How many 109's in the 9's ???

yullose

Certified Gun Nut
Joined
Apr 9, 2005
Having put a stock 109 motor in the 10's two years ago with just bolt-ons... I'm pretty confident I have a very good foundation to work with since buying my most recent GN.

I'm curious what kind of uphill challenge I face, if I shoot for a 9-sec timeslip.
I'm sure a bigger turbo would help, but I know Russ and Grumpy have used a similar sized unit on the 9-sec combo they have.

I fully understand the importance of good 60ft times... and without a transbrake'd TH400, I know the ET potential will suffer until that swap happens... that said, I'd be happy with 9-sec MPH for the time being... somewhere North of 135+ would be nice.

Nitrous is not out of the question... and is probably 'gonna be on the car eventually anyway.

Any advice on my combination is appreciated. Bigger turbo ? bigger cam ? and obviously a front mount is at the top of the list of things to do.
 
Having put a stock 109 motor in the 10's two years ago with just bolt-ons... I'm pretty confident I have a very good foundation to work with since buying my most recent GN.

I'm curious what kind of uphill challenge I face, if I shoot for a 9-sec timeslip.
I'm sure a bigger turbo would help, but I know Russ and Grumpy have used a similar sized unit on the 9-sec combo they have.

I fully understand the importance of good 60ft times... and without a transbrake'd TH400, I know the ET potential will suffer until that swap happens... that said, I'd be happy with 9-sec MPH for the time being... somewhere North of 135+ would be nice.

Nitrous is not out of the question... and is probably 'gonna be on the car eventually anyway.

Any advice on my combination is appreciated. Bigger turbo ? bigger cam ? and obviously a front mount is at the top of the list of things to do.

Was your new GN previously owned by Jim Bennet in south jersey?
 
Go to Bowling Green this May and talk to any TSM racer. There will probably be 15+ 9 second 109 cars there.
 
Was your new GN previously owned by Jim Bennet in south jersey?

Yes as a matter of fact... and I seem to recall him telling me you were the hot dog that put this motor together. :D
He spoke very highly of you.

Maybe you can tell me a little more about it and what it's capable of ?
Jim's a super guy... it seemed he lost interest in the car and got frustrated with it... as did I the first week I got it home... I've sorted out all the electrical gremlins and have it running pretty well right now as it is...
Jim B really wanted to see it taken to it's potential, so I promised him I'd do my best. The info in my sig is from his best recollection, with zero documentation... so I pretty much trusted his word when I bought this car...

Any info about the motor or advice you have to offer is greatly appreciated...

Maybe you could chime-in on this other thread too if you know anything about it...
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/ge...272-rjc-pp-modified-doghouse-issues-pics.html
 
Go to Bowling Green this May and talk to any TSM racer. There will probably be 15+ 9 second 109 cars there.


Unfortunatly, this event falls on the same week my wife and I are in Ocean City, MD... otherwise I'd be there with my car instead.:D
 
Here you go.

