Finally finished my boost bypass system. Works awesome!

[ijames]

Vaderv6, arguing about names is a tough row to hoe on the internet. Look at all the verbiage in the past about bov vs bpv, aftercooler vs intercooler, valve spring pressure vs force, lb-ft vs ft-lb for torque, etc. You can either spend all your energies on that battle, or you can try to skip past it by making sure that people can tell what you mean when you post and by making sure you understand what other people mean, in spite of how they phrase it, when they post, and get on with the technical discussion (which to me is the good part). Your choice.

However, resorting to gratuitous insults directed at the people you are arguing with is not a good way to further your cause, and posting a picture and caption like that is completely uncalled for, unwanted, and inappropriate. It represents the complete antithesis of "going fast with class". I realize that enough time has passed that you probably cannot delete it yourself, but I hope that one of the moderators does it for you (and if they do, they should also delete this message).

 

[klrv6]

Pics and part #s

Please


I can host the pics if needed.

 

[VadersV6]

Vaderv6, arguing about names is a tough row to hoe on the internet. Look at all the verbiage in the past about bov vs bpv, aftercooler vs intercooler, valve spring pressure vs force, lb-ft vs ft-lb for torque, etc. You can either spend all your energies on that battle, or you can try to skip past it by making sure that people can tell what you mean when you post and by making sure you understand what other people mean, in spite of how they phrase it, when they post, and get on with the technical discussion (which to me is the good part). Your choice.

However, resorting to gratuitous insults directed at the people you are arguing with is not a good way to further your cause, and posting a picture and caption like that is completely uncalled for, unwanted, and inappropriate. It represents the complete antithesis of "going fast with class". I realize that enough time has passed that you probably cannot delete it yourself, but I hope that one of the moderators does it for you (and if they do, they should also delete this message).

I had my reasons for getting upset..most of them having to do with people not listening to what Im saying. But if you notice, I already apologized to those I offended and said Im done with the argument, so its time for EVERYONE to let it go.

 

[87GN_70GS]

Initiative like this should be rewarded, not bashed. Good job Vader.

 

[Dennis F]

You mean this ? http://www.thedodgegarage.com/turbo_bov_mod.html ...I don't know any locals DSMers that have done that mod....Have you seen it work ?

Yes I have and I use a similar system in my DSM.

I use a pressure selinoid that open the port to the lower part of the diaphram and vents the pressure to atmosphere so only the top port gets pressure to help keep the BOV closed during high boost (15+psi)

Works awesome. A lot of my friends use this mod and everyone has the same exact results. A 1g BOV that seals to any boost level you want. Most just cap the line after taking it off the lower port during racing. I bought this switch from Dejon Tool for 40 bucks and it does it for me. I get the benifits of quick lifting valve during city/cruise and good sealing under racing conditions.

 

[Dennis F]

Ive heard that BOVs are bad because it will add fuel to the oil somehow (i.e. a/f ratio gets screwy after it releases the air to the atmosphere) and will weaken the integrity of the oil (thus, should have to change the oil much more often to prevent premature wear of the motor)??? You guys with BOVs (Not By-pass valves) should take a whiff of your motor oil next time before you change it and tell me if you smell any gas.....This BOV talk will go on forever, as it did in the past here on this board....

Think about it for a second, how would that happen?

 

[VadersV6]

Think about it for a second, how would that happen?

He says that because dumping metered air into the atmosphere causes a rich spike. If you can tune around that, fine. BOV's are ok for full blown race cars, but for daily drivers a bypass offers better driveability.

 

[Ormand]

He says that because dumping metered air into the atmosphere causes a rich spike

More like an "undefined" spike. On a turbo Buick, anyway. The valve opens when the throttle is closed. When the throttle is closed, the fueling goes to ZERO, or pretty close, based on the TPS reading, not the MAF. So, with zero air, divided by zero fuel, you have 0/0, which is "undefined". Now on a ricer, where the valves BELONG, there may be different conditions.

 

[BASS]

This is what I found from another site:

"The downside of releasing the air to atmosphere is that it has already been metered, and when it blows off the ECU will be injecting the wrong amount of fuel into the cylinders.(The MAS reads ten air units, say, and the ECU tells the injectors to squirt the right amount of fuel for ten air units.But then five of those air units are vented off to atmosphere, and only five make it to the cylinders, and five more have to be drawn from the outside air, through the MAS again) so the engine temporarily runs extremely rich, meaning too much fuel is injected into the cylinders.

This temporary rich condition isn't usually that harmful, but it can cause bucking or hesitation on lift-throttle.If the condition is really bad it can eventually foul spark plugs and even clog the catalytic converter.(Unburned fuel on the cat burns very hot, and too much of it can melt the cat)."


So, Im thinking, since more fuel is being dumped into the cylinders, the integrity of the oil will be compromised, and thus, you will need to change the oil more often......

 

[Ormand]

As I pointed out, there is NOT more fuel dumped into the cylinders on a turbo Buick. The ECM has "deceleration enleanment", or "decel fuel cut-off", or whatever you want to call it. When you take your foot off the gas, the ECM cuts fuel. Watch the O2 on your ScanMaster as you drive. Remember, just because you read something on the web, that doesn't make it right. And if it's on anothe site, it MIGHT not apply to the turbo Buick.

