Gears for 10.50's.

[87we410877]

Ok, the cars got a 10 second recipe by Andersons and has gone 10's before. I am looking to go to the track this summer and was wondering what would be a more practical gear ratio for running mid 10's, the stock 3.42's on a goodyear 28X10 slick or something different like 4.11's with the same tire. I dont care about street drivability as i will be trailering the car to the track and back. Thanks alot!!

 

[Red Regal T]

99% use the 3:42s so sounds like a plan to me. TTAs run 3:23s. 4:11s sound like some kind of chinese water torture.

 

[87we410877]

Really!!!!! im suprised. I guess gears are a mustang thing then. haha. Hey thoes are some f'n seats you got in thoes things man. LMAO. thats awesome. thanks.

 

[John Wilde]

Do not change the gears.
I am stuck with some 3.90s that I can't use.

 

[turbo2nr]

Are you using a locked converter? If not, are you planning on using 4th.

I would think that using 4th would be the way to go. I am trying that out next year with a 4.11. I built my tranny for WOT OD shifts. Art Carr says many others have tried this and the tranny will live. I want to cross the line at the top of 4th gear. Makes sense to me. Why just use three gears?

 

[got rice?]

im interested in why we should keep the stock gear ratio too. this is one department with these cars im not familiar with. taller gears seem to be the way to go with most other cars.is it street drivability,or something with being turbocharged?

 

[BLACK6PACK]

Turbo cars work best under a good load, hence the use of tall gears (3.42) even when running low 10s. If the gears are steep, (4.11s) then the car doesn't get as much of a chance to load up the turbo. Set up right, you can run 4.11s and use OD to race, but you're going to spend money that you really don't need to spend. My brother was running 10.20s at 132mph with the stock gears on a 28x9 tire. He still has AC and overdrive, so you can cruise the car down the street.

 

[John Wilde]

With the numerically high first gear in the 200 and the low rpm torque building motor why would you want to make the rear gears that high....
You are not building a High Winding NA Motor.

We have 3.70s in our 7 second car and are think about going to 3.40 or 3.50s. Our motor can spin pas 8500RPM if needed and makes over 1800HP.Turbo cars do not need gears na 14 second mustang.

 

[turbo2nr]

I do not think I would get a better 60', so don't stress about the 1st gear thing. Using a T-brake, you don't need anymore load. I was just thinking using four gears would be faster the whole way down the track because of gearing. It's not like an extra shift wastes any time, right? Why not use four gears? I still don't see your arguement. Are you saying that by using four gears and a 4.11, I will go slower? No way! I just tried it for myself last year. I started with the 3.42, then tried a 3.73, now trying a 4.11. Gets faster every time. I can get just as good, or better 60's, and still have better gear advantage all the way down the track. The 200 tranny can take WOT 3-4, if built for it.

 

[Race Jace]

I just switched from the stock gears to 3.23 in my car. there was no noticeable difference in 60 times. the car did pick up in the 2nd half of the quarter.

Things i noticed with the taller gears(lower numerically) vs shorter (higher numerically)

since we run relatively mild cams the taller gears seem to always be an advantage. They do make the car feel more sluggish on the street. less fun to drive.

If you have your car tunned correctly look at the VE tables. mine and most of the cars i have seen have bigger numbers lower in the rpm cells of the 1/4 pass than the upper cells. (i don't mean the whole table only the cells you are in durring a pass) this means you are probably using more fuel down low because the motor is making more torque at that lower RPM.

There was a very good article of HP vs torque in the GSXtra. This also relates to the gear ratio.

 

[turbo2nr]

Jason, I guess you use a non-lock up and only 1-3 gears on a 200tranny, right?

 

[Race Jace]

Jason, I guess you use a non-lock up and only 1-3 gears on a 200tranny, right?

yes

 

[Garycar]

4.11's and 4 gears was tried by many during the early 90's. As far as I know most if not all returned to the 3:42 gears. The Buick turbo motor loves load. It is a torque motor, not a high winding small block Chevy. When I had the stock motor in the car, I had tried 3.90 gears. It ran a best of 10.79 with 3.90's and 10.77 with the 3.42's but the mph with the 3.90 was 122.8 vs 125.6 with the 3.42's. The extra shift with the 4.11's will simply delay your reaching the quarter mile end. I absolutely agree with Jason and the others who preach 3.42's or even 3.23's.
However, try it if you will and let us know the results.