Final "109" ET Records as of the close of the 2008 TSM season

1. 8.955 @ 156.02 Dick Kereny 12/16/2006 Outlaw Trim
2. 9.026 @ 150.11 Don Cruz 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
3. 9.144 @ 148.89 Dick Kereny 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
4. 9.165 @ 149.04 David Bamford 11/1/2008 Outlaw Trim
5. 9.230 @ 148.00 Tony Occhipinti 4/16/2005 Outlaw Trim
6. 9.280 @ 148.62 Steve Hughes 9/6/2008 Outlaw Trim
7. 9.329 @ 141.00 Roy Garcia 11/4/2006 Outlaw Trim
8. 9.335 @ 144.84 Richie Balcom 11/2/2007 Outlaw Trim
9. 9.355 @ 144.56 David Bamford 11/5/2005 TSM Legal
10. 9.356 @ 143.95 Roy Garcia 11/4/2006 TSM Legal
11. 9.382 @ 144.40 Phil McGloin 11/2/2007 Outlaw Trim
12. 9.385 @ 147.88 Jason White 8/1/2008 TSM Legal
13. 9.418 @ 143.87 Richie Balcom 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
14. 9.452 @ 144.43 Phil McGloin 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
15. 9.460 @ 142.67 Toni Colallilo 11/1/2008 Outlaw Trim
16. 9.510 @ 142.90 Tim LeMay 9/5/2008 Outlaw Trim
17. 9.530 @ 143.00 Billy Anderson 5/21/2006 Outlaw Trim
18. 9.540 @ 146.06 Scott Claridge 6/2/2008 Outlaw Trim
19. 9.564 @ 140.33 Steve Sullivan 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
20. 9.580 @ 139.99 Walt Judy 9/8/2007 Outlaw Trim
21. 9.633 @ 141.25 David Stinson 11/9/2008 Outlaw Trim
22. 9.634 @ 140.87 Jason Cramer 5/18/2008 TSM Legal
23. 9.650 @ 140.40 Mike Qwick 6/16/2007 Outlaw Trim
24. 9.650 @ 135.57 Steve Hughes 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
25. 9.660 @ 138.16 John Pekar 10/27/2007 Outlaw Trim
26. 9.670 @ 142.02 Kevin Bolger 09/05/08 Outlaw Trim
27. 9.670 @ 142.00 Chris Hogeland 10/15/2007 TSM Legal
28. 9.680 @ 139.93 Rich "Bird" 11/27/2006 Outlaw Trim
29. 9.700 @ 135.00 Len Freeman Outlaw Trim
30. 9.710 @ 140.00 John Martin 10/27/2007 Outlaw Trim
31. 9.716 @ 140.23 Tony Occhipinti 9/18/2004 TSM Legal
32. 9.744 @ 137.24 Art Frye 9/8/2007 Outlaw Trim
33. 9.748 @ 137.25 Dave England 9/17/2005 TSM Legal
34. 9.750 @ 136.97 Kevin Hess 8/3/2006 Outlaw Trim
35. 9.781 @ 137.54 Lonnie Diers 6/2/2008 Outlaw Trim
36. 9.790 @ 138.70 Scott Atkinson Outlaw Trim
37. 9.800 @ 145.00 Jim Byrne 6/22/1905 Outlaw Trim
38. 9.820 @ 137.67 Tim Lemay 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
39. 9.822 @ 136.17 Cliff Bryan 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
40. 9.830 @ 139.39 Jim Rome 10/15/2006 Outlaw Trim
41. 9.860 @ 134.00 Ted Achatz Outlaw Trim
42. 9.900 @ 136.00 Gene Fluery Outlaw Trim
43. 9.902 @ 136.72 Scott Simpson 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
44. 9.910 @ 136.40 Dan Berry Outlaw Trim
45. 9.910 @ 134.00 Bill Zaher 8/3/2006 TSM Legal
46. 9.914 @ 136.15 Jeff Rodick 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
47. 9.920 @ 136.88 Don Palumbo 11/4/2006 TSM Legal
48. 9.926 @ 138.10 Kevin Bolger 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
49. 9.926 @ 137.58 John Sullivan 5/18/2007 TSM Legal
50. 9.940 @ 136.80 Randy Alexander 9/26/2008 Outlaw Trim
51. 9.942 @ 135.00 Mike Ricketts 6/22/2007 Outlaw Trim
52. 9.947 @ 138.14 Melissa 10/12/2007 Outlaw Trim
53. 9.960 @ 137.00 Orlando Granada Outlaw Trim
54. 9.970 @ 136.00 Ryan Guy Outlaw Trim
55. 9.980 @ 134.00 Louie Lopez 1/1/2002 TSM Legal
 
Well... I'm picking up a 70GTQ this weekend... along with a set of 83lb injectors, modded ECM, 70mm TB, matching plenum and RJC plate...

That should be a good step in the right direction. ;)

Next on the list is a decent FMIC.

I was hoping Nick would chime in with his opinion too... but I guess he doesn't like me. :D
 
Yullose, will the GN be in Ocean City ? I plan to be there with mine.

