HR Partsnstuff mounts

[TurboTR]

>Let's make sure I am understanding this correctly. If you put a straight edge accross the freeze plug boss horizontally, it hits nothing? The casting around the cyl bore doesn't stick out
past that level?? The 5/16 dimension doesn't sound that far off.

Yes that's right, the "Mt Everest" edition freeze plug boss extends out past the case there. When I get done with the trans mockup (hopefully today) I can then hoist the motor out a bit and get better info. Maybe a pic or two as well, if I can line up a digital cam.

>How much space is there at the top edge of the mount, right in the center of the milled scallop on the mount to the edge of the casting around the cyl bore?

I'll check it out today.

Seems like if there's variance in the freeze plug boss heights, and if the mounts have to "reference" off the bosses then there's going to be some substantial problems to overcome. Is there any way to get it work right without having them bump up against the bosses? In other words just cut that portion away?

TurboTR

 

[geno]

Tod
I didnt even realize i was posting to something you wrote
I have a set of S2 mounts and you must be talking about Dennis,s block that Dale has. I can give my mount to Dale if you want and he can rework it to fit if you want.Then you can send me your untouched mount. If there is anything i can do to help just tell me. I can also take a digital picture of the tall boses on Dennis,s block to show the inerferance with the mount.

 

[Bad as L]

A quick question.......Would it matter that we are working with an on-center block ? Are the stg II mounts specifically for an off-center engine ? Both of the on-center blocks I have been working on seem to be identical.
Dale

 

[HRpartsNstuff]

I will be checking an on-center block tomorrow just to be sure myself. Can't imagine why they would make them taller, especially on one side only of one style block.

As for designing them NOT to hit against the boss, we thought of that throughout several upgraded styles. GM designed the mounts to kind of wedge themselves in that "corner" between the surface it bolts against & the freeze plug boss. This gives added support on the pass side, where the block has extra strength & won't distort the bore. On the drivers side, this "wedge effect" keeps the mount tight against the block. This keeps it from bouncing around & flexing out of position. To take that feature away would be a bad thing, especially on higher HP cars.

I will be looking into how far we can modify the mount to help fit any "Mt. Everest" type of freeze plug bosses out there. After looking at what I have here, the dr side can't be relieved too far without really weakening the mount. Machining and/or grinding the freeze plug boss to the normal/correct height would be the "Politically correct" way to do it. I am sure that is not what anyone wants to hear, but the higher boss is the abnormal part of the equation.

With some more info & hopefully pictures, we will get this sorted out in the next few days & have a fix figured out.

 

[HRpartsNstuff]

GENO:

Can you send me some pics of this taller boss? Put a straight edge across it & show the gap to the block casting around the bore if possible.

Also, if you have access to a block with the tall boss & a set of stg II mt's, can you take pics with them installed as well? Let me know the distance from the milled scallop (in the middle) on the mount, to the block, at the top edge.

Any & all help is appreciated.
Thanks!

 

[geno]

I will try to setup a time with Dale to take some pictures of the block he has with the tall bosses. I called him tonight and left a message.

 

[geno]

I just got off the phone with Dale and im going over to take some picture,s saturday night. I should be able to post them or send them to you that night

 

[TurboTR]

>I can give my mount to Dale if you want and he can rework it to fit if you want.Then you can send me your untouched mount.

Well I really appreciate that. Might have to do something like that. I'm hoping that HR can come through with a fix for me somehow. Well, back out into the garage...

TurboTR

 

[HRpartsNstuff]

You can only modify the mounts so much to get them to fit. I have some here that are already modified that you can try. I would gladly swap them with you if it is what you need. No sense doing more work if you don't have to.

I really don't think you can modify the mounts enough to get it where it needs to be. Once I see some pics/measurements, I will be able to better tell if it will work or not. Some boss modification may be necessary as well, like half from each part. I have seen blocks from roundy-round racers that had the bosses almost completely ground off. They did it for weight savings & dry sump pump clearance from what I hear. It doesn't hurt anything from what I can see.

I will test fit a modified mount on a tall boss "hopefully" tomorrow.

 

[TurboTR]

Thanks Paul, and please check into it asap. We're waiting for what you say basically. I can't tighten down the mill until I get this settled.

TurboTR

 

[HRpartsNstuff]

Well, after looking at 3 different stg II on-center blocks, I kinda found out what is going on.