 

[DonnieShort]

4.11's and 4 gears was tried by many during the early 90's. As far as I know most if not all returned to the 3:42 gears. The Buick turbo motor loves load. It is a torque motor, not a high winding small block Chevy. When I had the stock motor in the car, I had tried 3.90 gears. It ran a best of 10.79 with 3.90's and 10.77 with the 3.42's but the mph with the 3.90 was 122.8 vs 125.6 with the 3.42's. The extra shift with the 4.11's will simply delay your reaching the quarter mile end. I absolutely agree with Jason and the others who preach 3.42's or even 3.23's.
However, try it if you will and let us know the results.

Right, not to mention the fact that 4th gear in the tranny is .67 switching to 4.11's would be a waste of time and money.

 

[Race Jace]

Right, not to mention the fact that 4th gear in the tranny is .67 switching to 4.11's would be a waste of time and money.

I don't think it would be a waste of time on all TR motors. if you had a motor that made power up that high it would benifit because the converter would have less slip. I would say most of us don't but there are some.

I would love to see a comparison myself.

 

[turbo2nr]

I plan on running the same RPM range as every one else, but just using all of four gears.

If a lower ratio is so great, then get a 1.83 gear and just use 1st and 2nd gear.

Or better yet, just run a straight drive 1:1 and just use one gear the whole track, like a rail car.

I'm sure you can get stupid in either direction.

My question may be:
What is the best number of gears for a 10-9sec car with an automatic? Not one or two obviously. Three is what 99% run, I guess. Why not four? We already have it, and it's spinning, ready to go. Gear it up for a 3-4 shift just after the eighth, and then run thru OD. Shifting at the same RPMs as everyone else, just sooner in time compaired to a "normal" geared car using 3 gears.

So, some of you thing by shortning the actual time spent in each gear, we are loosing some torque usage, or something like that? Like, the motor can't rev-up that fast?I don't feel that happening. Faster cars spend much less time in each gear but, seems to work for them. I am refering to low nine sec TRs, etc.

I too am aiming for 10.5 and better next year.

 

[PhilM]

Race Jace: you are running a 400, right?

Do you peak out in 3rd gear still with the 3.23's? I am thinking I will need to drop my ratio as well, i cannot stuff a large diameter tire in the well and I may peak out in 3rd gear ??!?

Phil

 

[Slo86GN]

Personally, I would stick with what works. The 3.42 works best with our cars because of the low end torque we have available plus we don't have to spin the RPM's up like a SBF, SBC, SBD. Think of the turbo V6 in the same way you would a big block. Big low end torque/mid range power production but kinda tails off as the rpms rise, and unless built to spin high rpm, doesn't like going there. As for running 10's with 3 gears, nothing wrong with it. Heck, a buddy of mine has a Fox body Mustang coupe that runs 8.80's on 28x10.5" slicks with a 'Glide and 3.70 rear gear. The 410ci engine he's running makes all it's power under 7K rpm, so he set the gear up to take advantage of the broad power band. Same could be said for our Buicks....the factory engineers figured out the 3.42 was the best match for our cars.

One other thing to consider about the 3.42 rear...streetability. I actually enjoy driving my car on the street, and 4.11's would pretty much negate any rpm drop you normally see going into OD. Even if you use a non-lockup convertor, the 3.42's still make it very street friendly. Any steeper gear than 3.42's start pushing the cruise revs up. I dunno about you, but I don't like the idea of buzzing my engine along at higher revs for very long.

 

[turbo2nr]

28" tires, non-lock converter.....2850RPM at 68MPH (on flat ground, yeah it climbs to well over 3000 when going up hills)

 

[87we410877]

My tranny is built my Dell Transmission w/ a 9" art car converter so i assume it can handle the WOT 3-4 shift but as most of you said, i will stick with the 3.42's . Thanks alot!!!!