Damn skippy it will be there... We have a room booked all week at the Beachmark hotel... right across from Big Peckers. We'll be getting into town sometime on Sunday afternoon... and leaving the following Sunday. My buddy rented 70 rooms for all of us coming from PA/Pottstown area... and has them all spoken for.
 
Here you go.

Final "109" ET Records as of the close of the 2008 TSM season

1. 8.955 @ 156.02 Dick Kereny 12/16/2006 Outlaw Trim
2. 9.026 @ 150.11 Don Cruz 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
3. 9.144 @ 148.89 Dick Kereny 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
4. 9.165 @ 149.04 David Bamford 11/1/2008 Outlaw Trim
5. 9.230 @ 148.00 Tony Occhipinti 4/16/2005 Outlaw Trim
6. 9.280 @ 148.62 Steve Hughes 9/6/2008 Outlaw Trim
7. 9.329 @ 141.00 Roy Garcia 11/4/2006 Outlaw Trim
8. 9.335 @ 144.84 Richie Balcom 11/2/2007 Outlaw Trim
9. 9.355 @ 144.56 David Bamford 11/5/2005 TSM Legal
10. 9.356 @ 143.95 Roy Garcia 11/4/2006 TSM Legal
11. 9.382 @ 144.40 Phil McGloin 11/2/2007 Outlaw Trim
12. 9.385 @ 147.88 Jason White 8/1/2008 TSM Legal
13. 9.418 @ 143.87 Richie Balcom 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
14. 9.452 @ 144.43 Phil McGloin 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
15. 9.460 @ 142.67 Toni Colallilo 11/1/2008 Outlaw Trim
16. 9.510 @ 142.90 Tim LeMay 9/5/2008 Outlaw Trim
17. 9.530 @ 143.00 Billy Anderson 5/21/2006 Outlaw Trim
18. 9.540 @ 146.06 Scott Claridge 6/2/2008 Outlaw Trim
19. 9.564 @ 140.33 Steve Sullivan 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
20. 9.580 @ 139.99 Walt Judy 9/8/2007 Outlaw Trim
21. 9.633 @ 141.25 David Stinson 11/9/2008 Outlaw Trim
22. 9.634 @ 140.87 Jason Cramer 5/18/2008 TSM Legal
23. 9.650 @ 140.40 Mike Qwick 6/16/2007 Outlaw Trim
24. 9.650 @ 135.57 Steve Hughes 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
25. 9.660 @ 138.16 John Pekar 10/27/2007 Outlaw Trim
26. 9.670 @ 142.02 Kevin Bolger 09/05/08 Outlaw Trim
27. 9.670 @ 142.00 Chris Hogeland 10/15/2007 TSM Legal
28. 9.680 @ 139.93 Rich "Bird" 11/27/2006 Outlaw Trim
29. 9.700 @ 135.00 Len Freeman Outlaw Trim
30. 9.710 @ 140.00 John Martin 10/27/2007 Outlaw Trim
31. 9.716 @ 140.23 Tony Occhipinti 9/18/2004 TSM Legal
32. 9.744 @ 137.24 Art Frye 9/8/2007 Outlaw Trim
33. 9.748 @ 137.25 Dave England 9/17/2005 TSM Legal
34. 9.750 @ 136.97 Kevin Hess 8/3/2006 Outlaw Trim
35. 9.781 @ 137.54 Lonnie Diers 6/2/2008 Outlaw Trim
36. 9.790 @ 138.70 Scott Atkinson Outlaw Trim
37. 9.800 @ 145.00 Jim Byrne 6/22/1905 Outlaw Trim
38. 9.820 @ 137.67 Tim Lemay 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
39. 9.822 @ 136.17 Cliff Bryan 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
40. 9.830 @ 139.39 Jim Rome 10/15/2006 Outlaw Trim
41. 9.860 @ 134.00 Ted Achatz Outlaw Trim
42. 9.900 @ 136.00 Gene Fluery Outlaw Trim
43. 9.902 @ 136.72 Scott Simpson 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
44. 9.910 @ 136.40 Dan Berry Outlaw Trim
45. 9.910 @ 134.00 Bill Zaher 8/3/2006 TSM Legal
46. 9.914 @ 136.15 Jeff Rodick 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
47. 9.920 @ 136.88 Don Palumbo 11/4/2006 TSM Legal
48. 9.926 @ 138.10 Kevin Bolger 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
49. 9.926 @ 137.58 John Sullivan 5/18/2007 TSM Legal
50. 9.940 @ 136.80 Randy Alexander 9/26/2008 Outlaw Trim
51. 9.942 @ 135.00 Mike Ricketts 6/22/2007 Outlaw Trim
52. 9.947 @ 138.14 Melissa 10/12/2007 Outlaw Trim
53. 9.960 @ 137.00 Orlando Granada Outlaw Trim
54. 9.970 @ 136.00 Ryan Guy Outlaw Trim
55. 9.980 @ 134.00 Louie Lopez 1/1/2002 TSM Legal