There IS some casting differences among the stg II ON-center blocks. Basically, the DRIVERS side of the block has been moved outward on some of these blocks. Some have the freeze plug boss out farther than others as well. This is on the drivers side only, the pass sides are all the same.

Our second design stg II mounts seem to fit all production 3.8 & 4.1 blocks, all stg I blocks, OFF-center stg II blocks, all pass side and some drivers side ON-center blocks.

We will offer modified stg II drivers side mounts for these special ON-center castings, or you can have the dr side std stg II mounts modified to fit. Our base plate is 1/4" thick. Approx. one-half of this thickness (1/8") needs to be milled away, where it contacts the freeze plug boss. This is a little easier for others to do because it is a straight/level milling operation, parallel to the base plate surface.

The best way to see if you need the special drivers side mount is to do a simple check. Put your stock mount on the drivers side & snug the bolts up. The lower edge of the freeze plug boss is SUPPOSED to contact the mount. The DIFFERENCE between the blocks is how far the mount "kicks" out away from the boss.

If the mount looks relatively parallel to the boss (less than a 1/16"), then you have a std type block.

If the mount looks out-of-parallel to the boss (approx. .100 or more), then you have the special casting.

The straightedge test WILL NOT WORK. We found one block that had a boss lower than the block casting, and one that was higher than the casting, and they BOTH were special castings.

Remember, this ONLY applies to the drivers sides of ON-center stg II blocks.

Wheeeew! Now I know what they mean about stg II stuff being all custom fit!

As soon as I figure out how to post pics of this, I will get them up. In the mean time, I can e-mail them to anyone that this applies to.

 

[HRpartsNstuff]

Try this link. The first pic is hard to see, but it is the reg style. The last pic is a good shot of the special casting.

http://community.webshots.com/album/36561538otLrDL

 

[geno]

That takes me off the hook for the pictures
Your all over it Paul

 

[TurboTR]

Hmm, ok, so is the thing to do then send me one of the milled ds mounts and we'll exchange them? I need it asap of course.

TurboTR

 

[TurboTR]

PS guys you don't know hard it is to keep myself from going out and buying a Mavica cam or equivalent and taking all sorts of pics. If I was working I'd be all over it of course. This new on center S2 from Dale is a true work of art and I'm *dying* to show it off to some who could appreciate it It's been about 7-8 months in the making. I'm sure most novices that peek under the hood will mistake it for some sort of race only dry sump mill, with braided AN hoses running every which way down there and all

Just business as usual for Dale. The guy's work is awesome

I'll probably wet myself when I hear it light off for the 1st time Solid roller, 9:1 JE's, billet Olivers, motorsports forged crank, 274 inches, etc, etc. Ahhh, a mechanical symphony awaits...

TurboTR

 

[N2BUICK]

Motor mounts

This is a for what its worth.
I had to grind both of my HR mounts to fit my on center stageII block.
Glad to see this topic surface.
There does not seem to be any downside to these mods..
It would have been nice to know,up front,that the mount is supposed to rest on the freeze plug boss.
Both of mine still hit the boss. I took enough metal off,just to get somewhat better parallel contact,with the surfaces to be bolted together.
The mounts and freeze plug bosses are not parallel.I can get a .023 (driver) .038(pass.) feeler gauge on the "lower" side.
I guess I have a "standard" block.
Paul your mounts are stamped 01130DRV,01123PASS .
My block has a GM sonic check sheet,date 9/12/96 (block s/n U1341)
More info.if needed
I have digital pics of mounts on motor,off motor,whatever you need
I don't have a pic host service,not sure how to send them?

Austin

 

[TurboTR]

Well on mine the modded mount could have stood to be shaved a few more thou over the freeze plug boss to make it ~ perfect, but it's close enough now IMO and it's on. Thanks Paul for helping work this out!

TurboTR

 

[TurboTR]

Well I tightened one of the mount to frame pad bolts down last night and wound up bending the bolt. Tightening the bolt down tweaks the mount ears inward toward the pad as the slack is taken up, which puts an angle on the bolt contact surface which bent the bolt on mine. I was just using 3/8" drive hand tools. The frame pads are irregular shape, and the thick steel of the new mounts has a hard time conforming.

I think this really calls for a new, matching set of HD steel frame pads (with the right shape) to make it all good. I may have to see about inserting some spacers to take up some of the slack between the mount and the pad (where the bolt passes through).

JMO. Food for thought and more opportunity for HR

TurboTR