 

[BASS]

Ok, so your telling me that a properly adjusted BOV on a turbo Buick will have no long term detrimental effect on the motor? If thats the case and its going to add life to the turbo, why didnt GM put one on in the first place (or at least a bypass valve for that matter)?

 

[Ormand]

Gm did not put one on, because one was not needed. Somewhere farther up this thread is mention of the many turbo Buicks with well over 100,000 miles on the stock turbo. Now,adding a bypass valve, or a blowoff valve, may add miles, but it will also cost money, and it will be one more thing to maintain. Buick is in business to make profit, so they don't do a lot of stuff if it isn't really needed.

 

[Dennis F]

My plan and fitment will put the BOV in a position to recirculate the metered air back into the intake tube. So everything will work out fine.

 

[VadersV6]

As I pointed out, there is NOT more fuel dumped into the cylinders on a turbo Buick. The ECM has "deceleration enleanment", or "decel fuel cut-off", or whatever you want to call it. When you take your foot off the gas, the ECM cuts fuel. Watch the O2 on your ScanMaster as you drive. Remember, just because you read something on the web, that doesn't make it right. And if it's on anothe site, it MIGHT not apply to the turbo Buick.

Yeah its deceleration fuel cutoff, and its not always on. Its dependant on the torque converter stall speed and the amount of grab it has on the motor at a given speed, during deceleration. A high stall converter will slip too much for DFCO to work properly at lower speeds, like below 65mph. The stock converter in my car will cause DFCO to cut fuel to zero until I get to about 45-50mph. Below that, while decellerating, its not working....its giving normal fueling with zero throttle. When I had the high stall art carr TC in there, DFCO would work until I decellerated to about 65mph. Below 65, there wasnt enough grab to make it work. Not enough grab to force the engine to couple with the tranny. Thats why extender put that feature in the chip. DFCO on or off, which you can turn off in the case of running a high stall TC.

 

[69MachI428SCJ]

I know this is a link to what many would call a "ricer" car but the guy in this post that works at Forge Motorsports knows what he is talking about. The reason alot of the 80's turbo cars did NOT have a bypass was that it was an added cost that they did not feel was needed with the STOCK boost levels. I have road in a Syclone where it had so much compressor surge it was insane. It can't be good for the turbo. I have dealt with alot of turbo and sc'ed cars and always used one. With a MAF car you MUST use a recirculating setup or it will run like crap...plain and simple. I know ALOT of people that just slap a "blow-off valve" on there MAF equipped car so they have a loud "wooosh" sound and then wonder why there car is so slow and it falls on it's face between shifts!:barf: Here is the link though..maybe that will clear some of it up...

http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?t=209640

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Dennis- you misquoted about 100 things I said again, but like I said, Im done. Enjoy your blowoff valve and Ill enjoy my bypass valve...overrun cutoff valve, sneeze valve, blowjob valve whatever.

LOL, BJV

BW

 

[8AV8]

How would you like it if that was your kid or little brother in that picture you posted? Would it still be funny? Think about it for a second.

Good luck with your new idea, but try not to ridicule people who can't help the situation they are in.

Chris

 

[VadersV6]

How would you like it if that was your kid or little brother in that picture you posted? Would it still be funny? Think about it for a second.

Good luck with your new idea, but try not to ridicule people who can't help the situation they are in.

Chris

My grandfather is 85 years old. Never had a surgery in his life. Never has taken medicine. Eats what he wants and has smoked hand rolled cigarettes for 70 years. During WWII, he was in a Nazi concentration camp for 2 years. It was taken over by Soviets and while the gaurds were drunk, he and 2 other guys escaped. 3 days wandering in the wilderness and was finally found by americans. He weighed 90 pounds. He had many friends shot down right next to him and endured major hardships. Today he's outside building sheds, cutting down trees, playing with his massive stamp collection...up till 2 years ago he was still working as an auto mechanic, building transmissions. He's healthy as a horse. I asked him what the key was to living so long and not getting sick. He said the key was to not take life so seriously. You and I both could take that advise. I didnt make that picture. Its been on the net for probably 10 years. I was making a point about how stupid I was to be taking the criticism so seriously. I was making fun of myself, not retards.

 

[8AV8]

I'm involved with working , thru my church, with some mentally disabled kids.

I go pretty much whichever the wind blows. I don't take the stuff in this world to seriously.

I just thought that picture was in poor taste.

 

[turbosam6]

I know this is a link to what many would call a "ricer" car but the guy in this post that works at Forge Motorsports knows what he is talking about. The reason alot of the 80's turbo cars did NOT have a bypass was that it was an added cost that they did not feel was needed with the STOCK boost levels. I have road in a Syclone where it had so much compressor surge it was insane. It can't be good for the turbo. I have dealt with alot of turbo and sc'ed cars and always used one. With a MAF car you MUST use a recirculating setup or it will run like crap...plain and simple. I know ALOT of people that just slap a "blow-off valve" on there MAF equipped car so they have a loud "wooosh" sound and then wonder why there car is so slow and it falls on it's face between shifts!:barf: Here is the link though..maybe that will clear some of it up...

http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthread.php?t=209640

I have a maf car. I don't recirculate the air after the bypass. My car runs fine. Tune has alot to do with it.

If a vehicle has compressor surge, it has absolutely nothing to do with having a BOV, BPV, or whatever.