Gabby Rojas should be added to this list as he recently ran a 9.63 @141mph pass with his stock cube iron headed 109 car in Outlaw trim. Here's the thread from the Timeslip and Combo database~

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/ti.../275354-new-iron-head-record-gabby-rojas.html
 
it indeed has a 214/214 cam installed in it.if you would like to talk more about the engine dont hesitate to give me a call at 732-814-8227. Nick,

Sweet... I hate to bug people over the telephone and waste your time like that.... but I understand if you don't want any of your secret recipes spilling over the internet. :D

I'm running back to PA for the weekend to boink the wife and pick up some parts for the GN... Maybe I'll give you a buzz next week sometime after I write down a list of questions. :wink:
 
Here you go.

Final "109" ET Records as of the close of the 2008 TSM season

1. 8.955 @ 156.02 Dick Kereny 12/16/2006 Outlaw Trim
2. 9.026 @ 150.11 Don Cruz 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
3. 9.144 @ 148.89 Dick Kereny 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
4. 9.165 @ 149.04 David Bamford 11/1/2008 Outlaw Trim
5. 9.230 @ 148.00 Tony Occhipinti 4/16/2005 Outlaw Trim
6. 9.280 @ 148.62 Steve Hughes 9/6/2008 Outlaw Trim
7. 9.329 @ 141.00 Roy Garcia 11/4/2006 Outlaw Trim
8. 9.335 @ 144.84 Richie Balcom 11/2/2007 Outlaw Trim
9. 9.355 @ 144.56 David Bamford 11/5/2005 TSM Legal
10. 9.356 @ 143.95 Roy Garcia 11/4/2006 TSM Legal
11. 9.382 @ 144.40 Phil McGloin 11/2/2007 Outlaw Trim
12. 9.385 @ 147.88 Jason White 8/1/2008 TSM Legal
13. 9.418 @ 143.87 Richie Balcom 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
14. 9.452 @ 144.43 Phil McGloin 11/3/2007 TSM Legal
15. 9.460 @ 142.67 Toni Colallilo 11/1/2008 Outlaw Trim
16. 9.510 @ 142.90 Tim LeMay 9/5/2008 Outlaw Trim
17. 9.530 @ 143.00 Billy Anderson 5/21/2006 Outlaw Trim
18. 9.540 @ 146.06 Scott Claridge 6/2/2008 Outlaw Trim
19. 9.564 @ 140.33 Steve Sullivan 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
20. 9.580 @ 139.99 Walt Judy 9/8/2007 Outlaw Trim
21. 9.633 @ 141.25 David Stinson 11/9/2008 Outlaw Trim
22. 9.634 @ 140.87 Jason Cramer 5/18/2008 TSM Legal
23. 9.650 @ 140.40 Mike Qwick 6/16/2007 Outlaw Trim
24. 9.650 @ 135.57 Steve Hughes 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
25. 9.660 @ 138.16 John Pekar 10/27/2007 Outlaw Trim
26. 9.670 @ 142.02 Kevin Bolger 09/05/08 Outlaw Trim
27. 9.670 @ 142.00 Chris Hogeland 10/15/2007 TSM Legal
28. 9.680 @ 139.93 Rich "Bird" 11/27/2006 Outlaw Trim
29. 9.700 @ 135.00 Len Freeman Outlaw Trim
30. 9.710 @ 140.00 John Martin 10/27/2007 Outlaw Trim
31. 9.716 @ 140.23 Tony Occhipinti 9/18/2004 TSM Legal
32. 9.744 @ 137.24 Art Frye 9/8/2007 Outlaw Trim
33. 9.748 @ 137.25 Dave England 9/17/2005 TSM Legal
