveshaft. (uses a different driveshaft).
Print this post up and take it with you. Dont worry about looking stupid or pissing this guy off by looking at everything. Looking for these things will save you thousands and thousands of dollars, and will spare you a ton of stress and heartache. Dont talk yourself into buying the car if things arent right. Another GN will come along and it will be well worth the wait.
 
VadersV6 said:
I was enticed by the mods list, and it really stung me in the ass. If one of these cars doesnt have the original paint, odds are it had bondo on it. Banging on the panel wont tell you if it has bondo. Given the torque these cars make, the whole body tends to twist, and 6 months down the road you'll have bondo cracking open all over the place like mine. Stand by each tailpipe, and look down the side of the car. If you see a bunch of ripples, it has bondo, and bad bondo work at that. Find yourself a really weak magnet. One that barely holds on in an area you know there is no bondo. Go all over the car with this magnet, and if the magnet refuses to hold in some places, there is bondo there. You'll have some on the rear pillars, but you cant do much about that. That said, look under the car and inspect all the bushings for cracks and look all over for rust. Open the doors and look underneath to see if the drain holes are still open, and once again, look for rust. Look at the weatherstripping underneath as well. If the guy will let you, pull back on both of the side covers in the trunk...the ones that cover the opposite side of the quarter panels. Look for holes drilled with bondo seeping through them. Look underneath the gas tank and make sure there are no dents or cracks, and look for repair work...they're sheets of tar paper they glue over holes. Push down on each corner of the car and get the car bouncing. Let go and see if the bouncing stops or if it keeps going. If it keeps going, the shocks are gone. Look to see how much of the brake pads are left in the front.
Make sure the shifter goes into ALL gears. Mine didnt go into first.
Make sure the speedo doesnt grind or bounce.
On the steering column, there is a big ring that would have the shifter arm attached if it were a column shift car. Check how much slop is in it by rotating it each direction. Move it in each direction and make sure the key will still rotate all the way and start the engine. Mine would turn to the on position, but wouldnt start the car. Thats from bad bushings, but you can do a quick adjust under the car that will fix that for the most part.
Check the weatherstripping and listen for wind noise in the doors when you drive.
With the hood up, turn the igition key to the on position. Start counting. Immediately get out of the car and listen to the sound of the brake motor (powermaster) running as it builds pressure. From the time you turn the key on, it should take no more than 7 seconds for it to cycle. if it takes longer, you likely have a bad accumulator.
Ask the guy if you can pull the up-pipe off. its the one that goes from the intercooler to the throttle body. Its held on by 2 hose clamps and should come off very quickly. Look to see if there is alot of oil in that pipe. If there is, you probably have a bad turbo seal.
Make sure the engine idles smoothly (assuming it doesnt have a cam.)
Make sure the tranny shifts properly, and for the love of God, MAKE SURE that the torque converter is locking up at 45mph or a little higher. It will be like a 5th shift and will bring the rpms down further. This will give you better mileage and will keep your tranny cooler. If this isnt working, it will be a pain to figure out the problem and can end up being very costly to repair.
Print this post up and take it with you. Dont worry about looking stupid or pissing this guy off by looking at everything. Looking for these things will save you thousands and thousands of dollars, and will spare you a ton of stress and heartache. Dont talk yourself into buying the car if things arent right. Another GN will come along and it will be well worth the wait.

Awesome post and from experience from some of the threads you have written.
 
Thanks. For the sake of space, I left alot of things out but these are the main things to look for. I edited it and added something about looking for the correct rear end.....a doozy.
 
Wow thanks for all that usefull info! Also when I drove it I did notice the mph needle hop a bit while going slow... How bad of a problem is that?
 
When i got my car, the speedo was disconnected cause when it was, the needle would bounce violently and the dash cluster sounded like a rock crusher. I pulled the gauge cluster out (not a big deal), and pulled the speedo cable off the back. There is a smaller cable inside the big one, and this one pulls right out, assuming youve disconnected the cable under the hood. There is a connector under the hood on the opposite side of the dash cluster. You just unscrew these 2 halves. Anyway, once youve disonnected that one under the hood, you can pull the cluster out, pop the cable off, pull that core wire out...just slides right out, and then you grease the whole thing up really well and slide it back in. Then you reassemble everything. Now my needle bounces a little below 35mph, but not bad. Its very steady above that. If I were to grease the other half (the one that runs from under the hood and connects to the tranny, Im sure everything would be perfect.
 
check around t-top area for rust under the seal like mine had and to tell ya the truth 100% of cars have bondo from factory (things happen) don't be over concerned about it unless it had repaint and is a ripple monster and some guy had no idea of what he was doin go check foose mobiles they have bondo on em and sellin for close to a mil. a car, ask the guy good questions like major damage and look for differences in way panels are hung ie spot welded compared to sheet metal screws holdin it on for dear life or rivets, once you know what your'e lookin for its easy to spot major damage do take a magnet though and if it don't stay on run! :biggrin:
 
Kirban's (215-766-1611) sells a book on shopping for these cars(specifically) and not getting stung in the a$$. Much valuable info!! Their catalog has lots of great resto parts in it, if you don't already have it. ;)
 
my turn........................... :p

I'd go for the 87 and do to the car what you want, in my opinion, the asking price is toooooooo high.
 
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