34. 9.750 @ 136.97 Kevin Hess 8/3/2006 Outlaw Trim
35. 9.781 @ 137.54 Lonnie Diers 6/2/2008 Outlaw Trim
36. 9.790 @ 138.70 Scott Atkinson Outlaw Trim
37. 9.800 @ 145.00 Jim Byrne 6/22/1905 Outlaw Trim
38. 9.820 @ 137.67 Tim Lemay 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
39. 9.822 @ 136.17 Cliff Bryan 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
40. 9.830 @ 139.39 Jim Rome 10/15/2006 Outlaw Trim
41. 9.860 @ 134.00 Ted Achatz Outlaw Trim
42. 9.900 @ 136.00 Gene Fluery Outlaw Trim
43. 9.902 @ 136.72 Scott Simpson 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
44. 9.910 @ 136.40 Dan Berry Outlaw Trim
45. 9.910 @ 134.00 Bill Zaher 8/3/2006 TSM Legal
46. 9.914 @ 136.15 Jeff Rodick 11/2/2008 TSM Legal
47. 9.920 @ 136.88 Don Palumbo 11/4/2006 TSM Legal
48. 9.926 @ 138.10 Kevin Bolger 8/23/2008 TSM Legal
49. 9.926 @ 137.58 John Sullivan 5/18/2007 TSM Legal
50. 9.940 @ 136.80 Randy Alexander 9/26/2008 Outlaw Trim
51. 9.942 @ 135.00 Mike Ricketts 6/22/2007 Outlaw Trim
52. 9.947 @ 138.14 Melissa 10/12/2007 Outlaw Trim
53. 9.960 @ 137.00 Orlando Granada Outlaw Trim
54. 9.970 @ 136.00 Ryan Guy Outlaw Trim
55. 9.980 @ 134.00 Louie Lopez 1/1/2002 TSM Legal

What does Outlaw trim mean?
 
I'm only knocking on the door to 9's but.......... I was happy when I went to an electronic boost controller last year. Much easier to control and set. I was on a 2004R last year launching off the foot brake. The launch control on the boost controller was tied into the brake and worked well for controlling the launches. Without much runs I got into the 1.4 60fts and maybe there was more left, dunno. I'm on a t-braked TH400 now.

I'm don't know much about your converter for running those times. I was on a 9.5" PTC nonlock.

There may be gains going to headers and a bigger downpipe, something you could do if you switch over to an external wastegate and haven't already.

Also, I think for the list above if the pass wasn't made after passing tech at a TSM event, it was considered Outlaw trim.
 
Outlaw trim on the above list either means the run was not at a sanctioned TSM race or the car was not per the TSM rules.
 
This is like 1993 all over again for me.... :cool:

My quest for a 9 second timeslip was finally achieved in 1993 with my '70 Camaro.... I had an aluminum headed 427 and a cheater plate. She would go 11.20's on the motor... and finally went a 9.93 @ 139 at the 1993 Super Chevy show at Maple Grove Raceway. (It actually made a couple 9-sec runs earlier in the year on Fri night grudge nights) Eventually, several years later I had the car going 8.40's @ 159... and another Camaro in the 8.30's @ 165.


Who'd a thunk, 16 years later I'd be trying to do the same $hit all over again... :D
 
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